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Old January 4th, 2006, 12:01 PM   #1
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How to pulldown to get 1080 24p

The 1080/24p clips that we have been getting from Kaku are imbedded in a 1080/60i stream so they seem very interlaced when I play them back. What can I do to apply the pulldown in FCP or somewhere to get a quicktime file that is true 1080/24p?

I looked at the panasonic site to find the frame converter plug-in or whatever, and I found the thing you use for the Varicam, but would that plug it work for the HVX footage?

If someone could walk me through this process it'd be much appreciated.
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Old January 4th, 2006, 01:28 PM   #2
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Hmmmmm, ya know I'm not sure.
I beleive Final Cut Pro HD should be able to handle DVCPRO-HD 1080p24 clips embedded in the 60i stream and give you pull down you need. It's only able to do it if you have the latest update that was released last week. 5.0.4 i think. Make sure you have that version of FCP and you should be OK.
Cinema Tolls should be able to do it as well.

There's no low-cost editor that does 1080p24 at all on PC yet. *sad face*

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Old January 4th, 2006, 07:09 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shannon Rawls
There's no low-cost editor that does 1080p24 at all on PC yet. *sad face*

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I don't know what low cost means but Canopus Edius supports all the p flavors including 1080p. Here is a link to a list of prests available. http://www.rdonato.com/uploads/Presets.jpg It is 600 bucks and for 1k you can get the broadcast version which supports timelines with a mix of just about anything(so does Edius 3.6 non-broadcast) including in the broadcast version only
Panasonic DVCPRO® 50 and DVCPRO HD
Panasonic DVCPRO P2
Panasonic VariCam®
Sony XDCAM®
Windows Media HD®

I think they will sell a seperate module eventually just for DVCpro support so as to fit this cameras market ...but compared to Avid this is cheap and Edius is a nice editor.
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Old January 4th, 2006, 09:08 PM   #4
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Randy,

Why did you give me that screenshot? all it shown was DV & HDV in the presets. Not 1 ounce of DVCPROHD or uncompressed HD or and type of HDCAM in it. That was a waste of screenshotting. *smile*

Additionally, you're wrong.
The edius version you're talking about can't touch DVCPRO-HD. Which is what we're discussing right now.

Neither Edius DVX or Edius NX does DVCPRO-HD. If you pay for the HD extension kit for Edius NX then you can do DVCPRO-HD. But be prepared to pay $2,098.00 if you want it. (hardly low-cost) Now if you do decide to go that route, be prepared to know that it will NOT do 1080p24 DVCPRO-HD. (the prefered method). However, it will ingest the 1080/24pN but it will not yet do the pulldown needed, and thats what we are all waiting for from these companies and what Brian is asking about.

There are some much more expensive options offered by Canopus, but do I really need to discuss anything higher then $2k grand?

Personally, I think what Barry is doing is a perfectly acceptable work-a-round for PC users. Take a bit of time, but hell, that's what this business is all about. Especially if you want the best of the best.

Also.....I wouldn't let "software" be a determinant on whether you buy one camera over another. Software will catch up to ALL these cameras before you know it.

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Old January 4th, 2006, 09:30 PM   #5
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To remove the pulldown in FCP (v5.04):

1) select the clips in the bin you want to remove the pulldown from.
2) under the TOOLS menu select CINEMA TOOLS REVERSE TELECINE

That's it!

(you will now notice in the vid rate section of the bin, the frame rate has changed from 29.97 to 24)
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Old January 4th, 2006, 11:42 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shannon Rawls
If you pay for the HD extension kit for Edius NX then you can do DVCPRO-HD. But be prepared to pay $2,098.00 if you want it.
They have a new bundle called Edius Broadcast that includes everything you'd need for 100% HVX integration. It's Edius 3, plus the P2 option pack, plus the DVCPRO-HD option pack, plus the Varicam option pack(full support for all variable frame rates).

That bundle is $999 retail; I'd guess somewhere around $700 street. That should qualify as low-cost.

The other things they offer (like SP and NX and whatnot) are hardware cards, but according to what I think I heard at DVExpo, you don't need any of that stuff in order to be cutting HVX footage in realtime in high-def. Those cards primarily give you the live video output for an external monitor. But supposedly you can be underway and editing with just the Edius Broadcast package.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 04:22 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John M Burkhart
To remove the pulldown in FCP (v5.04):

1) select the clips in the bin you want to remove the pulldown from.
2) under the TOOLS menu select CINEMA TOOLS REVERSE TELECINE

That's it!

(you will now notice in the vid rate section of the bin, the frame rate has changed from 29.97 to 24)
Thanks a million! I was trying to figure out how to do this before... but it wasn't explained step by step.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 09:34 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shannon Rawls
Randy,

Why did you give me that screenshot? all it shown was DV & HDV in the presets. Not 1 ounce of DVCPROHD or uncompressed HD or and type of HDCAM in it. That was a waste of screenshotting. *smile*

But be prepared to pay $2,098.00 if you want it. (hardly low-cost) Now if you do decide to go that route, be prepared to know that it will NOT do 1080p24 DVCPRO-HD. (the prefered method). However, it will ingest the 1080/24pN but it will not yet do the pulldown needed, and thats what we are all waiting for from these companies and what Brian is asking about.


