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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old March 29th, 2008, 12:26 AM   #1
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Flash XDR

Check this out:
http://convergent-design.com/downloa...20Brochure.pdf
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Old March 29th, 2008, 01:40 AM   #2
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That'll be nice if 1080p30 is not important to you because the EX1 live HD-SDI does not support it.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 03:14 AM   #3
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I checked in the manual and don't find anything to confirm HD-SDI doesn't output certain formats. What I found interesting though, is that the SDI output is a "digital signal of the same format, converted from the component signal" - how can it be 10bit, 4:2:2 ?

Anybody?
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Last edited by Piotr Wozniacki; March 29th, 2008 at 04:30 AM.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 06:17 AM   #4
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You guys crack me up... everything you want to know about Flash XDR is right under your noses:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=102312
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Old March 29th, 2008, 07:04 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Chris Hurd View Post
You guys crack me up... everything you want to know about Flash XDR is right under your noses:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=102312
Chris,

I know all about Flash XDR; I'm on Mike's mailing list and have already paid the deposit for the unit.

Mike Thomann has stated in this thread something new to me about the EX1's HD-SDI output, not about the Flash XDR. Can you enlighten me on which (if any) recording modes are not supported by the EX1's HD-SDI output?
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Old March 29th, 2008, 08:25 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Piotr Wozniacki View Post
I checked in the manual and don't find anything to confirm HD-SDI doesn't output certain formats. What I found interesting though, is that the SDI output is a "digital signal of the same format, converted from the component signal" - how can it be 10bit, 4:2:2 ?
Component isn't digital.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 08:40 AM   #7
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Bob has beaten me to the punch... component is analog.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 08:50 AM   #8
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Component isn't digital.
Gee.... What's up today?

Who said component is digital? I was citing from the user manual, page 116 (for Europe), which states:

"The SDI OUT connector outputs serial digital signals of the same format converted from the analog component signals fed from the COMPONENT OUT connector"

Both this, and Mike's statement earlier in this thread, that "That'll be nice if 1080p30 is not important to you because the EX1 live HD-SDI does not support it" are something new to me, hence my request for clarifying:

1. If SDI is merely the component _CONVERTED_ into digital, can it be true 10bit 4:2:2 (I'm asking, not denying)?
2. Is there really any limitation on the SDI output _FORMATS_ (e.g. 1080/25p)?

I hope my English was clear enough this time :)
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Old March 29th, 2008, 08:57 AM   #9
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You are perfectly clear, Piotr, at least to me. I'd like to know what you ask, too.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 09:45 AM   #10
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An analogue signal can be converted to as many bits and whatever chroma sampling scheme you so desire. Pretty basic engineering there, really.
So the 10bit digital value will be a 10bit digital value representing what's on the analogue signal, it could go to 14bits or even 16bits if you can afford the ADCs. Wouldn't fit down the HD SDI cable of course.

As to your second point, none that I can read about. The progressive formats are sent as PsF for SD, probably to conform to the SMPTE standard. Nothing I can find supports there being no 30p or 29.976p to be precise.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 09:51 AM   #11
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An analogue signal can be converted to as many bits and whatever chroma sampling scheme you so desire. Pretty basic engineering there, really.
So the 10bit digital value will be a 10bit digital value representing what's on the analogue signal, it could go to 14bits or even 16bits if you can afford the ADCs. Wouldn't fit down the HD SDI cable of course.

As to your second point, none that I can read about. The progressive formats are sent as PsF for SD, probably to conform to the SMPTE standard. Nothing I can find supports there being no 30p or 29.976p to be precise.
Thanks Bob - I also got an e-mail from Convergent Design's Mike Schell, confirming again, that - according to numerous Sony sources - it is true 10bit indeed.

My confusion came probably from the fact that - as everyone tends to consider anything digital "better" - I would think it should be the Component signal being a result of conversion from digital, and not vice versa.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 10:20 AM   #12
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Keep in mind that the image sensor block, whether it is CMOS or CCD, is an *analog* device. The SDI and component video outputs are tapped upstream of the camera's A/D converter. I have difficulty accepting the post about 30p not being supported over SDI... that doesn't make sense to me.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 10:32 AM   #13
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Chris is right, it's supported.



It depends on how you have the camera set:
60 (59.94) NTSC
or
50 (PAL)

Page 117 of the manual

1080/30P (29.97P) is supported in the NTSC mode
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Old March 29th, 2008, 02:39 PM   #14
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Chris the sensor is analog, but the A/D definitely comes before the component and SDI outs. The camera's image processing is digital, therefore the signal must be quantized for the camera's processor to combine the R,G and B signals, apply gamma correction, white balance, etc. and all of those things happen before you see the image on any output, including the EVF/LCD. As far as unsupported formats for SDI, I will be able to run a test on Monday when I'm at work, my SDI monitor at home doesn't have a format indicator. SDI is a VERY versatile format, and can handle just about any format you want to send through it.
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Old March 29th, 2008, 02:41 PM   #15
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Thanks for clarifying that, Sean!
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