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Sony ENG / EFP Shoulder Mounts
Sony PDW-F800, PDW-700, PDW-850, PXW-X500 (XDCAM HD) and PMW-400, PMW-320 (XDCAM EX).


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Old November 19th, 2007, 05:16 AM   #1
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XDCAM workflow and PDZ-1 software

Yet another question...

I'm just getting to grips with my F350 and have been exploring the PDZ-1 software quite a bit. I really like the possibility of using it as a full archive viewer and being able to search for stock footage I've shot, in the future. I plan on dedicating a complete HDD for the storage of the proxy files etc.

So my questions:

How do you manage your XDCAM workflow? DO you take a similar approach and copy all your recorded discs into the PDZ-1 environment? How about disc naming - do you shoot on a new disc and then rename back at the edit suite?

I have a Matrox Axio LE edit system, so it's missing some of the clever functions and clip management that something like Vegas has (I believe). How do you manage the full res clips - copy them to HDD, edit and when the project is finished, delete them and only archive the project files and changed/final high res clips?

Any pointers or suggestions are welcome.

Thanks,

Paul.
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Old November 21st, 2007, 01:16 PM   #2
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I'm mac based so this may work for you Paul, but I simply copy the HD MXF's from my rushes disks to folders on a hard drive. I use clip free naming and prefix my clip names with the year and format. I never reset the numbering so each clip ends up with a unique year/format/number name. If I need to go back to the original disks, because the rushes are in numerical order finding the originals is easy. I always keep the original disks in case of hard drive failure.
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Old November 21st, 2007, 04:04 PM   #3
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Paul,

I am not familiar with the Matrox Axio but Sony's PDZ-1 complimentary XDCAM utility offers some great features and it keeps improving. As you mentioned, yes, the PDZ-1 does a decent job as an archival tool. There is a built-in search engine that comes handy to look for any annotations or disc names you have in the library. It's a bit slow but still very convenient to have. In our shop, we are archiving all XDCAM discs using the PDZ-1 software and loading the proxies on a PC with inexpensive external storage. It only takes a few minutes per disc and it makes it very convenient when trying to locate footage. For AVID users, the new version of the PDZ-1 (v. 2.21) has a new AVID ALE export tool that allows exporting PDZ-1 generated EDLs in AVID ALE compatible format. Beside the EDL, you can also attached XDCAM media to the ALE archive with the option to just attached the media used in the EDL (w/ selectable handles...) or the whole clips. This took can be quite powerful in a production environment especially to PAs and producers.

Thierry.
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Old November 21st, 2007, 04:22 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
I'm mac based so this may work for you Paul, but I simply copy the HD MXF's from my rushes disks to folders on a hard drive. I use clip free naming and prefix my clip names with the year and format. I never reset the numbering so each clip ends up with a unique year/format/number name. If I need to go back to the original disks, because the rushes are in numerical order finding the originals is easy. I always keep the original disks in case of hard drive failure.

Ah OK - that sounds good - just to check, does the F350 continue numbering clips uniquely across multiple discsas long as you don't change the prefix?
What do you use for the format? 50i, DVCAM etc?
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Old November 21st, 2007, 04:23 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Thierry Humeau View Post
Paul,

I am not familiar with the Matrox Axio but Sony's PDZ-1 complimentary XDCAM utility offers some great features and it keeps improving. As you mentioned, yes, the PDZ-1 does a decent job as an archival tool. There is a built-in search engine that comes handy to look for any annotations or disc names you have in the library. It's a bit slow but still very convenient to have. In our shop, we are archiving all XDCAM discs using the PDZ-1 software and loading the proxies on a PC with inexpensive external storage. It only takes a few minutes per disc and it makes it very convenient when trying to locate footage. For AVID users, the new version of the PDZ-1 (v. 2.21) has a new AVID ALE export tool that allows exporting PDZ-1 generated EDLs in AVID ALE compatible format. Beside the EDL, you can also attached XDCAM media to the ALE archive with the option to just attached the media used in the EDL (w/ selectable handles...) or the whole clips. This took can be quite powerful in a production environment especially to PAs and producers.

Thierry.
Thanks Thierry,

I'll take a look to see if Premiere CS3 can support anything like that - not sure it can though :( (actually - just had a look and it looks like Premiere can import AAF files) Will explore further tomorrow :)

Last edited by Paul Gale; November 21st, 2007 at 04:26 PM. Reason: correction
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Old November 21st, 2007, 05:06 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Gale View Post
Ah OK - that sounds good - just to check, does the F350 continue numbering clips uniquely across multiple discsas long as you don't change the prefix?
Yes it does. I use the same numbering system. A unique prefix with the running counter. By the way, not only can you reset the count, but you can preset it as well. This allows me to work with a client's media, numbering clips specifically for them, then returning to my own ongoing count afterwards.

It acts just like the running numbers in your checkbook.

