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Old November 4th, 2002, 02:54 PM   #1
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Need a Conversion Lens and Good Microphone for PD150

Hello all,

I am about order PD150 and going to use it on 18th to tape a show. I would like to know if I want a wideangle conversion lens, which one should I get? I got a sony one for my TRV900, and I am pretty satisfied with it.

I also want to purchase a good stereo Microphone. I have At822 but I thought I might be able to do better cause PD150 got 2 XLR and all. I really want good audio (I'll be still making backup audio with Sound Professional Mic with Sony MD NZ1).

If I ended up getting recommendation to use 2 good mic to do stereo, (maybe I'll do X/Y setup) what microphone mount would be good to use with PD150?

Thank you :o)
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Old November 4th, 2002, 07:07 PM   #2
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I have a Century wide angle which I think is just a bit soft when fully zoomed in. But it is certainly secure with the bayonet mount. Very few reflection or distortion problems.

Regarding the microphone, Go to http://www.dplay.com/ and ask Jay Rose. I'd read the FAQs and other info there first.

I think you will like the 150.
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Old November 4th, 2002, 08:41 PM   #3
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Dear Mike,

I can't find the faq section you mentioned... I m browsing through tutorial about attuneator, but I kinda need to get a set of good stereo mic before 18th... i know this might drive you up to wall but any recommendation for picking right mic for loud punk rawk concert?
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Old November 6th, 2002, 12:07 AM   #4
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I'd use a pair of Shure SM81C microphones set up in a cross-configuration mount. They will take an incredible amount of sound pressure and still record good music. They do require Phantom power and are not set up to take an internal battery. (That's one of the reasons I bought the PD-150). So you'd have to either use a mixer or get a phantom power box for around $75.

The downside is they are expensive. About $350 each the last time I checked.

If the sound is really loud, a pair of Shure SM58's ($100 each) would also work. They are dynamic microphones and will take a lot of sound pressure too. But they are not nearly as sensitive as the 81's. So you'd have to get close to the talent.

What else? A set of boundary microphones might also work if you can either mount them on the walls or on the stage itself. These eliminate a lot of the echo you get in large rooms. I have a pair of really good Radio Shack units that I got on ebay for about $70 each. I don't think RS sells them any longer. Shure, Electrovoice and a number of other manufacturers do build them.

Still, I'd try and overcome my shyness and at least get one feed from the club if only to record it on something other than your camera.

Shotguns are not a good choice for this.
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Old November 6th, 2002, 04:47 PM   #5
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i own and use the AT 822 stereo mic that you have to record loud concerts indoors in small clubs with excellent results. the mic handled the spl very well. i read that you have an MD recorder as well? place the mic on a stand in the back center of club hooked to MD and you should be fine < -- only if you cant get a feed from the house board.i im sure the soundguy would have no problems giving you a feed

be sure to use manual rec level on the MD in any situation or you will definiely distort.
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Old November 6th, 2002, 06:15 PM   #6
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Hi Matthew,

have you had a problem someone stealing your dat or md while you are up front taping the show? I wonder if I am too far away from the stage, I would get wired echoing of the venue.

I thought if I get a feed from board, there is no way but use AGC because the sound guy can't be borthered keep checking my tighny recording level and keep adjusting it to make it not clip.

thank you for the response... Where can I buy a micstand that is tall enough to go up above people's head?
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Old November 6th, 2002, 06:43 PM   #7
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to be honest i was able to be with my md recorder at all times for i was not the one video taping the shows and didnt have to worry about theft.i would think that if you were with the band you could be able to secure a place with the club for mic placement. a boom arm would work to get over heads or a table for a regular mic stand but this would depend how the club was laid out . my friend who was videotaoing at the time had contacts with the band etc so there was no problems for any type of setup in the club as long as it wasnt anything to obtrusive. ive never really had an echo problem but then again i am talking really small clubs here. mainly bars that have bands in small towns. ive also experimented with recording in a theater from the projection booth placing the 822 out a projecter window facing down towards the stage with decent results but then again the acoustic environment helped in this situation im sure, even though the mic was not in an ideal location. also ive noticed some pumping and breathing from the AGC when recording loud signals thats why i mostly use manual gain when recording thru the mic in/analog. i set it to peak at about the -12 marker on my sony RZ-55 MD or maybe a little less than that. i always then record the MD straight to tascam cd recorder thru a roland vs880ex multitrack reocorder which has mastering tool kits for a final cd master.
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Old November 6th, 2002, 07:07 PM   #8
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I pretty much have full access to any venue, including place like oh so famous The Filmore in Sanfrancisco. But I don't know if I could talk to sound dude because I don't know him. Since I don't know him, I can't contact him advance and set things up. I guess I need to go to bar and get buzzed up or something and get courage.

