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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old May 13th, 2008, 12:40 PM   #1
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60p with 87.5MBit/s

When I'm right, then shooting in 720/24p-HQ with maximum overcranking results in a 720/24p-35MBit/s-VBR-Stream with 2.5x slowmotion. But if you would reinterpret it as 60p it would be a 720/60p-87.5MBit/s-VBR-Stream. So you can effectively shot 60p with 87.5MBit/s. Right?
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Old May 13th, 2008, 12:44 PM   #2
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I don't think it works that way. I think it is always 35mb/s when in that mode (I guess because of the VBR it can go up to about 38 I have heard, but that is it). But maybe I am not understanding, and in fact you are correct.

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Old May 13th, 2008, 01:18 PM   #3
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720p24/60 does record at something like 87.5mbps so it will playback in 24fps (actually 23.98) timeline at 35mbps VBR.

On a Mac you'd then need to convert to uncompressed or Apple Pro Res and conform in CinemaTools (although I haven't tried this) to 60fps time base. You'd be into another codec though unless you went back to XDCAM EX which would be 35mbps VBR.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 02:01 PM   #4
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Because the hardware has the ability to process such high bitrates, I guess, sony could realize higher bitrates together with 4:2:2 at 1080p just with a firmware-update. Interesting...
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Old May 13th, 2008, 02:28 PM   #5
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The codec itself might be hardware burned in rather than firmware though.

It does mean that it may be possible for the camera to handle 50mbps but I think it's more complex than a firmware update. You're not seeing this update for the F335/355 either.

My "crystal ball" would be to say you might see this announced for in EX5 at NAB 2009 which might list for something like $20,000 US.

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Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold View Post
Because the hardware has the ability to process such high bitrates, I guess, sony could realize higher bitrates together with 4:2:2 at 1080p just with a firmware-update. Interesting...
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Old May 13th, 2008, 02:38 PM   #6
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You don't need to wait that long though, the Flash XDR will do 100 mb/sec and 4:2:2, shipping soon.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 02:55 PM   #7
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One more thing to attach to the camera. It'll be interesting how all this impacts the price/feature set of new cameras at NAB 2009.

Of course people want their $6449 camera to have this built in to the camera rather than a $5000 add on.

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You don't need to wait that long though, the Flash XDR will do 100 mb/sec and 4:2:2, shipping soon.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 03:23 PM   #8
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I agree that a 50mb EX camera would be nice but to be honest if you take the HDSDi and record it to uncompressed and then compare that with the matching 35Mb files the difference is all but impossible to see visually. It should also be remembered that when you add in the amount of extra data being recorded at 4:2:2 over 4:2:0 the 50Mb 4:2:2 stream is only slightly less compressed than the 4:2:0 35Mb stream.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 03:42 PM   #9
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Alister, I'm wondering if 50mbps 4:2:2 would help in green screen or heavy compositing situations. Natively one wouldn't notice a difference as you allude to.

In studio situation one can certainly take HD-SDI out but I'm thinking of certain "field" situations where 4:2:2 to card might help.
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Old May 13th, 2008, 04:19 PM   #10
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It would be better if a feature was built in rather than having a separate unit, true, but the Flash XDR is a fairly compact bit of kit. Recording to CF cards is nice too as they are pretty cheap.
And it's 100 mb/sec, so even at 4:2:2 that's pretty low compression. I gather they're going for an uncompressed version too?
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