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Sony HVR-Z1 / HDR-FX1
Pro and consumer versions of this Sony 3-CCD HDV camcorder.


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Old July 10th, 2005, 05:34 PM   #1
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From HDCam to HDV, timecode?

I've got an HVR-Z1U camera. My client has HDCAM tapes.

I talked to a dub house and they can convert the HDCAM to HDV using a hvr-m10u, but told me that the timecode won't transfer. I know that the HVR-Z1U has a timecode feature and I take it that the HVR-M10 has it also.

My question is, assuming that the timecode is just started on the hvr-m10u, how close will the timecode be to the source timecode on the HDCAM?

Thanks for your help

Sean Borjes
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Old July 10th, 2005, 05:55 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Borjes
I've got an HVR-Z1U camera. My client has HDCAM tapes.

I talked to a dub house and they can convert the HDCAM to HDV using a hvr-m10u, but told me that the timecode won't transfer. I know that the HVR-Z1U has a timecode feature and I take it that the HVR-M10 has it also.

Sean Borjes
I wasn't aware that the HDV deck could record HD unless it was already in HDV (ilink) mode.

How are they converting HDSDI to HDV?
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Old July 10th, 2005, 06:37 PM   #3
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Well, According to my dub house...

I talked to a gentleman who told me he could do the dub and he said it would be no problem to dub the HDCAM to HDV over SDI. Digital straight across. He said the signal would be degrated (cause it's going to HDV, a compressed format) but that it will transfer.

Since you're unfamiliar with this, how would you convert HDCAM to HDV and further, is there anyway to either keep the timecode or just start the deck "close enough" so that if someone wants to eventually use my edl then the rebuild will only take a few days as opposed to starting from scratch?

Thanks
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Old July 10th, 2005, 09:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Borjes
I talked to a gentleman who told me he could do the dub and he said it would be no problem to dub the HDCAM to HDV over SDI. Digital straight across. He said the signal would be degrated (cause it's going to HDV, a compressed format) but that it will transfer.

Since you're unfamiliar with this, how would you convert HDCAM to HDV and further, is there anyway to either keep the timecode or just start the deck "close enough" so that if someone wants to eventually use my edl then the rebuild will only take a few days as opposed to starting from scratch?

Thanks
The HDV VTR does not have HDSDI in or out. Miranda sells a box that goes from HDV to HDSDI but, at the moment, there is no (that has been announced) box that goes from HDSDI to HDV.

The HDV VTR also has no component HD analog inputs. It does have outputs, but it has no way of inputting and HD signal and converting it to HDV.

I'd love to be wrong. I'd love to know how they're doing this dub.
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Old July 15th, 2005, 03:44 PM   #5
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You were right.

There is no HDSDI on the HDV deck. It does have a analog component in, but no way to go digital straight across.

They do still have to do a downconvert regardless.

Since we realized that going in Analog will only give us a DV signal as opposed to an HDV signal, we decided to dub to DVCam instead.

This way the timecode does come straight across. This is awesome for me because my HDV camera will read the timecode, so it makes for a much less expensive way to do an offline.

I'm finishing my project in DVD anyway, but when my client does want to go back to finish HD, we'll be able to do it with relative ease.

I'm sure that Sony will come out with a real production HDV deck which will have either a firewire or HDSDI so it will go straight across.

Thanks for your help
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Old July 15th, 2005, 05:46 PM   #6
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Correction -- there's no analog HD input either.

The Sony and JVC decks have no way to input a high-def signal, except through firewire. You cannot do a high-def dub to any HDV deck, unless you first convert it to HDV MPEG-2 and then input it through the firewire port.
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Old August 4th, 2005, 02:02 AM   #7
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Wow,
another reason why we have the Z1 but still holding back on a deck.


Aynone knows then, what will be the best way to go from HDV back to HDcam ? Is this possibly the best way? : Final Cut and output it via HD-SDI with a Blackmagic card (which we dun have) to HDcam (which we dun have a deck either, and have to go to blackmagic - is this how they will process out HDV tapes) ?

Aren't the analogue component outputs from the z1 itself, uncompressed ? are are we able to hook that up to a deck HD-sdi ? Timecodes will be different I suppose ?

We shot / are shooting a doco for Nat Geo and have done both cinealta and Z1 and want to cut both together in the final online edit.
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Old August 4th, 2005, 08:20 AM   #8
 
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Convert your m2t immediately to 4:2:2 YUV, and edit in this format. Do not edit in the m2t format. Don't use the AIC.
You'll have to do one of two things;
Rent an HDCAM deck, or take an external drive to a facility where they can dump to HDCAM for you.

The analog outputs from the Z1 are indeed uncompressed, but if they're after tape (playing back recorded media) they already have the MPEG 2 compression applied. This isn't a problem, and it actually looks better to capture the media via HD/SDI if you have an HD component I/O on your system.
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Old August 4th, 2005, 11:57 AM   #9
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Aren't the component analog outputs of a Z1 downconverting to a DV signal, or are they really passing an HDV signal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle
The analog outputs from the Z1 are indeed uncompressed, but if they're after tape (playing back recorded media) they already have the MPEG 2 compression applied. This isn't a problem, and it actually looks better to capture the media via HD/SDI if you have an HD component I/O on your system.
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Old August 4th, 2005, 12:35 PM   #10
 
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no, they are a 4:2:2 analog output. So, if you want to capture HD without ever hitting the mpeg compression, carry along a big desktop with a BlackMagic, Kona, or BlueFish card and SCSI/SATA RAID that can handle the stream, and you've got a monster camera/recording rig for HD. There are a lot of current bushes in the field with which you can plug in that computer. :-)
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Old August 4th, 2005, 12:36 PM   #11
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You could also buy the Miranda HDV to HDSDI box. About $2K.

Even though the component analogs out on the camera are uncompressed that really only counts if you are outputting direct from the camera. If you coming off the tape, the signal has already been encoded with HDV. In that case, all you're doing is going D->A and then A->D to get back to HDSDI.
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Old August 5th, 2005, 11:29 AM   #12
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yeah I saw the miranda box at Broadcast Asia 05 couple of months back. but they didn't have a price for us then.
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Old August 5th, 2005, 11:32 AM   #13
 
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Have you looked at the HDV Connect or HD Connect from Convergent Design? Very intelligent boxes for a little less than the Miranda
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