Rolling shutter example at DVinfo.net

Slobodan Milivojevic Bobansky · June 16th, 2008, 08:09 AM

Hi,
for those that don't know how rolling shutter problem looks,
please take a look at this clip.
U should see big white squares when somebody flashes with photo camera.

www.bobansky.com/rolling_shutter.wmv

Scott Hayes · June 16th, 2008, 08:58 AM

it really isn't that bad. flash is flash, and I doubt they will notice it. what were
settings? gain, shutter?

Slobodan Milivojevic Bobansky · June 16th, 2008, 09:10 AM

Shutter 300, with no gain, but full iris opened

Steve Gerhart · June 16th, 2008, 02:11 PM

First thanks for taking the time to post Slobodan,
I have been using sony for a long time back when the V5000's were hot and feel my Sony 400L cameras are the best I have ever used at weddings but I cant use a cmos rolling shutter for weddings so now I am thinking of Panasonic

Bruce G. Cleveland · June 16th, 2008, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hayes

it really isn't that bad. flash is flash, and I doubt they will notice it. what were
settings? gain, shutter?

I agree Scott and I thought this was a dead subject by now. I just did a wedding Saturday with 2 photogs and lots of flashes. Unless you know aobut what to look for, they just look like ordinary flashes. Annoying.

Bruce

Andy Wilkinson · June 16th, 2008, 03:01 PM

Since this subject has come up yet again...

I read somewhere on here a while ago that a very effective/easy fix in post for this (and I really wish I could find the original thred!) is to simply overlay a semi-transparent white screen for the frame or two that's affected. Then it looks like perfectly normal flash (i.e the whole frame is white for a millisecond). As always, knowing what to do is the key (thank you again DVinfo community!). It only takes a few seconds to do - unless I guess you're covering a big event with hundreds of flashes going off.

Some poeple seem very irritated by this rolling shutter effect, others (like me) generally just accept it and learn to ignore it. That's OK, we're all different.

Ron Priest · June 16th, 2008, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Wilkinson

Since this subject has come up yet again...Some poeple seem very irritated by this rolling shutter effect, others (like me) generally just accept it and learn to ignore it. That's OK, we're all different.

Well I'm glad it's come up since Im in the middle of trying to make a purchase decision between a Z1 and a Z7 and here is my thought of the problem. It looks more like a problem with the video than a flash. At least with an non-rolling shutter camera the flash covers the whole screen, that looks like a flash, but with the rolling shutter and just a portion of the screen is white it doesn't look normal, it looks like an electrical interference in the video.

Just my 2 cents.

John Knight · June 16th, 2008, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Priest

....trying to make a purchase decision between a Z1 and a Z7

You are kidding us right?

Scott Hayes · June 16th, 2008, 10:05 PM

hahaha, no he's not. I am trying to get him to buy my Z1 so i can buy a Z7 :-)

By the way, here is a great example of CCD flash on a Z1

Ryan Valle · June 16th, 2008, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Priest

Well I'm glad it's come up since Im in the middle of trying to make a purchase decision between a Z1 and a Z7 and here is my thought of the problem. It looks more like a problem with the video than a flash. At least with an non-rolling shutter camera the flash covers the whole screen, that looks like a flash, but with the rolling shutter and just a portion of the screen is white it doesn't look normal, it looks like an electrical interference in the video.

Just my 2 cents.

Because of this rolling shutter issue, my decision falls between the XH-A1 and the Z7. Also low light is another question i have between the two cameras, but thats mentioned on a different post.

I have seen Z1 footage and I am just not happy with its quality.

Scott Hayes · June 16th, 2008, 10:29 PM

I have been shooting Z1 for the last 4 years, and it's quality is great. The A1 is a great camera as well. It is a workhorse, durable and very dependable, as is most
Sony gear.

Ryan Valle · June 16th, 2008, 11:27 PM

Yeah, the quality of the picture on the Z1 is good, but i think for the price, the XH-A1 produces a better image than that Sony. I read that the image quality between the A1 and the Z7 are quite close though, so really its a question of if you have the money for the Z7 and if you need/want a larger screen, memory card recorder, and interchangeable lens. But that's all my opinion and others can easily disagree with me.

