SI-2K Mini in the Field at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > High Definition Video Acquisition > HD and UHD ( 2K+ ) Digital Cinema > Silicon Imaging SI-2K

Silicon Imaging SI-2K
2/3" 1080p IT-integrated 10-bit digital cinema w/direct-to-disk recording.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old August 28th, 2009, 09:45 AM   #1
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
SI-2K Mini in the Field

OK, so Mini head comes pretty much ready for studio setup. Power provided via outlet adapter, monitoring happens on the computer (laptop) that runs SiliconDVR software, support is rails on the tripod/dolly. Looking good.

But what about the field work?

- Camera support? (especially stabilizers - this cam has rather pronounced jello and rolling shutter effects...)

- Power?

- Monitoring? (say, if it is tethered to the laptop in the backpack, how does operator monitor for composition and critical focus? how do you start/stop recording?)
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 28th, 2009, 11:37 AM   #2
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Steve Rice who trades as Darling Films in Western Australia has the bits to set up the Mini Head on a P+S rails kit with OLED viewfinder ( Monitoring ) and a Anton Bauer or V-Mount battery on the back ( Power ) to feed to a backpacked notebook PC or the conventional SI2K recorder unit via umbilical. It is nicknamed the Slumdog kit but it is not quite the same.

The Kenyon Laboratories KS4 gyro may be viable for dampening this kit for handheld work. On the shoulder it might be a bit awkward.

I understand but have not confirmed by research that on Slumdog Millionaire, a gyro was used on some handheld work.

A single gyro will dampen on two axes. A second gyro mounted in 90degrees relative to the first provides the third axis of dampening.

On another post here related to air-ro-air or air-to-ground work, the suggestion was that a two-gyro setup, one oriented along the optical axis beneath the camera and a second oriented vertically behind the camera but canted rearwards about 11 degrees conferred more comfortable usability for agile work versus a true 90 degree arrangement. (My paraphrase of my recollection of the orignal post text.)

Last edited by Bob Hart; August 28th, 2009 at 11:39 AM. Reason: error
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 28th, 2009, 03:02 PM   #3
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Can't find anything of this nature at Darling's web site - only some rap videos :)

Any photos of the rig?

--------------

Some Kenyon stabilized camera references that may be useful:

Kenyon Gyro Basics

IndieCameras.com

And this:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...D6p9HH-sEtJJaA

Quoting...

"In a battle with the sound department, a Kenyon Gyro stabilizer
was used on many of the handheld shots to take the wobble out
of shots that most HDV and mini HD camcorders could eliminate
with Optical Image Stabilization. They used the Kenyon
KS-4 gyro stabilizer (Kenyon Laboratories--Kenyon Gyro Stabilizers for cinematography, cameras and binoculars.), and the local sound
department was able to reduce about 60% of the high-pitched
whine with a custom sound blimp."

So yeah, don't underestimate the noise factor... Also Kenyons take over 5 min to come up to speed, as you know...

I like this SteadyTracker Ultralight (but did not try it w SI-2K mini yet):

CobraCrane | 210056 SteadyTracker UltraLite | 5045 | B&H Photo

It always worked for me with Sony V1U/EX1, and is very practical and simple to set up.

Opinions (Charles Papert seems to conditionally like it):

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/jibs-cran...ultralite.html
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 28th, 2009, 11:37 PM   #4
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Alex.


That is a different "Darling Films". I shall have to tell him about that website.

We are off to Freo tomorrow to talk with a frontline 3D specialist here. I shall see if I can get a photo of the Mini rig. I'm guessing that is also how Steve will want to shoot 3D.

It basically consists of :-


Rods (rails) as the primary structure.

Forward bridgeplate/mount for Mini head.

I think from memory there is also a bridgeplate for tripod mount.

Rear end bridgeplate/support for Anton-Bauer/V-style mount battery mount which can pivot from upright to an inclined position, I guess to facilitate balance.

Fitting to go on top of Mini to carry the OLED viewfinder.

OLED viewfinder itself.

SI Mini head itself.

Shoulder cup.

Run switch on side-handle which goes on a P+S style rosette fixture.

Cables set.


Steve Rice also had P+S make up a longer set of silver rods to support the OLED viewfinder to bring it furthur out from the main recorder unit body and also to enable left eyed operation on the Mini arrangement.
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 28th, 2009, 11:52 PM   #5
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Hart View Post
Run switch on side-handle which goes on a P+S style rosette fixture.
Qu'est-ce que c'est?
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 28th, 2009, 11:54 PM   #6
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
I suppose Tekkeon battery won't do? It does power my manhattanLCD monitor for an hour though...
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 29th, 2009, 10:57 AM   #7
Wrangler
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 6,781
Regarding the Steady Tracker type devices, I'll reiterate that I think they are useful for action sequences where the goal is to remove the most egregious signs of handheld but nowhere near as subtle as a gimbaled stabilizer.

I haven't had the opportunity to fly the SI2K yet but my sense from inspecting it at trade shows is that the cable between head and recorder would be a bit of an issue with a "proper" stabilizer. Once a more flexible solution is worked out, this could be an amazing setup for endurance-based stabilizer shooting (running shots, extended takes a la "Russian Ark" etc).
__________________
Charles Papert
www.charlespapert.com
Charles Papert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 29th, 2009, 11:40 AM   #8
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Even Charles Papert couldn't have said it better!

