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Sony HVR-Z1 / HDR-FX1
Pro and consumer versions of this Sony 3-CCD HDV camcorder.


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Old March 14th, 2005, 03:50 PM   #16
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Thanks for the information Shannon,

is there any way you can let us take a look at either of these music videos?
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Old March 14th, 2005, 08:56 PM   #17
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Z1s available

My order for the Z1 went through S. CA. Vegas users group. The order was through a Sony dealer with the camera being shipped directly from Sony. The word at Sony is they are expecting a shipment this week and our cameras will be shipped then. The price is $4,820 including delivery in the US.
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Old March 15th, 2005, 12:52 AM   #18
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I been gone all day.

ummmm, how do you answer 16 replies? LOL

easy

just answer Brandon:

NO PROB MR. GREENLEE. I"LL SHOOT YOU A DVD WHEN THEY ARE FINISH CUTTING THE VIDEOS. maybe even a trailer, although I hate how my stuff looks on the internet, and sometimes makes me look bad. *smile*

- ShannonRawls.com
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Old March 15th, 2005, 06:36 AM   #19
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CF30 or SS30

Quick Question for those in the know. I've been messing around with just about eveything inside and outside this camera and I have also grown to love CF30. Here's my question:

Is there a drawback to using the cam without CF30 but with the shutter speed set to 30?

To me it looks even better(motion wise) and it looks the same (image qual wise) but the huge advantage gained is that you get twice as much light. For me this is great because the only thing I don't like about my FX1 is how much light it needs. I know that using CF30 can end up costing you vertical resolution so I assume the same is true with a shuttle speed of 30, can anyone verify this?

Thanks in advance,
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Old March 15th, 2005, 07:28 AM   #20
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Is CF30 effectively the same motion signature as the Frame Mode on the XL1 series? i.e. "mock" 30P?


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Old March 15th, 2005, 09:36 AM   #21
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<<<-- Originally posted by Shannon Rawls : I been gone all day.
NO PROB MR. GREENLEE. I"LL SHOOT YOU A DVD WHEN THEY ARE FINISH CUTTING THE VIDEOS. maybe even a trailer, although I hate how my stuff looks on the internet, and sometimes makes me look bad. *smile*

- ShannonRawls.com -->>>


Thanks alot.

What is your final medium for distribution?

Is this headed for TV or maybe promo packs for the artists involved?
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Old March 15th, 2005, 10:14 AM   #22
 
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<<<-- Originally posted by Charles Papert : Is CF30 effectively the same motion signature as the Frame Mode on the XL1 series? i.e. "mock" 30P? -->>>

Is CF30 effectively the same motion signature as the Frame Mode on the XL1 series? i.e. "mock" 30P?


It's similar, but not the same. I've put frame by frame images up at http://www.sundancemediagroup.com/tr...30_cadence.htm if you're interested.

Jerry, what happened to the "killer, awesome, lower than anyone else" deal I kept hearing about? We bought 2 cams for about the same cost from B&H, with no tax, and we got 3 DigitalMaster tapes tossed in to boot. I was gonna wait, but it seemed like it was taking forever to get a price quote. I'm glad we didn't wait.
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Old March 15th, 2005, 10:29 AM   #23
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"killer deal"

Douglas:
It wasn't the "killer deal" but they went to the trouble and since I had waited, I went with them. I felt like I should support the group effort. I pay no tax either way.

I saved about $120 but the use of the camera during that time would have been worth more. I am in no rush on my project but I can rent the camera to Guy's client for a 2 day shoot (he wanted to use it with his FX1) and would have come out ahead. I'm not sure if it will get here in time.
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Old March 15th, 2005, 10:36 AM   #24
 
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Ouch! Sorry to hear that. We don't rent cams often, but hey...if you're not using it and you know the guy....We rented ours for 2 days at 150.00 each, so it was a pretty sweet return of 600.00 for the two days. That's why I didn't want to wait for the price that I was thinking was coming. B&H no longer has the better deal that they had back in Feb, but I think that's because there is a shortage of these cams right now.

Sorry that it wasn't a great price. I kept wanting to tell everyone what we were doing through B&H, but didn't want to rock the boat.
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Old March 15th, 2005, 10:50 AM   #25
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the project

Every once in a while we get an ouch. My first feature is coming together. We'll probably begin it soon after NAB. Right now I just want to get my hands on the camera and learn as much about what it can do as I can. This community seems like one of the best places to do that -(outside of your place, of course). I'm keeping notes on all your suggestions and plan to start trying them out as soon as it gets here. I hope to shoot a couple of short scripts that I can post. I'm looking forward to seeing you at NAB and getting the latest techniques.
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Old March 15th, 2005, 12:07 PM   #26
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I am still hoping for some opinions on the type of footage that would best show the differences between using standard 60i vs CF30.