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Perhaps I wasn't as clear as I could have been but my comments(specifically where I said "including in the broadcast version only") makes it clear that the Edius Broadcast version (which is expected out any day) does support DVC-Pro in all flavors(and HD cam etc) and it will cost 1K not 2,098...that is old info and Canopus is now bundeling all the plugins you need in the Broadcast version...also you are mistaken on the 1080p24 DVC Pro HD and it has been doing it for some time for Varicam owners who are very pleased....Let me quote from the literature:

"The Panasonic VariCam format provides 720p 24fps and variable frame rate capture for film-like feel and detailed fast/slow motion effects. With built-in VariCam support, the EDIUS timeline can import VariCam footage for editing in its native format. Edited VariCam sequences can be exported back to a DVCPRO HD deck, or output to another format for use within other environments." BTW FCP doesn't allow the variable frame rate capture.
...... Now when are you going to get this camera so I can read some entertaining posts about it...and I want to see some shower SS from you.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 09:45 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry Green
The other things they offer (like SP and NX and whatnot) are hardware cards, but according to what I think I heard at DVExpo, you don't need any of that stuff in order to be cutting HVX footage in realtime in high-def. Those cards primarily give you the live video output for an external monitor. But supposedly you can be underway and editing with just the Edius Broadcast package.
For the most part that is correct...the cards give you high quality component out for HD and SD of all flavors. A couple of things they do to save CPU cycles is the cards do all the overlay work which is done in software(cpu cycles) by most editing softwares and perhaps most important for RT is if you have a mix of SD and HD of diferent frame sizes and it does all the scaling which is a big relief of CPU cycles. That is one of the reasons Canopus can keep its RT claims with mixed formats on the timeline...but bottom line the cards are a "super video card" that you can rely on for proper color mapping for an external monitor.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 11:31 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Randy Donato
also you are mistaken on the 1080p24 DVC Pro HD and it has been doing it for some time for Varicam owners who are very pleased....Let me quote from the literature:

"The Panasonic VariCam format provides 720p 24fps ....blah blah blah
Randy, there you go again showing me something that makes no sense. Varicam doesn't do 1080p24. Did you think it did? If you know it doesn't, then how do you equate 1080p24, with literature that's plain as day telling you 720p24??? Why would you sit up and tell me i'm wrong, and then go and post literature quotes that don't support your statement. You were better off not saying anyting at all. *smile*

Brutha...It currently does NOT work. I know because I hae a friend who works for the city of los angeles where he bought the entire Edius expensive setup (on taxpayers money no less) and he has confirmed this with me. The broadcast version is NOT RELEASED yet. Heck, if thats what you're banking on, then EVERYBODY supports DVCPROHD....Sony Vegas, Adobe Premier, Ulead Media Studio Pro, Windows Movie Maker! lol.........it's just not released yet. *smile*

This is what I said: There's no low-cost editor that does 1080p24 at all on PC yet. *sad face*

Notice the "yet" statement.

Don't get me wrong...we are on the same side here. We both are wearing the same uniform. I want DVCPRO-HD to work on PC more then anybody here. All I'm saying is it's doesn't right now, and it will in the future. I'm even being more optomistic about it by saying it does not MATTER that there isn't any support for it on January 5th, 2006. Because it is coming and coming very soon.

Gee wiz.

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Old January 5th, 2006, 12:19 PM   #11
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Shannon, I am pretty sure you are wrong on this one and give me a little time and I may get someone from Canopus to respond. Edius Boadcast is Edius version 3.x the underlying editor plus all the older codec/p2 options that have been around for a long time but at the prices you have quoted. The only difference between 720P and the 1080p flavors is the frame size which Edius is agnostic about. If it works for 720P there is no reason it will not for a bigger frame. I know that big time improvements for P support in general was a part of the new 3.6 release so your guy may just need to update to that assuming he has the DVC-Pro HD codec option, P2 option, and the varicam module(all of which will come with Broadcast at a reduced price). Canopus is very tight with Panasonic(one of the few PC software companies that have the codec license) and I doubt they will miss out on this format.

Last edited by Randy Donato; January 5th, 2006 at 01:13 PM.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 12:59 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Donato
Well since you have a tendency to say it with such emphasis you must be right...but again you are wrong. Edius Broadcast is Edius version 3.x the underlying editor plus all the older codec/p2 options that have been around for a long time but at the prices you have quoted. The only difference between 720P and the 1080p flavors is the frame size which Edius is agnostic about. Tell your friend to call tech support and ask for Joshua if he really can't get it to work right now...did you see in the screen shot that you termed a waste the drop down of presets which support 1080P in just the plain manilla version of Edius 3.6?....add the DVC Pro HD codec(which Canopus works very closely with Panasonic on implementation),P2 and the frame capture and you are done...or wait and get it all cheaper in Edius Broadcast
LOL ;-). It's interesting being a member of this community.
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Old January 5th, 2006, 02:15 PM   #13
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You caught my unedited version which I thought better of and changed....no sense getting Shannon any more excited :) Oh well....
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Old January 5th, 2006, 04:18 PM   #14
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Ahhhhhhh MMMmmmmm Hmmmm, see...*tapping my foot with arms crossed* Ya got caught talkin' smack to me Huh Mr. Randy!!!!! *SMILE*

Well, check on it. It's not just the resolution size that's different. It's the way its recorded as well. This is why Avid is having a few isssues.

Check on it, and please bring back some good news!

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Old January 5th, 2006, 04:56 PM   #15
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For you it is going straight to the top...I should know in a day. I have been wrong more than once in my life and may be here(but not about my Texas Boys playing some fellows near where you live):)
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