Wait... you ARE Charles Papert! :)

Thanks for posting here.

Now, for the more "normal" camera moves with SI-2K Mini, I think mini jib on a sliding dolly should be fantastic. Will try shortly.

(Obviously not for running through the slums of Mumbai or anything....)
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 11:19 AM   #9
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Si2k mini rig

The computer is playing fair tonight and images can be uploaded.

Yes, that is one of the those economy Jumbo matteboxes from the little guys over in Chandrigagh India. There was an earlier issue with 4x4 slide holders being a whisker too small for the slides to fit without some plastic having to be shaved at the edges. This has been corrected in the current product.


Alex.

Here are a couple of pics of the Mini rig. Some of the cabling and mattebox bits have not been fitted for these images. Until the laptop arrives, the camera is operated in the SI2K recorder unit.

A "rosette" is the beach umbrella type disk shaped fitting with bolt in centre with teeth formed in it which stops the object it attaches from moving. In this instance, one each to stop the long arms from moving on the rails and one each on the grip handles. The remote run switch is visible on top of the right grip handle.


Charles.

I am a bit of a dumb when it comes to steadycam, one of these "do I need to know this now - not right now" type situations, besides my left knee is pretty much shot, so it is an adventure I will not likely attempt.

Would the windage (air resistance) of an operating laptop on the sled with the screen closed, a 7" daylight LCD monitor where your normal green monochrome monitor would go, cause an issue for a sustained running follow like you describe? Would a solid sail of identical and opposite profile up at the camera end be needed as a counter-resistance to the resistance of the laptop during forward movement or in crosswinds?
Attached Thumbnails
SI-2K Mini in the Field-si2k-mini-03.jpg   SI-2K Mini in the Field-si2k-mini-04.jpg  


Last edited by Bob Hart; August 30th, 2009 at 11:39 AM. Reason: error
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 11:29 AM   #10
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Bob, the green button on the right-hand grip, is that a Record/Stop?

Where does it connect? I only see 2 connectors on camera, one power and one data.
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 12:19 PM   #11
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Alex.


I would have to ask Steve Rice about the connections. He had it set up one day to the recorder unit body via the remote cable. That cable also supplies power to the camera head.

I'm not sure how the start-stop button works or if it works at all with the laptop arrangement.
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 12:22 PM   #12
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Thanks Bob, you are the man!

Judging by this forum, it looks like you are the only person in the world to actively shoot with SI-2K outdoors... and you are doing it upside-down too!!! ;) LOL
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 01:01 PM   #13
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Alex.


It is more likely I am one of few who are posting here. The more serious practitioners are likely focused on earning their keep with their cameras and keeping quiet about their work until it is fit and ready to exhibit.

We haven't had a lot of work with the SI2K yet and it has been mainly pre-prod promotional trailers for local feature movie projects. Much of this has been indoors and outdoors.

I took it airbourne in a Maule M5 in split mode with the Mini head on a stick and me in the lotus position in the luggage bay behind the seats with the recorder unit and battery. Short of using a digital SLR and not being able to see what I was doing, there would have been no other practical way to shoot the real airbornes in this sequence.

http://exposureroom.com/members/DARA...597bc917c0c0b/

Nowhere near the ballyhoo associated with the RED cameras. I don't know the REDs and and not qualified to comment.

What I do like about these things, (that is the full recorder unit/camera package) is that you can turn them on, do the things you are told to do with them and they work, out of the box more or less.

The footage goes straight into a no-name Windows XP computer with Premiere Pro 2 with Prospect 4K and you can do stuff with it without need for a transcoding, conversion or capturing stage.

My computer does not have the guts for real time effects and grading but the fact that I can do a simple assemble and edit straight off the CRU Dataport drives is a big plus for me.

Last edited by Bob Hart; August 30th, 2009 at 01:10 PM. Reason: errors
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 01:24 PM   #14
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,435
Cool footage, thanks!

So takeoff shot is CP lens 25mm, and in-cabin is all Kinoptik 5.7?

Last edited by Alex Raskin; August 30th, 2009 at 01:56 PM.
Alex Raskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 30th, 2009, 01:50 PM   #15
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,356
Alex.



From memory we did some take-offs with a 105mm Nikon, others with the 25mm but I'm not sure now which one we used. I messed it up because I forgot to reset blacks after camera warm-up.

The in-airs where you can see the ground below are with Kinoptik. The rest were on-ground cheats with CP Ultra T* 16mm, 25mm and the single close-ups with the Nikon 58mm f1.2.

A audio feed from the comms system was quite unusual. It has an effective noise cancelling system which actually eliminates engine and prop noise. This was convenient in that I was able to lay a continuous ambience without conflict with other engine which might otherwise cause a sync or beat effect.

Last edited by Bob Hart; August 30th, 2009 at 02:00 PM. Reason: added text
Bob Hart is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > High Definition Video Acquisition > HD and UHD ( 2K+ ) Digital Cinema > Silicon Imaging SI-2K

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:07 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network