sharpening the footage at DVinfo.net

Tom Hardwick · August 25th, 2004, 01:39 PM

Well, having owned a VX2000 for 2.5 years I've made a most noticeable difference it the look of my latest wedding shoot. All I did was up the sharpness one notch in the custom presets, and now my full aperture, maximum telephoto portraits (a technique I love using, and find most flattering) have taken on a snap that's seemingly out of all proportion to the small adjustment I've made. In fact it looks so much better I'm tempted to up it
another notch, but am I likely to come unstuck when watching the footage off DVD?

I've looked very carefully at my film and there's nothing like the nasty edge enhancement that Panasonic seem to regularly apply to their camcorder settings. I'm delighted with the improvement, and it's made wide-angle coverage of whole groups also look a lot more acceptable too. It's a very 'video' look in that it's so clean and smooth, but having shot film for years that don't bother me none (as I'm sure some song put it).

tom.

Boyd Ostroff · August 25th, 2004, 03:47 PM

"The mornin' sun when it's in your face really shows your age. But that don't bother me none..." Is that it? Upping the sharpness setting should definitely help to accentuate those facial wrinkles in the mornin' sun. ;-)

VX-2000 Sharpness at default: http://www.greenmist.com/dv/vxsharp/05.JPG
VX-2000 Sharpness at +1: http://www.greenmist.com/dv/vxsharp/04.JPG

Yeah, I can see how that might help in some situations. It's interesting how our tastes for this sort of thing seem to change over the years.

Gints Klimanis · August 25th, 2004, 03:58 PM

I'm new to video, but my job is signal processing.

I'm inclined to avoid any in-camera sharpening. The results in my vx2000 aren't particularly flattering on higher contrast edges.
In-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape. You can always sharpen
on your video editor, and the MPEG2 compression will probably handle that sharpening better then the DV compression. If you do have problems with the minor sharpening in the VX2000, you can always soften/blur your video before going to DVD to kinda undo the sharpening, although the dual of the VX2000 sharpener is probably not offered in any software.

At some point, a video processing program will offer halo-free sharpening. We just have to ask for it.

Tom Hardwick · August 26th, 2004, 12:23 AM

Carli Simon was it Boyd? :-)
Thanks for your input guys. I always feel that my DV footage is the best it's ever going to look, and going out to anything else (DVD, VHS etc) is going to degrade it somewhat.

Interresting to learn that you consider sharpening in post to be 'better' Gints. I've had a look at that too, using my Storm 2's real-time and hugely variable sharp filter. The effects seem subtly different - as if one acts on the DV compression whereas the other is a pure 'edge finder'.

When you say, "in-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape" what do you mean exactly? I watch my footage with a eagle eye, and all I see are improvements. OK, the wrinkles are sharper, but so too are the eyes and the flowers and the jewelery. Everything takes on a new sparkle.

tom.

Boyd Ostroff · August 26th, 2004, 08:14 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Tom Hardwick : Carli Simon was it Boyd? . -->>>

Actually I was thinking of Maggie May by Rod Stewart...

Mike Rehmus · August 26th, 2004, 08:37 AM

DV compression technology was not designed for high-contrast images and tends to create artifacts. Sharpening an image tends to generate contrast discontinuities which don't encode so well.

Gints Klimanis · August 26th, 2004, 03:50 PM

>When you say, "in-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape" what do you mean exactly?

Tom, Mike Rehmus beat me to the answer.

August 25th, 2004, 01:39 PM	#1
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	sharpening the footage Well, having owned a VX2000 for 2.5 years I've made a most noticeable difference it the look of my latest wedding shoot. All I did was up the sharpness one notch in the custom presets, and now my full aperture, maximum telephoto portraits (a technique I love using, and find most flattering) have taken on a snap that's seemingly out of all proportion to the small adjustment I've made. In fact it looks so much better I'm tempted to up it another notch, but am I likely to come unstuck when watching the footage off DVD? I've looked very carefully at my film and there's nothing like the nasty edge enhancement that Panasonic seem to regularly apply to their camcorder settings. I'm delighted with the improvement, and it's made wide-angle coverage of whole groups also look a lot more acceptable too. It's a very 'video' look in that it's so clean and smooth, but having shot film for years that don't bother me none (as I'm sure some song put it). tom.

August 26th, 2004, 08:37 AM	#6
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	DV compression technology was not designed for high-contrast images and tends to create artifacts. Sharpening an image tends to generate contrast discontinuities which don't encode so well. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

August 25th, 2004, 03:47 PM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	"The mornin' sun when it's in your face really shows your age. But that don't bother me none..." Is that it? Upping the sharpness setting should definitely help to accentuate those facial wrinkles in the mornin' sun. ;-) VX-2000 Sharpness at default: http://www.greenmist.com/dv/vxsharp/05.JPG VX-2000 Sharpness at +1: http://www.greenmist.com/dv/vxsharp/04.JPG Yeah, I can see how that might help in some situations. It's interesting how our tastes for this sort of thing seem to change over the years.

August 25th, 2004, 03:58 PM	#3
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	I'm new to video, but my job is signal processing. I'm inclined to avoid any in-camera sharpening. The results in my vx2000 aren't particularly flattering on higher contrast edges. In-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape. You can always sharpen on your video editor, and the MPEG2 compression will probably handle that sharpening better then the DV compression. If you do have problems with the minor sharpening in the VX2000, you can always soften/blur your video before going to DVD to kinda undo the sharpening, although the dual of the VX2000 sharpener is probably not offered in any software. At some point, a video processing program will offer halo-free sharpening. We just have to ask for it.

August 26th, 2004, 12:23 AM	#4
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Carli Simon was it Boyd? :-) Thanks for your input guys. I always feel that my DV footage is the best it's ever going to look, and going out to anything else (DVD, VHS etc) is going to degrade it somewhat. Interresting to learn that you consider sharpening in post to be 'better' Gints. I've had a look at that too, using my Storm 2's real-time and hugely variable sharp filter. The effects seem subtly different - as if one acts on the DV compression whereas the other is a pure 'edge finder'. When you say, "in-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape" what do you mean exactly? I watch my footage with a eagle eye, and all I see are improvements. OK, the wrinkles are sharper, but so too are the eyes and the flowers and the jewelery. Everything takes on a new sparkle. tom.

August 26th, 2004, 08:14 AM	#5
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	<<<-- Originally posted by Tom Hardwick : Carli Simon was it Boyd? . -->>> Actually I was thinking of Maggie May by Rod Stewart...

August 26th, 2004, 03:50 PM	#7
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	>When you say, "in-camera sharpening stresses the DV-compression, which results in a lower quality video on tape" what do you mean exactly? Tom, Mike Rehmus beat me to the answer.