I assume that fast moving objects would be a good start. Anything else in particular? Any advantages when shooting landscapes, ocean waves, sunsets/sunrises?
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Old March 15th, 2005, 12:54 PM   #27
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Slower moving objects are also good, and try against a static background with some not-quite horizontals of high contrast. I use a movie like this for testing my plugins and find it shows up a lot of faults. The high contrast off horizontals are there to show up aliassing and twitter BTW.

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Old March 15th, 2005, 01:05 PM   #28
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Shannon thanks for sharing your findings, it is hard to find plp like you and others in this forum that are willing to share info without asking for nothing in return "knowledge is a universal gift, it should be share, not sell" this is why i say thank you.

i ll be shooting a "reggaeton" music video in Puerto Rico next month im into pre-production desitions, first ill be using a sony fx1 with a mini35 adapter and a set of 35mm high speed primes, my initial workflow was to shoot cf30 for regular shots and 60i for slow motion shots, as ill be editing in premiere and Shannon you are a PC guy like me, should i shot this way or do you think that the soon to be realese ifo about cf24 will look better? also im really intrested on your output methods, i know that you edit on HD 29.97 timeline, leaving the downcovertion til the end, is this true? do you capture progressive?

thanks
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Old March 15th, 2005, 02:39 PM   #29
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<<<-- Originally posted by Rafael Cruz :
my initial workflow was to shoot cf30 for regular shots and 60i for slow motion shots, as ill be editing in premiere and Shannon you are a PC guy like me, should i shot this way or do you think that the soon to be realese ifo about cf24 will look better? also im really intrested on your output methods, i know that you edit on HD 29.97 timeline, leaving the downcovertion til the end, is this true? do you capture progressive? -->>>

That's exactly what I did. On the raggae video we had a plane taxi the runway, and the director wanted a look similar to the movie "FACE OFF" where Nicholas Cage was going out to the airplane in slow motion and his jacket flew up with the wind and revealed those gorgeous pearl handles all chrome smith & wessons in the small of his back. Well yea, he wanted something like that. So for that shot we took the camera out of CF30 and put it on regular 60i. Shot that scene, and put the camera back in cf30 for the rest of the shoot. The editor is going to slow the 60i down in post to replicate that FACE OFF scene but instead, using the artist coming from a taxi'ng airplane.

I personally don't think you should ever really need to shoot ANY fast-paced music video in CF24, or 24P, or 60i deinterlaced to 24fps. That's the big miconception about 24p.

"24P DOES NOT GIVE YOU A FILM LOOK......HOW YOU SHOOT AND HOW YOU LIGHT AND HOW YOU DIRECT GIVES YOU THE FILM LOOK"

24p is just a framerate. nothing more. And as of 2005, humans are acustomed to 24p for great dramatic style movies or action adventures with drama and love and dialog conversations involved. Not Music Videos.

For Music videos, I bet most people didn't know that the directors normally overcrank their cameras for most of the video. They overcrank to 48fps if they can...especially for the fast paced hip-hop, rock, raggae, dancing, metal, bouncing around music videos with lots of T & A shots. Slow motion is almost ALWAYS overcranked and never in 24p mode. This is why I gave up arguing with novices who read too damn much on the internet and follow advertising posters like a religion. You have to get out there and EXPERIENCE what is really going on and see the methods that are used to get a clear understanding. People follow "24p" like its the holy grail and any DP who says the words "24P" is followed like Jesus himself. Yet, after all is said and done, they are upset in the cutting room.

Music videos shot in DV/HD, in my humble opinion, should be shot in Progressive 30 frames progressive to look best on a Cable TV broadcast, especially the current hip-hop, rock, raggae, dancing type. Much better visually then 24p. Save 24p for your movie!

Rafael, no..I do NOT edit on HD timeline in 29.97. I do the downconversion FIRST and edit DV on a 29.97 DV timeline in progressive mode. I just prefer this method for speed and real-time transitions and all that good tuff that dv editting provides us today. if we need to make a HD master, I will then Online the footage and do so. Right now...there's no need, but I hold that option in my hands to do it anytime i damn well please! *smile* ya gotta love HD.

Raggaeton is hott!! by the way!

- ShannonRawls.com
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Old March 15th, 2005, 11:45 PM   #30
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Do you guys leave your shutter at 30 in CF30 or do you set it to 60?
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