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Sony NXCAM / AVCHD Camcorders
Sony HXR-NX100, HXR-NX70, NX30, NX5, NX3/1, HXR-MC2500, HDR-AX2000, etc.


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Old April 5th, 2010, 10:14 PM   #1
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Nx5u & fcp

First I'd like to say thank you to all for the great info found here.

I received my NX5U about two weeks ago (External H/D on back order). So with out the external H/D I can only capture in one resolution on SD card.

I shoot breaking news as a independent (stringer) for local news stations.

So with this in mind I am having a issue with my customers that use FCP that at this point I am forced to go back to shooting with my DVX100B. I am not a pro editor and have no time on a Apple/FCP system. This makes it difficult for me to trouble shoot or offer solutions to fix the problems. Shooting 1080/60i HD w/video out down covert 720p/480i at the local Fox station the video after capture and edit jumps as though 3 frames out of 5 were dropped. After about 3 hours of trying to capture different ways we were able to by using SDI Out into their remote server. So to be safe I changed the res to 480/60i and now no audio is present on a FCP system. Today I went to the local Spanish station using FCP and captured a sample clip with no audio present. We ended up transferring to tape via RCA jacks.

I've come to the conclusion the NX5U AVCHD uses a .mts file extension that FCP does not recognize. But I have no idea why mpeg-2 SD 480/60i will not capture the audio.

Again RCA jacks to tape no problems but direct transfer via camera or sd card w/o camera in a FCP system seems not to work AVCHD or mpeg-2.

Audio out is set to Dolby as PCM did not work on any NLE Apple or PC.

I hope this is enough info to get some answers to help solve the FCP issues I've run into.

I plan on a post to address my impressions Pro vs Con of the NX5U.

John Mulvihill

619Media.com

Last edited by John Mulvihill; April 5th, 2010 at 10:15 PM. Reason: Caps
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Old April 5th, 2010, 10:32 PM   #2
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I deal with this issue all the time - the video editors at our newspapers edit with Premiere Pro on the PC and the video editors at our partner TV station use FCP on the Mac.

For $30 I bought the Moyea MTS Converter for my Windows laptop. This software will convert .MTS files into several popular formats, including Quicktime for use in FCP. I'm surprised your clients don't have a file-conversion program. I'm sure you're not the first freelancer to shoot with a non-Mac-friendly camera.
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Old April 5th, 2010, 10:43 PM   #3
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Hello John,

I do not have any issues bringing HD files captured with my NX5U to Final Cut Pro.

It is recommended to have the audio set to Dolby, PCM seems to have an issue as it is taking longer to import clips.

How are you bringing your XN5U AVCHD file into FCP, are you using "Log and Transfer" ? If not, that is probably your issue.

Hope it helps!
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Old April 6th, 2010, 12:00 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherri Nestico View Post
I deal with this issue all the time - the video editors at our newspapers edit with Premiere Pro on the PC and the video editors at our partner TV station use FCP on the Mac.

For $30 I bought the Moyea MTS Converter for my Windows laptop. This software will convert .MTS files into several popular formats, including Quicktime for use in FCP. I'm surprised your clients don't have a file-conversion program. I'm sure you're not the first freelancer to shoot with a non-Mac-friendly camera.
Thanks for the reply.

As far as conversion programs are concerned you would think that all TV station should be able to convert almost any format. Part of the problem is the person doing the capture not wanting to be bothered and or having the ability/understanding. The other issue is not being my systems I have little control over what programs are on the customers computers. On top of that if I do the conversion then there is a real virus issue once the files are converted/processed in my computer even though Apples are less prone to infection. This will be a option I will present to them.

AVI files are what I've been using over the last couple of years but the time has come to untangle the HD issues.
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Old April 6th, 2010, 12:03 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Paquin View Post
Hello John,

I do not have any issues bringing HD files captured with my NX5U to Final Cut Pro.

It is recommended to have the audio set to Dolby, PCM seems to have an issue as it is taking longer to import clips.

How are you bringing your XN5U AVCHD file into FCP, are you using "Log and Transfer" ? If not, that is probably your issue.

Hope it helps!
Due to my lack of knowledge with FCP I have no idea but will find out and report back ASAP.

Thanks, John
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Old April 6th, 2010, 10:06 AM   #6
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John,

Are you working on a Macintosh system?

If you are trying to bring in the MPEG2 files that are SD into FCP you will need to convert them to DV streams. FCP does not work with MPEG2 files. It will see the video but the audio is missing. I use a program called MPEG Streamclip to convert the file to a DV Stream.

As for FCP and HD you need to Use log and transfer to bring the files into FCP.

If you are using a Macintosh system and you do not want to go through FCP and want to make the HD files (AVCHD) available to other systems you can also use Toast Titanium 10.0 to convert the files. It can convert into HDV, or many CODECs under QT that other editors can import.

Toast 10 also as a function to back-up the AVCHD files to DVD and it will span the file across multiple DVD's. This is a low cost way yo archive footage.

Hope this helps.

Steve
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Old April 6th, 2010, 10:23 AM   #7
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John

Unfortunately, you are correct about the technical people not wanting to be bothered and/or not understanding what to do. That's unfortunate, but that's the reality in the shrinking newsrooms. As far as viruses being exchanged, I would think a TV station would have a network anti-virus program installed to protect its computers from such threats. We have a corporate anti-virus program and I get video from freelancers on DVDs, thumb drives and through FTP - never had a problem.

I can tell you too from experience that in my position, I'd rather work with a freelancer that presents me with a video format I can use immediately. So I would encourage you to offer to do the conversion yourself.
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Old April 6th, 2010, 09:17 PM   #8
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Keep in mind my working knowledga of FCP is equal to my knowledge of Chinese. I am of course assuming the basics of editing software is fundamentally the same.

