The V1U is functionally useless for 24P movie production, correct? at DVinfo.net

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Sony HVR-V1 / HDR-FX7
Pro and consumer versions of this Sony 3-CMOS HDV camcorder.


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Old November 11th, 2006, 11:33 AM   #1
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The V1U is functionally useless for 24P movie production, correct?

I'm looking to buy a low price 24P-capable HD cam next month for independant feature production and the V1U looked great, until I read a little further and found out that no NLE currently supports editing its 24P.

I'm coming into this fairly new, but unless I'm mistaken, if I buy this cam, I won't be able to use it to create a 24P movie unless and until FCP, PP etc supports it, which could easily take a year or more, based on past actions. I understand that Sony's own editing equipment supports it, but that's not much use for the vast majority of us who use 3rd party NLE's.
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Old November 11th, 2006, 11:58 AM   #2
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From my (basically limited) understanding, you can use it with Connect HD or some other Cineform product to get 24p. I'm sure Vegas 7 will update it soon enough (if it hasn't already).
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Old November 11th, 2006, 02:34 PM   #3
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It has been said on this forum several times that Edius Pro 4 supports the V1 24p.

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Old November 11th, 2006, 03:09 PM   #4
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Greg, where have you read that no current NLE supports the V1's 24P? Sony's marketing of the V1 specifies that most current NLEs will allow editing this form of 24P.
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Old November 11th, 2006, 06:16 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vandas
Greg, where have you read that no current NLE supports the V1's 24P? Sony's marketing of the V1 specifies that most current NLEs will allow editing this form of 24P.
Tom, as I mentioned I'm learning this stuff as I go along, but I've seen a couple of online articles such as the one below and posts in forums that suggest that no NLE currently supports 3:2 pulldown in HD resolution for HDV
http://www.creativemac.com/articles/...e.jsp?id=67595

I really hope to be corrected on this since I intended to use the cam to capture 24P without needing to wait for FCP to support it.
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Old November 11th, 2006, 08:29 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Quinn
I'm looking to buy a low price 24P-capable HD cam next month for independant feature production and the V1U looked great, until I read a little further and found out that no NLE currently supports editing its 24P.

I'm coming into this fairly new, but unless I'm mistaken, if I buy this cam, I won't be able to use it to create a 24P movie unless and until FCP, PP etc supports it, which could easily take a year or more, based on past actions. I understand that Sony's own editing equipment supports it, but that's not much use for the vast majority of us who use 3rd party NLE's.
The word "currently" is the key as you can't "currently" buy the V1 so the fact that one can't "currently" edit 24p doesn't justify the absurd TOPIC name you posted. You can't "currently" buy a PS 3 in the USA -- doesn't meant you won't be able to in a few days.
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Old November 11th, 2006, 11:05 PM   #7
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The camera isn't even out yet; I've never seen an NLE manufacturer release updates for a camera BEFORE the camera ships, nor really talk about it. This camera isn't useless to shoot anything, it's EXTREMELY useful to shoot anything with.

Feature film? Extra added color, gamma, etc., features, along with 24p, gives the filmmaker one of the biggest advantages, IMHO. If you are a great DP, learn how killer the camera is (along with a great script, cast, crew, etc., of course), you'll be happy with the footage.

What about other situations that may not call for 24p?

How about wedding videography? I haven't shot a wedding (or at least helped shoot) in over 3 years, but I've seen what these guys and gals can do with the Z1. And I know what my little wedding video looked like, that was shot by a close friend on his FX1...killer! V1 can add more to how the camera handles blacks and whites, something I had issues with in DV when it comes to the black tuxes and white gowns. Esp. outside in South Florida--things are practically glowing. I know the V1, like the Z1/FX1, will handle that fine, if not better.

Event/corporate, etc.? After using the Z1 and FX1 regularly in film production, I was able to just shoot everyday stuff with those units, stuff that is common in event videography--you're just going with the flow. And I was VERY impressed with how the cameras held up to bright light and dark shadows when you can have your light kit handy. I'm positive we'll be able to make great use of the additional picture controls and more.

