Vignette problem - Page 12 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Sony XAVC / XDCAM / NXCAM / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds

Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 28th, 2007, 10:09 PM   #166
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,896
That's fairly normal, it's barrel distortion. You were probably set to full wide 5.8. If you had zoomed in a tad it would of been better.

When I say normal, ideally it would be nice to have no barrel distortion at full wide, but a lot of lenses, even ones that cost more can have a small amount of barrel distortion.

Also, i'm not sure how you captured that frame, but you may want to choose deinterlace (blend) before your screen capture.
I see your post was an interlace capture.
Steven Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 12:35 AM   #167
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 498
Carroll,

Deep focus = far, at or approaching infinity

Shallow focus = near, at or approaching minimum
Eric Pascarelli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 01:28 AM   #168
Old Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 3,529
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Thomas View Post
Could someone who can view Mac created mov files please check this out and see how bad the vignetting shows itsef. Carol said you really have to look to see it. Unfortunately, I have a PC. MAybe perform a screen capture during its worse section.

http://www.clamcamvideo.com/CLAM0004_01_1.mov
Steve? I've downloaded your MOV, and I can not view it through QT? I've got the latest QT installed on my PC, I can play other MOV files without an issue. I can "hear" your file, but the visuals aren't appearing. Same for VLC player too.

Grazie
Graham Bernard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 02:46 AM   #169
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Billericay, England UK
Posts: 4,711
Jason, I think you're right to hold off. Early adopters of the PD170, the JVC101, the Ford Pinto and numerous other examples show that early adopters pay the price, and invariably end up doing the final prototype testing.

It's nothing against the manufacturers, if they waited till every production bug was sorted before releasing a new product we'd still be shooting onto VHS.

tom.
Tom Hardwick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 07:04 AM   #170
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 591
now lets get one thing straight.... it was only the pinto wagon ( estate for you brits ) that had the exploding fuel tank problem..... hehe

I guess there might be some satisfaction in owning something that can be fixed with firmware..... the vignette issue is another issue.

Just a thought.... is it possible that it's a ND filter hanging on the outer edge? or does the EX1 not have the ND filter flags like the Z1?
Christopher Witz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 07:25 AM   #171
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Billericay, England UK
Posts: 4,711
Internal NDs are way, way out of focus, so I'm much more swayed by the thought that it's a tolerance build-up that puts the chip centrelines very slightly off axis. Unlike wide-aperture lens vignetting (where it's not uncommon to have the frame edges 1.5 stops down on the centre) this shows a mechanical problem such as I've just described.

tom.
Tom Hardwick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 07:44 AM   #172
Trustee
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Nicosia, CYPRUS
Posts: 1,080
Guys have you tried the same set up with any other of your cameras?
Did you have any Vignette problem with other models?

Stelios
__________________
My Blog: http://steliosc.blogspot.com
"I hope for nothing, I fear nothing, I am free" Nikos Kazantzakis
Stelios Christofides is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 07:44 AM   #173
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 591
so basically, the lens's image circle is not quite big enough for the chip with the manufacturing tolerance sony has with this cam out of their prestigious cinealta factory? Maybe a miscommunication between fuji and sony on specs?

I do trust that to have a lens do all the magical things this fujinon lens can do... and not have any issues.... is remarkable.

Personally... I'd take a little vignette over softness at one end of the zoom range or the other any day. Heck.... I tend to add a little vignette in post to most things anyways. But.... if I were shooting something critical like paintings or a product on a white cove I'd be a bit bothered. Then again.... I guess an layer in post could overcome the problem with the white cove issue.

Is it just me, or does there seem to be a conspirasy with manufacturers to give us a reason to always feel the next price point of product in there line will fix the problems of the one below it? Almost as if they create a perfect product and then take something away and lower it's price.

sorry for the ramble.... latte kicking in
Christopher Witz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 07:56 AM   #174
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA
Posts: 3,782
What happens next?

I guess this thread can go on for weeks as the back orders are filled and we post our findings.

Now we have to ask the tough questions which none of us here can answer (only Sony).

What will Sony do to fix this (they've gotta know if its widespread it's gonna be a bear)?