Scott Hayes · June 17th, 2008, 05:34 AM

I won't disagree with you on the A1. I shoot with one at work, and at first I
didn't like it, but after tweaking image settings, I have grown to really like the camera!
It really is the best HDV camera on the market for the price, hands down.

Robert Bec · June 17th, 2008, 05:42 PM

Hold on guys Sony will be releasing a new camera in September which is around the same size as the Z7 and not cmos but CCD.
I heard this from a person inside Sony and a JVC rep they are also releasing a new camera around the same time

Scott Hayes · June 17th, 2008, 08:19 PM

Um, i think it is the EX3, and will be at a HIGHER price point than the Z7.

June 16th, 2008, 08:09 AM	#1
Slobodan Milivojevic Bobansky New Boot Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: kragujevac, serbia Posts: 19	Rolling shutter example Hi, for those that don't know how rolling shutter problem looks, please take a look at this clip. U should see big white squares when somebody flashes with photo camera. www.bobansky.com/rolling_shutter.wmv

June 16th, 2008, 09:10 AM	#3
Slobodan Milivojevic Bobansky New Boot Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: kragujevac, serbia Posts: 19	answr Shutter 300, with no gain, but full iris opened

June 16th, 2008, 03:01 PM	#6
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	fix for rolling shutter in post Since this subject has come up yet again... I read somewhere on here a while ago that a very effective/easy fix in post for this (and I really wish I could find the original thred!) is to simply overlay a semi-transparent white screen for the frame or two that's affected. Then it looks like perfectly normal flash (i.e the whole frame is white for a millisecond). As always, knowing what to do is the key (thank you again DVinfo community!). It only takes a few seconds to do - unless I guess you're covering a big event with hundreds of flashes going off. Some poeple seem very irritated by this rolling shutter effect, others (like me) generally just accept it and learn to ignore it. That's OK, we're all different. __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production

June 16th, 2008, 10:05 PM	#9
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	Z1 CCD flash hahaha, no he's not. I am trying to get him to buy my Z1 so i can buy a Z7 :-) By the way, here is a great example of CCD flash on a Z1 Attached Thumbnails

June 16th, 2008, 08:58 AM	#2
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	it really isn't that bad. flash is flash, and I doubt they will notice it. what were settings? gain, shutter?

June 16th, 2008, 02:11 PM	#4
Steve Gerhart Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Jim Thorpe PA Posts: 34	First thanks for taking the time to post Slobodan, I have been using sony for a long time back when the V5000's were hot and feel my Sony 400L cameras are the best I have ever used at weddings but I cant use a cmos rolling shutter for weddings so now I am thinking of Panasonic

June 16th, 2008, 10:29 PM	#11
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	I have been shooting Z1 for the last 4 years, and it's quality is great. The A1 is a great camera as well. It is a workhorse, durable and very dependable, as is most Sony gear.

June 16th, 2008, 11:27 PM	#12
Ryan Valle Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: North Hills, CA Posts: 40	Yeah, the quality of the picture on the Z1 is good, but i think for the price, the XH-A1 produces a better image than that Sony. I read that the image quality between the A1 and the Z7 are quite close though, so really its a question of if you have the money for the Z7 and if you need/want a larger screen, memory card recorder, and interchangeable lens. But that's all my opinion and others can easily disagree with me.

June 17th, 2008, 05:34 AM	#13
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	I won't disagree with you on the A1. I shoot with one at work, and at first I didn't like it, but after tweaking image settings, I have grown to really like the camera! It really is the best HDV camera on the market for the price, hands down.

June 17th, 2008, 05:42 PM	#14
Robert Bec Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 358	Hold on guys Sony will be releasing a new camera in September which is around the same size as the Z7 and not cmos but CCD. I heard this from a person inside Sony and a JVC rep they are also releasing a new camera around the same time

June 17th, 2008, 08:19 PM	#15
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	Um, i think it is the EX3, and will be at a HIGHER price point than the Z7.