News? Why not? I worked for over 7 years in news, shooting on M2, BetaSP, DVCPro 25/50 and even my old Canon XL1. All those cameras did a fine job, but I was impressed to see a videographer shoot some freelance news stuff in HDV (Z1), then down-convert to DV/4:3 from the camera to an SD digital deck. It looked killer. I bet the V1 will only help him and others out.

I guess I felt like I needed to answer the statement that the "V1u is functionally useless for 24P movie production," when in fact it is. I don't know what anyone will offer when the V1 ships, but I do know Sony knocked 'em out of the park with their HDV offerings, and I am confident they'll continue to do so. And the NLEs supported the cameras pretty quickly, which was great.

As I always say, take the V1u out for a test drive, and see how it can help you. I know you'll enjoy the camera.

Sorry for the ramble, but I felt very passionate to answer.

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Old November 12th, 2006, 12:09 AM   #8
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OK, thanks for the replies - I should have written "functionally unusable" rather than "useless", but I stick with my assertion that if you're buying it to shoot 24P footage you might have to wait a while before the more popular NLE's such as FCP and PP actually support it. That said, I will be pre-ordering it since it seems to be in a class of its own.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 12:20 AM   #9
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Greg,

It may have taken around 2 years to get solid HDV editing (whether native or though a DI), but I'd be surprised if it takes a while to see an update that will cater to the V1u's speciality, 24p/30p. Keep in mind, the camera isn't even shippng yet, so no one knows what's in store.

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Old November 12th, 2006, 12:36 AM   #10
 
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1. Camera is not shipping yet.
2. There are currently 3 options in place for 24p editing now.
3. NLE developers have been given footage/data well in advance. Many have promised updates due "around the time the camera ships."
4. Virtually all apps support the cam in 60i/30p mode now.
5. Why worry about what apps don't support a non-shipping camcorder?

XDCAM HD and DVCProHD aren't fully supported, if at all supported in many applications. Does that make those cameras "functionally limited or dead?"
Of course not.
It takes time for developers to release updates, and there is no rush to release updates for a non-shipping product. Relax. Take a deep breath. It might take *your* favorite NLE some time to catch up, but catch up they will, and very likely, darn soon after the cam is shipping.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 03:36 PM   #11
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shoot in HD downconvert to SD

Heath:

Your post on the V1U convinced me to buy it over the Z1U. I will be shooting mostly sit down interviews and most of my clients only have SD TVs so 24p isn't that important to me.

Later I want to be able to offer them the stuff in HD when they (and most of America) get around to buying their new HD TV sets.

Sounds like the V1U is perfect for this, correct?
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Old November 12th, 2006, 03:42 PM   #12
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Sal,

Awesome and you bet it's great! I highly recommend shooting in HDV, capturing and editing in HDV, then create a new timeline and do your output to DV/SD (that's how I usually do it in Final Cut Pro when going to tape) and deliver in SD. You still have an HDV version.

Then, a year or so from now, when you hear your clients have a Blu Ray or HD DVD, then it's time to burn them a new, HD version!

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Old November 12th, 2006, 06:30 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sal C. Martin
Heath:

Your post on the V1U convinced me to buy it over the Z1U. I will be shooting mostly sit down interviews and most of my clients only have SD TVs so 24p isn't that important to me.
Sal, that seems like an odd statement... 24p isn't important to you, so you buy the V1U? Kinda seems backwards...
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Old November 12th, 2006, 06:38 PM   #14
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It's not an odd statement at all. 24P is just one of many useful features on this camera. I can imagine a lot of people buying this camcorder who have no intention of ever shooting 24P with it. In fact, even if the V1 had no 24P capability at all, it would still sell like crazy.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 08:56 PM   #15
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Chris is right. I know a guy who loves the DVX100a he bought 2 years ago that NEVER shoots 24p. He even makes a couple of extra bucks renting his cam out to local indie filmmakers. And those are the only people shooting 24p. He loves the way he can manipulate the image; I'll bet he buys a V1 over a Z1 because of the image controls.

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