What I've learned last night from my customers is the Log & Capture is being used instead of Log & Transfer. I have forwarded this link to the local Fox station for there review.


Here is a link I found with step by step instructions on AVCHD & FCP.

EventDV.net: The Event Videographer's Resource
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Old April 6th, 2010, 09:42 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Sherri Nestico View Post
John

Unfortunately, you are correct about the technical people not wanting to be bothered and/or not understanding what to do. That's unfortunate, but that's the reality in the shrinking newsrooms. As far as viruses being exchanged, I would think a TV station would have a network anti-virus program installed to protect its computers from such threats. We have a corporate anti-virus program and I get video from freelancers on DVDs, thumb drives and through FTP - never had a problem.

I can tell you too from experience that in my position, I'd rather work with a freelancer that presents me with a video format I can use immediately. So I would encourage you to offer to do the conversion yourself.
Thank you for your insight. The local ABC affiliate editors state that "using external drives from outside sources is ground for dismissal". I've also had a finger drive confiscated at a independent station by the IP department.

This is why I bought the NX5U as to make the xfer faster and easier but so far it's been everything but. I do believe that will change once we get the bugs worked out.

I am always trying to improve the way video gets delivered. I was going to do FTP xfer from my internet connected laptop from my vehicle. The big issue from tape was the time it takes to ingest, edit and then upload vs a physical delivery. Throw in airtime deadlines and it just did not make sense when you add in bandwidth ($$$) limitations.

I was also uploading a sample clip of news events with most audio disabled on the web site but it seemed to only benefit one customer who rarely buys anyways. Time + Effort = Zero.

As I am sure you know every TV station wants it first. So I make my decision who gets what when by location, air time and last but not least how good (volume) of a customer they are.

John
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Old April 7th, 2010, 12:44 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Fox View Post
John,

Are you working on a Macintosh system?

If you are trying to bring in the MPEG2 files that are SD into FCP you will need to convert them to DV streams. FCP does not work with MPEG2 files. It will see the video but the audio is missing. I use a program called MPEG Streamclip to convert the file to a DV Stream.

As for FCP and HD you need to Use log and transfer to bring the files into FCP.

If you are using a Macintosh system and you do not want to go through FCP and want to make the HD files (AVCHD) available to other systems you can also use Toast Titanium 10.0 to convert the files. It can convert into HDV, or many CODECs under QT that other editors can import.

Toast 10 also as a function to back-up the AVCHD files to DVD and it will span the file across multiple DVD's. This is a low cost way yo archive footage.

Hope this helps.

Steve
Steve, All this info is valuble. This the first time I've heard of mpeg2 having to be converted to be used in FCP. Last night I xfered 2 SD mpeg2 video clips into a two week old FCP system via RCA output into some type of media (RCA, IEEE 1394 and one other type of forgotten input) box with no loss of audio. When I input via camera/sd adapter the audio is lost into the local Fox stations FCP system which has no RCA inputs available. FOX is the only true HD station here so they perfer HD but without the external HD I can only record in one definition. Maybe I can down convert output to SD from HD. Something I will investiagte and report back on.

I hope this info helps someone before making that FX5U purchase. I know it's just a temp problem and all will be worked out in time.

Regards,

John
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Old April 7th, 2010, 07:52 AM   #11
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John
Do you shoot 1280x720P60 on the NX5U or 1080i? The 720P60 may transfer better if that is what they use. With these short programs you could use TMPGenc to change from AVCHD to HDV and give them the short file on a DVD. TMPGenc could also make an MPEG2 file for you too. This problem is an FCP problem so may not go away that quickly depending on how users upgrade to any fix. Since you are on a PC it may be easier to create a MAC friendly file anyway when you archive your original. LPCM audio may be the issue so when you convert it would change to Dolby or layer 2 MPEG anyway and may remove the issue.

Ron Evans
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Old April 7th, 2010, 10:27 AM   #12
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Ron, Thank you for your input. At present I sell between 50 to 70 videos a month. Not a king ransom but I like it and I do it 7 nights a week. I am hoping that since they value the service I offer it will motivate them to do what it takes to get what they want. The time crunch is really my biggest enemy.

Once I receive the external H/D I plan on shooting 1080i on the H/D then down convert the output to 720p/480i. The SD card will be used to record SD. Audio from the HX5U is set to Dolby as PCM has a whole new set of problems.

The mpeg2 conversion to DV stream worked well this morning with no audio loss. I really want to stay away from computer coversion on my PC with the converted files going into the customers network.


I am trying to figure out if SDI-Out may be the real solution for FCP & AVCHD. Meaning less transfer time and rendering.

Hope this makes sense!

John

Last edited by John Mulvihill; April 7th, 2010 at 04:29 PM. Reason: added the missing word "no"
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Old April 7th, 2010, 11:06 AM   #13
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I had no issues with FCP 7 and the NX5U; I'm not sure if FCP 6 will work with it, but I'm guessing maybe since it seems to handle AVCHD (pro and consumer) fine.

My only problem is you capture the data from the SD card into FCP 7 as ProRes 422 clips which makes everything quite large.

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Old April 7th, 2010, 01:41 PM   #14
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John,
You could get a Nano FLash Convergent Design | and record from the HD/SDI any format it records. How are you archiving the shoots? I back up to LTO3 linear data tape. Not sure why you do not want to convert in the PC and deliver what is needed. Have you looked at ProCoder 3 | Grass Valley which will simultaneously deliver several formats very quick.

Ron Evans
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