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Sony HVR-Z1 / HDR-FX1
Pro and consumer versions of this Sony 3-CCD HDV camcorder.


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Old January 26th, 2005, 07:48 AM   #16
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To quote the late, great Johnny Carson: "I did not know that!" Thanks Barry, I was going by the specs in the manual and that info is not clearly stated.
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Old January 26th, 2005, 08:19 AM   #17
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Why is it better to capture the already mpeg2 encoded signal via decklink multibridge as uncompressed than via firewire ?
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Old January 26th, 2005, 09:25 AM   #18
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Speaking of the "bit" topic - check this page out today. Mike over at HD for Indies has something about FCP and "bits".

http://www.hdforindies.com/
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Old January 26th, 2005, 12:19 PM   #19
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Gabor,

The reason we went with capturing via the Multibridge is because there is no timecode in HDV. When you output the downconverted DV footage from the FX1 you get standard DV timecode.

So we are sending the component (RGB) video and composite audio (left & right) to the Multibridge. We then use the downconverted DV signal just to control playback and get timecode. The component signal is actually YUV and not RGB.

This way I can recreate my entire project by recapturing the footage later.

With the HDV footage captured via firewire I have no timecode and if I ever loose that file I will not be able to recreate the project without a whole lot of work.
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Old January 26th, 2005, 12:20 PM   #20
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Re: Sony HDR-FX1 no budget horror Feature

<<<-- Originally posted by Dustin Cross : Aloha,

Our biggest complaint about the cameras was the iris. Since we were doing a two camera shoot most of the time we would have one camera wide and one long on the lens. The wide camera would want to be at an f1.8, but the long camera couldn't go lower than a f2.8. That got old really quick.-->>>

That got old really quick? what does that mean. Does it matter that the apertures are different from a wide and a tele dual camera shot?

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Old January 26th, 2005, 12:27 PM   #21
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<<<-- Originally posted by Dustin Cross : Gabor,

With the HDV footage captured via firewire I have no timecode. -->>>

WHAT???? Really???? That's bad news for me and I did not know that.

With no timecode....how am I suppsed to effectively make a movie?? Take wild guesses?? If I record audio seperately, How do I sync it up?? (and lining up a slate with the waveforms peak mark before every single clip take is not an answer). How do I edit in DV for speed and real time effects and then recapture the footage in HDV for the final if there is no timecode for the program to look for??? with the HDV footage?

Please tell me that HDV has timecode, or they fixed this on the Z1.

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Old January 26th, 2005, 12:44 PM   #22
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Shannon,

To make editing easier you want both cameras to look as close to the same as possible. If you set up a shot with one camera using am f1.6, the other camera at an f2.8 will be too dark and if you try to cut those two whots together it will look odd.

For the timecode thing, the only answer I have found is convert the anologue HD signal to HD-SDI like we are going to do when we get our Multibridge working. AJA has stuff to do this that works right now, but the Multibridge was the cheaper and more robust solution, if it ever works.

Syncing external audio is going to be a slow process. There is no way I know of to sync timecode from the FX1 to an external device like a DAT deck. So you are going to be matching up the clap with its sound in post. I guess you could use a timecode slate and get the audio timecode off that slate when it claps. These slates and required accessories I think cost more than the FX1.
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Old January 26th, 2005, 12:53 PM   #23
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<<<-- Originally posted by Dustin Cross : Shannon,

There is no way I know of to sync timecode from the FX1 to an external device like a DAT deck. -->>>

Yes, via the LanC port, you can get the timecode with a little $200 device and then slave the DAT (pd-4) to the camera that way.

OR

(for the Z1, which i planned on getting), You can put both devices on Free-Run code, set em both at 00:00:00:00 at call, start them as closes as possible and clap the begginning of the reel. It's quite simple actually.....however....

If HDV has No Timecode......all is worthless. This is confusing, and puts a serious dent in my workflow.

So are you saying, if I was to use a program that captures directly from the camera...say for instance, the new imovie hd or FCPEHD....then each and every clip that is captured from the camera will have no timecode...or each and every clip will bein at 00:00:00:00, regardless of what position the tape is at??

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Old January 26th, 2005, 01:13 PM   #24
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Shannon,

I have not heard of the LanC port device for sending TC. That is pretty cool.

The only way I have captured HDV footage is with LumiereHD and every clip starts a 00:00:00:00 no matter where it is on tape. I have not used FCPEHD or iMovieHD so I don't know what they are doing. We decided to go with the analogue to HD-SDI solution because we coldn't find anything that gave us TC in an HDV file. I don't think MPEG-2 supports TC.

You can capture HD-SDI to DVCPRO HD which only reqires about 14MB/s. That is about four times the requirment of DV, but most harddrives can handle that speed and FCP supports it.

For the Multibridge and a Decklink HD you are looking at about $2500 or $2000 for an AJA analogue to digital converter and the Decklink HD card if you don't need analogue HD out like I do.

If someone knows of a way to get an HDV file with timecode please let us know!
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Old January 26th, 2005, 01:19 PM   #25
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<<<-- Originally posted by Dustin Cross : Shannon,

every clip starts a 00:00:00:00 no matter where it is on tape. -->>>

Lord, have mercy....This is bad news. That is a devastating blow to my workflow. I will be sad all day because of this.

Here are the devices that extracts timecode from your lanC port...

1. http://www.spcomms.com/lanc_interface/

2. http://www.spcomms.com/ltcexport/

but...so what....no timecode....no reason!

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Old January 26th, 2005, 01:45 PM   #26
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Shannon,

Hopefully the Z1 has real timecode.

The FX1 does not have timecode, but HDV footage downconverted by the camera to DV footage uses the tape counter. I would assume teh same tape counter TC is there for the HDV footage.

There is NO capture software I know of that will currently use timecode in HDV. Just because the Z1 says it will have TC don't expect to use it until you see capture tools that support it.
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Old January 26th, 2005, 03:22 PM   #27
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Actually Shannon you could have posted that question here and get the same answer. And yes, the Z1U has "real" SMPTE timecode, including the ability to switch between drop frame and non-drop frame; preset, free run, user bits and more. See my FX1 / Z1U comparison chart for timecode features.

See also my [http://www.hdvinfo.net/articles/sonyhdrfx1/freerun.php]Z1U Free Run Timecode[/url] article.

I'd really like to see our members posting their HDV questions and answers here rather than posting links to other message boards. This place is only as good as you want to make it; please accept this as my invitation to build this community by using it for all of your HDV discussions / research / questions / answers etc. Thanks,
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Old January 26th, 2005, 03:34 PM   #28
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<<<-- Originally posted by Dustin Cross : To make editing easier you want both cameras to look as close to the same as possible. If you set up a shot with one camera using am f1.6, the other camera at an f2.8 will be too dark and if you try to cut those two whots together it will look odd. -->>>

Looking back at your original explanation of the setup, you were using a .6 ND on both cameras...if the iris difference made the pictures look different, why didn't you just take the ND off of the darker camera? Or try a different amount of ND on one or the other?

To my knowledge, nearly every video zoom lens has this limitation due to their design...it's something I've worked around many times, and I'm sure others have as well...
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Old January 26th, 2005, 05:46 PM   #29
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Indeed, the work-around is as easy as locking the exposure for both cameras to whatever the max. aperture is at full telephoto; in this case it would have been f/2.8.
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Old January 26th, 2005, 08:39 PM   #30
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Dustin,

A bit of advice, don't capture in down-converted DV mode, use Frederic's solution of using iMovie HD and FCP HD, because there's no way of offlining in DV and onlining in HDV.

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