AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate?

Craig Marshall · June 14th, 2013, 08:03 PM

Ron, you would do better to download the Pro 64bit version whilst the 30 day free trial is in place as the Free version has only very limited codec support. That is, with only the 'Free' version, you will need to transcode first as license fees for most popular codecs need to be paid - eg: to Dolby Labs for AC3 as they 'own' it.

Note: If you need AC3 audio support in Lightworks, just install the 'AC3Filter' and configure it for stereo or 5.1 surround.

PS: Do watch the video tutorials first as it will make your evaluation more informed and may I suggest you direct any Lightworks specific questions to the Lightworks Forum, which I'm sure you will find extremely helpful.

Ron Evans · June 14th, 2013, 09:20 PM

Yes I have downloaded the Pro64bit version and will look at the tutorials.

Ron Evans

Ron Evans · June 26th, 2013, 01:34 PM

Craig, I have had a week or so now to look at Lightworks and see the background in film editing clearly. The asset management is clearly a strong point as would be the case managing film stock etc. For someone used to the modern approach of dragging assets from explorer to the timeline and exporting it seems a little dated. My projects are all multicam and I found the multicam convoluted compared to either Edius or Vegas. The marketing also seems to be ignorant of competitors capabilities too. I really didn't see anything unique that wasn't in the editors I have, CS6, Vegas and Edius The user interface is a lot cleaner in these editors too as the Lightworks interface looks like it was designed for much lower resolution monitors , which might have been needed several years ago. I think that LIghtworks is playing catchup to the modern NLE's it is clearly a solid performer but lacks some of the modern looks. I will stay with Edius and Vegas I think.

Ron Evans

Craig Marshall · June 26th, 2013, 04:44 PM

Ron, each to his own I guess but I would disagree on a couple of points. Even though Lightworks offers basic colour correction, dissolves, wipes and DVE moves, it is principally a professional 'editor' where most 'effects' are still commissioned out to third party specialists. Current Lightworks users seem to fall into two distinct groups:

1) Professional programme and feature Editors working in a 10 bit domain who generally Deliver an EDL or a DPX sequence on to other specialists.

2) hobbyists and semi professional users who Shoot, Produce and Deliver in the 8 bit domain.

There are probably a lot of features and shortcuts you missed in only a short evaluation and as I wrote before, Lightworks software was designed around a dedicated hardware control surface (the Console) and in my opinion, any evaluation performed without at least using a Contour Shuttle Pro 11 or similar would be a pretty futile exercise. Lightworks will 'work' with a mouse but it immediately becomes 'alive' with a custom programmed Jog/Shuttle device.

I note on the Lightworks Forum many editors migrating from Avid Media Composer over to Lightworks and their reaction has been the same: once they become accustomed to Lightwork's different methods, the big plus is speed of editing at a very low subscription price point. I have posted your comments on the Lightworks Forum (anonymously, under my avatar) so that others may offer their opinions and reactions to your evaluation as many of the regular Forum contributors also work with CS6, FCP and Edius.

PS: To preserve all possible 8 bit picture quality, I'm currently performing all my post production in the 10 bit domain. My current 10 bit AVCHD Lightworks workflow is:

1) Transcode 8 bit AVCHD to 10bit DNxHD 185 with timecode using AWPro
2) Set up a 10 bit Lightworks Project and edit.
3) Export a 10 bit DPX sequence Master video file
4) Export a 16 track 24 bit WAV file Master audio file

5) For BluRay 5.1 Delivery, I Export an uncompressed 8 bit YUYV sub master AVI file with twelve to sixteen separate audio tracks, bypassing Lightworks internal audio mixer. This is then imported into Vegas Studio for mixing to 5.1 Surround and burn to BluRay disk.

Ron Evans · June 26th, 2013, 06:03 PM

Craig
I need more than a simple editor for my work and I do indeed use a Shuttle Pro V2 set up so that it works the same way in all the programs I use since they all allow custom setup of these control features. My main programs are Edius, Vegas, DVD Architect, AE, Photoshop, Sound Forge, TMPGenc etc so my work flow is easy. I like working with a combination of the Shuttle and the mouse and rarely use the keyboard. The custom keyboard was something I used way back with the Fast Video Machine and I have moved on from there. Shuttle in left hand, mouse in the right hand is very fast. I agree to each is own but I see nothing special in Lightworks that would make me want to look any closer.