Will each user be left to do their own QC to determine what's "acceptable" or will Sony simply repair the cameras regardless of degree of vignetting?

Are those waiting for their pre orders to be fulfilled simply waiting for bum cameras that will need to be turned back in for repair?

What happens if you spot the issue months after receiving the camera?

No need for you folks to answer this. WE need to hear from Sony.

My only comment will be, if it's firmware it'll be relatively painless. If it's hardware there's going to be a lot of shipping back and forth along with repairs and follow up QC. I'd hope Sony is looking at the production line and dealing with it there if it's hardware. I'd rather wait a few more weeks and get a good camera then go through the process of receiving, doing my own QC and sending back.

Now we need to hear from Sony.
Craig Seeman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 08:35 AM   #175
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,896
This is Sony's CineAlta professional camera division. I can't imagine Sony will drag their feet with this issue.

I believe the CineAlta division takes great pride in the highend cameras.

Based on the few cameras we've received here, and the amount of known problem cameras, this is going to be real large.
Steven Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 08:50 AM   #176
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA
Posts: 3,782
Yes, but now the whole thing becomes a business issue which we have to wait to hear from Sony.

The more cameras that ship the more Sony will have to deal with shipping back and repair (unless it's a firmware issue).

For all we know, they may be dealing with it now which is why people are hearing next batches in a couple of weeks rather than a constant output.

The more cameras that get out there the worse the public relations issue becomes. Companies fix and survive these though. Remember the JVC 100 "split screen."

The unanswerable question is, given what has be quantified (and QC'd) by the users on this forum, when and how will Sony act.

Sony must have been aware of this as per Adam Wilt's article so one might also question why the issue persists in the production release. Alas another unanswerable question. I guess the concern is if they were aware of it then how did it get to this stage in release? THAT doesn't instill confidence.

Personally I don't look forward to getting a camera with an issue in two weeks and I don't look forward to having to PROVE to Sony it's an issue regardless of how sever or mild.

I think Sony has a narrow window to fix this. But again maybe they are already given the delays in the next batch.

My wish now is that Sony speak with either words or actions. I dearly you are correct in your assessment Steven.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Thomas View Post
This is Sony's CineAlta professional camera division. I can't imagine Sony will drag their feet with this issue.

I believe the CineAlta division takes great pride in the highend cameras.

Based on the few cameras we've received here, and the amount of known problem cameras, this is going to be real large.
Craig Seeman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 08:59 AM   #177
Contributor
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Pascarelli View Post
Carroll,

Deep focus = far, at or approaching infinity

Shallow focus = near, at or approaching minimum
Thanks, Eric. The sky clip I posted was manually focused at infinity but the iris was at about mid-range. I'll attempt to setup a situation of full-open aperture to repeat the test.

Carroll Lam
Carroll Lam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 09:03 AM   #178
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,896
Thanks Carol.
We're looking forward to your results.
Steven Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 09:19 AM   #179
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Belfast, UK
Posts: 4,121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Pascarelli View Post
Carroll,

Deep focus = far, at or approaching infinity

Shallow focus = near, at or approaching minimum
In cinematography "deep focus" refers to a large depth of field. The best known example is Citizen Kane, but DOP Gregg Toland also used deep focus in other films.

Shallow focus is opposite, a small depth of field: currently fashionable using wide aperture lenses shooting on 35mm or using 35mm adapters on video cameras.

It's quite possible to have a shallow focus on a far subject with the closer objects soft, or a deep focus on a near subject with everything sharp from the subject to infinity.
Brian Drysdale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2007, 09:39 AM   #180
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 498
Brian,

Perhaps in the language of cinema critique, and/or perhaps in the UK.

But I can assure you that on the US film sets I've been working on for the past 20 years, the terminology I use is common.

"Shallow" is perhaps less often used than "close focus."

We'll often refer to "shallow depth of field" but when we say"shallow focus" or "deep focus" I can assure you we are referring to the distance that the lens is set at and not the resultant DoF.
Eric Pascarelli is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Sony XAVC / XDCAM / NXCAM / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:08 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network