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Sony 4K Ultra HD Handhelds
Pro and consumer versions including PXW-Z150, PXW-Z100, PXW-X70 / FDR-AX100


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Old July 29th, 2015, 02:21 AM   #46
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

Yes, but the one I find are not the ones I want :) I want 2 clips straight from the card, not a youtube and vimeo compressed one and even 2 seconds per clip would do just for colorcorrecting and dynamic range purposes. I believe in wonders once I can test and see it with my own eyes.

I use my rx10 a lot at weddings but it does blow out highlights easily, with that I mean extremer situations where you are shooting indoors and you are shooting against a window light with a person standing in front of it, most camera would find that challenging, especially when there is no indoor light to compensate. The rx10 however blows out the window that badly that you can't see the window anymore, it's just one big white blob. I"m curious how s-log2 would handle that AFTER you have colorcorrected so that it would match color with how a standard profile of a rx10 would look like and most important, how easy it is to colorcorrect that.
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Old July 29th, 2015, 08:18 PM   #47
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

Here is a good SLOG-2 vs a "normal" REC.709 image (PP"off")...

The light to the right is exposed to about 100 IRE on both shots.

Look how much more latitude SLOG-2 gives. again, this is exactly why Sony developed SLOG-2. You can increase exposure without clipping the highlights.

I have this as two short videos files if you don't believe the frame grabs. ;-)
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PXW-X70 vs RX10-II-rx10-ii-profile-off.jpg   PXW-X70 vs RX10-II-rx10-ii-slog-2.jpg  

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Old July 30th, 2015, 12:00 AM   #48
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

While the discussion moves into that direction ... does anybody know, if Sony plans to add slog2 to the X70 in a future update? That would match those two cameras perfectly. Can someone recommend settings for a decent flat profile for the X70?
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Old July 31st, 2015, 12:40 AM   #49
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

I doubt it. Sony would really need to add 100mbp first. SLOG needs to be stretched back out into rec.709. You need a durable codec to handle that.

Plus, the PXW-X70 doesn't have a "CyberShot" or "Alpha" logo on it. The X70 is too professional and not "consumer" enough to have a gamma that can record 12 stops of dynamic range.

So...if you really want SLOG-2, you gotta go cheaper and drop down $1000+ to an RX10-II to get that. The X70 is too expensive to have SLOG-2.

It's very possible that the next $499 4k 100mbp/s "Action Cam" will get SLOG-2 Long before the XDCAM X70 does. The Action Cam is also at the perfect price point to get 60p 4k as well. It's just barely cheap enough and not too expensive to have that too.

Hopefully Sony won't raise the price of the 2016 Action Cam. If they do, that might disqualify it from getting SLOG-2 or 60p 4k!

It's a good thing the RX10-II came in at $1300. If it had only been a few dollars more and Sony would have been forced to pull out the high speed frame rate modes.

;-)
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Old July 31st, 2015, 06:49 AM   #50
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobias Meinken View Post
While the discussion moves into that direction ... does anybody know, if Sony plans to add slog2 to the X70 in a future update? That would match those two cameras perfectly. Can someone recommend settings for a decent flat profile for the X70?
I raise Black Gamma and Black Level as high as they will go, lower Saturation a bit, and in Knee adjust Point very low but Slope higher (sounds wrong but looks better to me than minus Slope values). Then I use scopes in post to put highs and shadows where I want. Works great and adds no noise.
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Old July 31st, 2015, 09:44 AM   #51
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

I'm not really familiar with SLOG2 and what cameras have it built in. I'm curious though, as I noticed the other day that Premiere Pro added some color effects in their newest update. One of which is to change the Input LUT. There is an option for SLOG2 and SLOG3. When applied to the footage, it give it a much richer and deeper color tone. Is this the same thing as if it were recorded out of a camera with SLOG2?
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Old July 31st, 2015, 10:55 AM   #52
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

Absolutley not, it's just an effect in PP to simulate Slog 2.

It's like adding a film effect to 60i footage vs filming in 24p.
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Old August 1st, 2015, 03:36 AM   #53
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Totten View Post
I doubt it. Sony would really need to add 100mbp first. SLOG needs to be stretched back out into rec.709. You need a durable codec to handle that.

Plus, the PXW-X70 doesn't have a "CyberShot" or "Alpha" logo on it. The X70 is too professional and not "consumer" enough to have a gamma that can record 12 stops of dynamic range.

So...if you really want SLOG-2, you gotta go cheaper and drop down $1000+ to an RX10-II to get that. The X70 is too expensive to have SLOG-2.
Maybe Sony will ship a "CyberShot" sticker with a new update to cover the "XDCAM" writing to justify SLOG in the X70...;-))
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Old August 1st, 2015, 03:37 AM   #54
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Re: PXW-X70 vs RX10-II

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Originally Posted by David Dixon View Post
I raise Black Gamma and Black Level as high as they will go, lower Saturation a bit, and in Knee adjust Point very low but Slope higher (sounds wrong but looks better to me than minus Slope values). Then I use scopes in post to put highs and shadows where I want. Works great and adds no noise.
Thanks David, sounds good. Will try.
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