Ron Evans

Noa Put · June 27th, 2013, 01:45 AM

Everytime lightworks is mentioned I see Craig trying to tell us why we are wrong not to use it :) I just read some responses on the lightworks forum and the comment "You will never win the argument with that type of person." gave me a uncomfortable feeling I get on other fan based fora. Not sure if it was ok for Ron that you placed his comments there and I don't understand why you should unless you are really trying to prove him wrong with the help of other lightwork users. I also think we are going off topic too much as it is about the advantages of converting into intermediate codecs.

Ron Evans · June 27th, 2013, 07:37 AM

Craig, I have to agree with Noa. What are you trying to achieve with bringing up Lighworks all the time. In my comparison to cars its like asking someone who has several modern cars with air conditioning, heaters, electric windows etc etc to please look at a car with manual windows, no heater or air conditioning and convince them it is reliable though. Lightworks may well work very well as a simple editor but it doesn't cut it against the competition yet. It doesn't do anything more as an editor either than any of the others.The only way to compete with the competition is by price and in this regard its a winner accept it doesn't do what I want and there are lots of programs at $60 that I also do not want. Price is the thing that their marketing has got correct. To me they are trying to breath life into an old program I wish them luck.

Ron Evans

Noa Put · June 27th, 2013, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marlon Martins

new version!

Hey Marlon, I tried the newer version and it works ok but I still get that popup message that it can't find drives, not that it is annoying, I just have to press ok until it finds the card in my reader and from there all seems to work like it should. I thought I"d mention it.

Marlon Martins · June 27th, 2013, 07:54 PM

you uninstalled the previous version as mentioned before installing the new one?

the code is different, should not have that anymore...

Marlon Martins · July 28th, 2013, 01:04 PM

"new version" will be out soon.

-removed encoding functions to a separated program
-added free space verification before file copy
-added size verification, to make sure everything is copied (compare file sizes in card/hard drive to make sure they match)
-added log function (show on the end of copy) for debug/error reporting

todo:
checksum verification option for integrity check

June 14th, 2013, 08:03 PM	#46
Craig Marshall Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Blue Mountains, Australia Posts: 170	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Ron, you would do better to download the Pro 64bit version whilst the 30 day free trial is in place as the Free version has only very limited codec support. That is, with only the 'Free' version, you will need to transcode first as license fees for most popular codecs need to be paid - eg: to Dolby Labs for AC3 as they 'own' it. Note: If you need AC3 audio support in Lightworks, just install the 'AC3Filter' and configure it for stereo or 5.1 surround. PS: Do watch the video tutorials first as it will make your evaluation more informed and may I suggest you direct any Lightworks specific questions to the Lightworks Forum, which I'm sure you will find extremely helpful. Last edited by Craig Marshall; June 14th, 2013 at 08:34 PM.

June 14th, 2013, 09:20 PM	#47
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Yes I have downloaded the Pro64bit version and will look at the tutorials. Ron Evans

June 26th, 2013, 01:34 PM	#48
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Craig, I have had a week or so now to look at Lightworks and see the background in film editing clearly. The asset management is clearly a strong point as would be the case managing film stock etc. For someone used to the modern approach of dragging assets from explorer to the timeline and exporting it seems a little dated. My projects are all multicam and I found the multicam convoluted compared to either Edius or Vegas. The marketing also seems to be ignorant of competitors capabilities too. I really didn't see anything unique that wasn't in the editors I have, CS6, Vegas and Edius The user interface is a lot cleaner in these editors too as the Lightworks interface looks like it was designed for much lower resolution monitors , which might have been needed several years ago. I think that LIghtworks is playing catchup to the modern NLE's it is clearly a solid performer but lacks some of the modern looks. I will stay with Edius and Vegas I think. Ron Evans