I haven't figure out fully where I can get line to patch to soundboard. I know I need dual XRL to mini, Dual RCA to mini headphoe out to mini and all the adaptoers that convers male to female. I have XLR dual. I made it using Y splitter, but splitter is balanced and thing connected to is unbalanced. Where can I get balanced or unbalanced one. someone showed a webpage about it but I couldnt' search and find what I wanted. If you could tell me where you get the line, it's gonna really help... I just make sure I get couple of shot before I talked to the sound dude. I think I m going to wear slutty shirts as well.
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Old November 6th, 2002, 08:50 PM   #9
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One thing about placing a microphone at the back of a venue of any size is that the sound will be out of synch with the video by a half-frame or more. This is according to Jay Rose. Maybe not be an issue unless you are standing in the outer harbor.

I normally put the MD recorder in a fanny pack and hang it on the microphone stand. Tape it with Gaffer's tape and they at least will have to steal the whole thing, stand and all.
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Old November 6th, 2002, 10:30 PM   #10
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FWIW, the wider you go, the softer the image details.

I hope you're going to do a two cam setup if u already have a 900. Use the 900 tight and the 150 wide as it's increased resolution will help hold the details.

There are different preferences about how to shoot something like a concert. If you go off the board, the music is clean but will show any errors. When recording from a room perspective, you get crowd noise which may or may not work in your favor, but will smooth out some of the artists' shortcomings.

Sort of a pick your poison.
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Old November 7th, 2002, 12:53 AM   #11
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Thank you Mike, and JoPhoto,

You guys are so awsome and resorce of amazing knowledge! Heey, why didn't I think of doing 2 camera shot? I have 2, so why don't I... thanks for reminding me that!

What is Gaffer's tape?
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Old November 7th, 2002, 01:15 AM   #12
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Dear Mike,

I looked for SM81C and I only found SM81. Are those 2 the same thing?

And for SM58, product search returned:

SM58-CN Vocal Microphone, Cardioid Dynamic, Tailored Response, 50 Hz to 15 kHz $204.00
Product Page
SM58-LC Vocal Microphone, Cardioid Dynamic $188.00
Product Page
SM58S Vocal Microphone, Cardioid Dynamic, With On-Off Switch $196.00
Product Page
SM58-LCE Vocal Microphone, Cardioid Dynamic, with 5/8-inch to 3/8-inch thread adapter for mounting on European Stands $188.00
Product Page

Which one did you have on your mind?
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Old November 7th, 2002, 11:51 AM   #13
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gaffe tape is like duct tape only it leaves no sticky residue behind when you pull the tape off.

i would use the shure sm57 over the 58 but this is just my opinon. ive used the 57 to record just about everything at some point in time but never really used it for a "room" recording only close micing of vocals and guitar cabinets snares etc.
boundry mics are nice as well we stuck one to the side of a building once outside and it picked up every sound that bounced off the wall like it was miced up close. my friend uses these alot for FOH at a theter with decnt results as well
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Old November 7th, 2002, 01:41 PM   #14
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Gaffer's tape is a cloth-backed tape with a superior adhesive that holds well and comes off most surfaces leaving no tape residue. Even when left for a while. Much better than duct tape.

SM81-C is the Shure designation. I cannot tell if the listing you viewed was erroneous or not. Go to the Shure Web site to confirm model numbers.

SM58 should cost under $100 at a guitar store or B&H. I'd not get a switched version since you can control that from the mixer or camera if you need to and the talent will always fool with it.

The different versions allow you to tailor one for your specific need. Personally, I never want any of the add-ons.

For slightly more money, about $50, you can get the Beta58 which is a slightly improved version of this microphone.
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Old November 7th, 2002, 04:12 PM   #15
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Thank you Mike and matthew s,

I finall found hum stopper but it looks like it needs ac power from wall? Have anyone seen hum stopper that is battery operated... One I saw at B&H that doesn't need power is 1/4 in and 1/4 out so it won't work with XLR or RCA and it's special order :o|
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