-gb-
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Old November 22nd, 2007, 03:06 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
I'm mac based so this may work for you Paul, but I simply copy the HD MXF's from my rushes disks to folders on a hard drive. I use clip free naming and prefix my clip names with the year and format. I never reset the numbering so each clip ends up with a unique year/format/number name. If I need to go back to the original disks, because the rushes are in numerical order finding the originals is easy. I always keep the original disks in case of hard drive failure.
Alister - if you change the format part of the prefix, doesn't the numbering change or does it remember each prefix you've used and continue renumbering where it left off? Do you use the prefix setting from memory stick?

Cheers!
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Old November 29th, 2007, 01:57 AM   #8
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I know this is all about MAC - but I want to give a short impression why PC-based editors should have a look on Vegas 8.

- Sony Vegas 8 has by far the best implementation of XDCAM HD and proxy handling
- while opening a disc in Vegas you have the option to
- transfer data infos only (no proxy videos, no hd files)
- transfer data + proxies
- transfer data + proxies + hd files
- transfer data + hd files

- full disc proxy transfer takes less than 3 minutes. You dont have to wait: While single proxies finish copying, you can drag and drop them already to the timeline, put a media TC on it, view it , trim it , select different audio channels in different manners.

- when done, Vegas is now either your luxury preview/capture software OR your comfortable editor

- when your preview clips are trimmed (even from different disks) you can start copying the HD MXF files. Optional Vegas will only COPY PORTIONS OF THE CLIPS THAT ARE USED WITHIN THE TIMELINE. 10 seconds out of 1 hr footage - no problem!

- After transfer you can use the copied files in any other NLE too.

A friend of mine is FCP user but likes to do previews with his PC and Vegas.

Another main benefit is that if you do not change integrity of the files (by CC or by and filters), Vegas can export the MXF streams without recompressing - that is FAST!

My 2c.

ULi
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Old November 29th, 2007, 02:02 AM   #9
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Thanks Uli,

I don't think I'd ever move to Vegas full time - I have an Axio system that won't obviously work with it anyway BUT I do own a copy and have had a quick play.

What I'd be interested in is being able to import a client generated clip list (maybe 40-50-60 clips defined by start/end timecode) and then be able to use these in Premiere Pro.

Any idea if this is possible?

Cheers,

Paul.
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Old November 30th, 2007, 09:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Gale View Post
Thanks Uli,

What I'd be interested in is being able to import a client generated clip list (maybe 40-50-60 clips defined by start/end timecode) and then be able to use these in Premiere Pro.

Any idea if this is possible?

Cheers,

Paul.
Hi Paul,

I'm personally trying to get an Avid Liquid Chrome Xe system up and running at the moment, but I have friends with Vegas and Premiere and was curious about your problem, so we tried a little experiment.

We used Vegas to create a cliplist exactly like the kind you described and then saved it as an .aaf file.

Since Vegas Exports .aaf files and Premiere imports .aaf files we figured Premiere would import the cliplist with no problems.

In fact, Premiere DID import the file created by Vegas, but the results were a little buggy. For example, it took SEVERAL minutes for Premiere to read and load the .aaf file, even on a very fast machine.

The clips with the proper names appear in the project window and even on the timeline once moved there, but the clips are empty. You have to manually link them it seems to the real files on your hard drives.

We didn't attempt to do a batch capture from any of the clips, but perhaps that method would work okay.

When attempting to link the empty clips to the correct .MXF files, an error pop-up window came up saying "The selected file cannot be linked because it has 1 audio channel(s) and the clip was created with 2 audio channel(s)."

Not sure if there's a way to get around that one, but maybe someone else here can try their own experiment and post the results.

The original clip list was created using Sony XDCam HD .MXF files.

Once Premiere imported the .aaf created in Vegas, we attempted to link the empty clips back to the same .MXF files. That's when the error window appeared.

As an attempt to get around the error message, I tried experimenting with a clip list that was ALL video and no audio. Created the .aaf file. Imported successfully into Premiere, tried again to link the "empty" clips to the original .MXF files, but.....got the same error message, "The selected file cannot be linked because it has 1 audio channel(s) and the clip was created with 2 audio channel(s)."

Close, but no cigar. Maybe someone else knows of a workaround, but that's as far as I got.

Best,
Michael
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Old December 1st, 2007, 03:38 AM   #11
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Thanks Michael,

Thanks for trying that :) Shame it's so buggy :(

What we really need is MXF support right in Premiere like Vegas has - little chance of getting that I guess unless Adobe realises that MXF is the way forward.
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Old December 1st, 2007, 06:42 PM   #12
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No problem, Paul.

I'm willing to bet that Adobe WILL integrate Sony .MXF file support into Premiere Pro eventually. I predict there will be a growing number of us who use these files in the months ahead, and Adobe needs to stay on top of their game to compete effectively like anyone else.

On the other hand, that doesn't mean they will move quickly. Could take months or even longer for them to make that happen.

There IS a plug-in for Premiere by Main Concept called MPeg Pro HDV. You can download a trial version of the Plug In for free from their web site. If Main Concept would lower the price of the plug in, I think they would sell more. From what I understand it's $500 or something like that. Pretty steep for a plug in, doncha think?

Best regards,
Michael
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