June 26th, 2013, 04:44 PM	#49
Craig Marshall Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Blue Mountains, Australia Posts: 170	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Ron, each to his own I guess but I would disagree on a couple of points. Even though Lightworks offers basic colour correction, dissolves, wipes and DVE moves, it is principally a professional 'editor' where most 'effects' are still commissioned out to third party specialists. Current Lightworks users seem to fall into two distinct groups: 1) Professional programme and feature Editors working in a 10 bit domain who generally Deliver an EDL or a DPX sequence on to other specialists. 2) hobbyists and semi professional users who Shoot, Produce and Deliver in the 8 bit domain. There are probably a lot of features and shortcuts you missed in only a short evaluation and as I wrote before, Lightworks software was designed around a dedicated hardware control surface (the Console) and in my opinion, any evaluation performed without at least using a Contour Shuttle Pro 11 or similar would be a pretty futile exercise. Lightworks will 'work' with a mouse but it immediately becomes 'alive' with a custom programmed Jog/Shuttle device. I note on the Lightworks Forum many editors migrating from Avid Media Composer over to Lightworks and their reaction has been the same: once they become accustomed to Lightwork's different methods, the big plus is speed of editing at a very low subscription price point. I have posted your comments on the Lightworks Forum (anonymously, under my avatar) so that others may offer their opinions and reactions to your evaluation as many of the regular Forum contributors also work with CS6, FCP and Edius. PS: To preserve all possible 8 bit picture quality, I'm currently performing all my post production in the 10 bit domain. My current 10 bit AVCHD Lightworks workflow is: 1) Transcode 8 bit AVCHD to 10bit DNxHD 185 with timecode using AWPro 2) Set up a 10 bit Lightworks Project and edit. 3) Export a 10 bit DPX sequence Master video file 4) Export a 16 track 24 bit WAV file Master audio file 5) For BluRay 5.1 Delivery, I Export an uncompressed 8 bit YUYV sub master AVI file with twelve to sixteen separate audio tracks, bypassing Lightworks internal audio mixer. This is then imported into Vegas Studio for mixing to 5.1 Surround and burn to BluRay disk.

June 26th, 2013, 06:03 PM	#50
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Craig I need more than a simple editor for my work and I do indeed use a Shuttle Pro V2 set up so that it works the same way in all the programs I use since they all allow custom setup of these control features. My main programs are Edius, Vegas, DVD Architect, AE, Photoshop, Sound Forge, TMPGenc etc so my work flow is easy. I like working with a combination of the Shuttle and the mouse and rarely use the keyboard. The custom keyboard was something I used way back with the Fast Video Machine and I have moved on from there. Shuttle in left hand, mouse in the right hand is very fast. I agree to each is own but I see nothing special in Lightworks that would make me want to look any closer. Ron Evans

June 27th, 2013, 01:45 AM	#51
Noa Put Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Posts: 9,509	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Everytime lightworks is mentioned I see Craig trying to tell us why we are wrong not to use it :) I just read some responses on the lightworks forum and the comment "You will never win the argument with that type of person." gave me a uncomfortable feeling I get on other fan based fora. Not sure if it was ok for Ron that you placed his comments there and I don't understand why you should unless you are really trying to prove him wrong with the help of other lightwork users. I also think we are going off topic too much as it is about the advantages of converting into intermediate codecs.

June 27th, 2013, 07:37 AM	#52
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,220	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? Craig, I have to agree with Noa. What are you trying to achieve with bringing up Lighworks all the time. In my comparison to cars its like asking someone who has several modern cars with air conditioning, heaters, electric windows etc etc to please look at a car with manual windows, no heater or air conditioning and convince them it is reliable though. Lightworks may well work very well as a simple editor but it doesn't cut it against the competition yet. It doesn't do anything more as an editor either than any of the others.The only way to compete with the competition is by price and in this regard its a winner accept it doesn't do what I want and there are lots of programs at $60 that I also do not want. Price is the thing that their marketing has got correct. To me they are trying to breath life into an old program I wish them luck. Ron Evans

June 27th, 2013, 07:54 PM	#54
Marlon Martins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Torres, Brazil Posts: 115	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? you uninstalled the previous version as mentioned before installing the new one? the code is different, should not have that anymore...

July 28th, 2013, 01:04 PM	#55
Marlon Martins Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Torres, Brazil Posts: 115	Re: AE50 - Do you convert to intermediate? "new version" will be out soon. -removed encoding functions to a separated program -added free space verification before file copy -added size verification, to make sure everything is copied (compare file sizes in card/hard drive to make sure they match) -added log function (show on the end of copy) for debug/error reporting todo: checksum verification option for integrity check