fx-7 a bit disappointed

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

Originally Posted by Ken Ross

Even the two shots you showed of the green basket are exposed differently and that alone could account for color differences. Exposure, white balance settings, white balance shift, color intensity, phase shift will all alter the color of green as well as other hues.
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Not only different exposures, but different angles, different compressions in the images, not screen caps from the same NLE settings; Sorry Chris, but those images are meaningless with respect to comparisons. You need to shoot same position, same lighting, same everything to make any sort of semi-realistic comparisons.
If you want the most base comparison, put both cams in Easy mode/green box mode, and let the cameras do the adjusting.

[Chris Barcellos]

To FX7/V1 Users:

Assuming FX7 provides similar 1080i footage as the V1, and that I am not enamoured with the need for 24p, am I stepping up from the FX1 by going with an FX7. I'm guessing from review I've seen so far that I would lose a bit in light gathering capability, maybe have a bit sharper picture, and I would benefit from the 20/30x zoom-- especially if I am going to try shooting nature stuff more in the future. Comments ?

[Ken Ross]

Chris, relative to the FX1 (which I too had), you'd be gaining somewhat better color reproduction, a bit sharper picture, HDMI output and the longer zoom. You'd give up some of the wide angle the FX1 had and some low-light capability.

[Chris Hull]

Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle

Of course at color phase shifted to one side or the other, the colors will appear unnatural! That's exactly what it's supposed to do. Shifting the phase in one direction or another is exactly for the purpose of emphasizing or deemphasizing chroma information.
Your post suggests you've not learned the camcorder functions yet. White balance won't make a scene more reddish, for example, unless you're white balancing to a color not contained in the actual lighting of the subject, or you're white balancing to a color other than white. You can warm (red) or cool (blue) the frame via white balance if you want to, but the camera itself will not do this.

the fx-7 shots i show were with color phase 0.with white balance i have found in nearly all the cams i have owned manual setting has given me personaly the best color using a white card etc but with this cam manual makes the picture too red for example tree trunks branches etc,awb is best in my fx-7, green the same whatever method used,if i put saturation up all the other colors that are ok with awb will go up as well .others say there cams are ok with green so i think maybe the two i have had come from a poor batch [chips perhaps]of early cams, unless you or someone can come up with a miricle i will have to live with it.thanks for your help chris

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

couldn't tell you anything more, Chris...maybe you have a bad apple. Out of the MANY forums I participate in, your post is the first of its kind. I've seen other comments, but not like yours. I'd suggest you take it back to the dealer. I shot 5 hours with a pre-production V1, which has the same chips as the FX7, including aerials under very nasty conditions, and all was well.
Either way, you've now got opinions from several others telling you what I'm telling you.
FWIW, I don't own *any* of the consumer models, never have. I do however, have several V1's, Z1's, and a boatload of A1's, all of which are similar to their consumer counterparts.

[Chris Hull]

thanks douglas i cant send another back too much hassle i may well grow to get used to the greens.regarding cams a lot of people have sent in to sites rubbishing the hc-1 but mine is great it just shows.the guy asking about the fx-7 20x zoom i realy like mine and the d extender.

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

Wow...too much hassle to have a correctly functioning camcorder that cost a few thousand bucks?

I'm still curious to know how you captured those images as well, as both of them are heavily cropped from what the cam shot.

Full shots of both cams for comparisons would be most helpful.

I can't see from your shots that they're not correctly green, those baskets sure look the same as the Safeway greens we have around here, and with no other relative colors aside from neutrals, it's hard to comment.

[Ken Ross]

Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle

I can't see from your shots that they're not correctly green, those baskets sure look the same as the Safeway greens we have around here, and with no other relative colors aside from neutrals, it's hard to comment.

Funny, I thought the same thing Doug! I seriously doubt another FX7 will change things for Chris. I think the camera just isn't for him and he might be better off trying to sell it.

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

I find the cropped photo very suspicious, and when I put both of them into Pshop to analyze the shot, the "FX-7" shot doesn't have the same pixelation that zoomed HDV has. I don't know how it was compressed, but one thing I can recognize fairly quickly are the patterns of HDV when zoomed in very deeply. Not sure if that's a good thing, but have spent a lot of time digging.
Chris, I'd really like to see two side by side shots, one from each cam, and captured exactly the same from your NLE with no cropping, color correction, etc. These obviously aren't.

[Chris Hull]

Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle

I find the cropped photo very suspicious, and when I put both of them into Pshop to analyze the shot, the "FX-7" shot doesn't have the same pixelation that zoomed HDV has. I don't know how it was compressed, but one thing I can recognize fairly quickly are the patterns of HDV when zoomed in very deeply. Not sure if that's a good thing, but have spent a lot of time digging.
Chris, I'd really like to see two side by side shots, one from each cam, and captured exactly the same from your NLE with no cropping, color correction, etc. These obviously aren't.

there was no correction but i filmed another green box the fx-7 was still the worst i think it needs green saturation to go up without altering other colors,by the way i have had filming friends check that its not just my eyesite and they agree green on my fx-7 is a bit week compared to the hc-1,pc corecction may be the only way if the film was a special one.the jaggies i get is also a bit of concern on 0 central res is it because the fx-7 has a bit more resolution
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u...56/1st-one.gif

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u...56/2nd-one.gif

two shots from video first fx-7 second hc-1 did prints to check and the hc-1 almost exact to the washing tub,no correction.chris
ps put photos beside each other for comparison

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

I'm going to submit that your display may have an issue.
Again, it's hard to compare anything, as you don't have other colors in the shot, and one looks like it has your body shadow on it.
Frankly, I don't think there is any problem there, but obviously you do.
If you feel there is a problem, get it fixed.
If you'd like intelligent input from this thread, you need to shoot an image that contains other colors. Or shoot a chip chart, which you likely don't have.
Then we have something for comparison.

[Chris Hull]

well one is true the other not,i made sure no shadow in either,best to leave this topic douglas i will get to love the cam maybe.cheers chris

[Chris Hurd]

If I bought a new car and suspected that it needed a tune-up right away, then shame on the manufacturer.

If I then chose not to get that tune-up and just "live with the problem," then shame on me.

Sorry but I cannot understand nor sympathize with the attitude that suspects there might be trouble with an expensive new camcorder, but resists the helpful attempts of genuinely concerned fellows to clarify or rectify the issue.

In fact, I find it downright annoying. Thread closed,