Anybody using Blackmagic Design HDLink or Mini-converter with the EX1? at DVinfo.net

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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
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Old July 16th, 2008, 12:05 AM   #1
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Anybody using Blackmagic Design HDLink or Mini-converter with the EX1?

If so, how do you like it? Does it work as it is supposed to?

Thanks.
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Old July 16th, 2008, 07:22 AM   #2
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I'm using a multibridge, displaying the video in a big 52" Sony Bravia (just to make the "wow!" factor on the customers... and it works!). We had some problems with it until Apple released FCP 6.0.2 which solved most of them.

So far, I'm quite happy with it, it works well for editing XDCAM EX footage, downconverting to SD, or digitizing our old Betacam SP tapes (we have more than ten years of valuable footage that we can't just throw to the garbage just because of the HD hype!).

If you want our advice, it will be of some help if you tell us what use are you intending to make of your HDLink.
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Old July 16th, 2008, 07:54 AM   #3
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Hi,

Using a HDLink to connect the EX1 to either a 24" Samsung LCD panel or a 46" Sony Bravia 46W4000.
Everything is good so far... I just think the signal from the EX1 is converted to interlace as I can see some "interlace defaults" on quick movements... Still have to dig this a little more to understand.
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Old July 16th, 2008, 08:51 AM   #4
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Sebastien, as far as i know, the EX always outputs the 1080 signal as interlaced, even if the camera is set to 1080 progressive modes.

And my multibridge can't output 25p or 30p, in the FAQ they say that they haven't provided support for it because there is not standarisation of 1080 25p or 30p, so it could cause compatibility problems with other equipment. Maybe that's the reason why the EX also outputs progressive in an interlaced form.

In fact, when you feed the multibridge with a 25p sequence in FCP, the image is displayed normally by the Bravia set, so it works as a 25 PsF signal (progressive segmented in fields).
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Old July 16th, 2008, 08:58 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Lorente View Post
Sebastien, as far as i know, the EX always outputs the 1080 signal as interlaced, even if the camera is set to 1080 progressive modes.

And my multibridge can't output 25p or 30p, in the FAQ they say that they haven't provided support for it because there is not standarisation of 1080 25p or 30p, so it could cause compatibility problems with other equipment. Maybe that's the reason why the EX also outputs progressive in an interlaced form.

In fact, when you feed the multibridge with a 25p sequence in FCP, the image is displayed normally by the Bravia set, so it works as a 25 PsF signal (progressive segmented in fields).
In fact I was too short on the explanation.
HD-SDI standard only support interlace (1080i). Of course, progressive images are transfered as 1080 PsF ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progres...egmented_Frame ), as you mentioned. I just imagine that a good converter would de-interlace the resulting signal to full 1080p. I just think this is not the case for the HD-Link.
But this is what I'm not sure :)
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Old July 16th, 2008, 02:24 PM   #6
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I would need either HDLink or the mini converter to allow me to use a 24" DELL as a preview monitor on set and also for color correction in post. This is what the HDlink is made for right? To turn computer LCD monitor like the Cinema displays into video monitors?
But I was told you still can't trust it, even with HDLink or the mini converter. But I thought this what the whole ida behind the products.
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Old July 17th, 2008, 02:32 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Michael Maier View Post
I would need either HDLink or the mini converter to allow me to use a 24" DELL as a preview monitor on set and also for color correction in post. This is what the HDlink is made for right? To turn computer LCD monitor like the Cinema displays into video monitors?
But I was told you still can't trust it, even with HDLink or the mini converter. But I thought this what the whole ida behind the products.
Why can't you trust it ?
THE thing you can't trust is your monitor, until it is calibrated. Then I see no reason not to be able to trust the HD-Link.
Be warned that to use it in post you will need a HD-SDI card in your computer. Then, take some care at the HD-link settings. You can change a lot of things, including gamma curves per channel.
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Old July 17th, 2008, 05:23 AM   #8
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How much better than Component / DVI?

I'm monitoring off a Sharp 32" 1080p TV, mostly in post but I occasionally drag the beast out to the field. I have calibrated the Sharp well I think. Two questions:

1. In the field, how much better is using the HDLink to HDMI rather than component from camera?

2. In post, how much better is Decklink (HD-SDI card) plus HDLink than using FCP's digital cinema preview with my graphics card (ATI Radeon HD 2600)? I have a DVI to HDMI cable, and now prefer this over using the Intensity Pro card (have currently), which is buggy for me and only puts out 1080i.

To refine the question, I'm not doing any high-end compositing, just trying to get a decent sense of brightness and color. Given than I don't have a "real" monitor, how much is gained by the $1400 total to add Decklink and HDLink to my system?

Thanks!
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Old July 17th, 2008, 06:59 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Collins View Post
I'm monitoring off a Sharp 32" 1080p TV, mostly in post but I occasionally drag the beast out to the field. I have calibrated the Sharp well I think. Two questions:

1. In the field, how much better is using the HDLink to HDMI rather than component from camera?
Using HD-SDI you will have only one coaxial cable, that can be 100 meters long. You will get full quality all the line and can chain other display.
Using the component you will have 4 cables (in one, but it's bigger than coaxial), go analogic, have a cable length limit and it may not be possible to chain other devices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Collins View Post
2. In post, how much better is Decklink (HD-SDI card) plus HDLink than using FCP's digital cinema preview with my graphics card (ATI Radeon HD 2600)? I have a DVI to HDMI cable, and now prefer this over using the Intensity Pro card (have currently), which is buggy for me and only puts out 1080i.

To refine the question, I'm not doing any high-end compositing, just trying to get a decent sense of brightness and color. Given than I don't have a "real" monitor, how much is gained by the $1400 total to add Decklink and HDLink to my system?

Thanks!
Can't comment on that. Biggest difference is "what" and "how" you will display.
If you just plug your monitor as a "second monitor" in your card, you will have your monitor configured by the system : gamma, resolution, frequency...
If you plug it in a card compatible with finalcut (decklink, intensity, MXiO...) your monitor will be used as a "real" broadcast monitor, showing exactly what you will output.
I don't have a lot of experiences here, so maybe someone else can give more details ?
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Old July 17th, 2008, 07:23 AM   #10
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HD SDI monitoring.

I use the HD Link fed to an ACD 23" when using a jib. It is mounted on a cart for all the clients to see. My other choice is component out to an IKAN 800HD mounted on the jib. I feel more secure using the HD SDI BNC connector plus my focus is more confident. Calibration is a must and yes you can see interlacing artifacts.
Pixel to pixel viewing is nice and the setup was less than $1,500.
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Old July 18th, 2008, 05:13 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Collins View Post
2. In post, how much better is Decklink (HD-SDI card) plus HDLink than using FCP's digital cinema preview with my graphics card (ATI Radeon HD 2600)? I have a DVI to HDMI cable, and now prefer this over using the Intensity Pro card (have currently), which is buggy for me and only puts out 1080i.
Rob,
Why is your Intensity pro buggy ?
Is this a driver or setting problem ?

I just saw the "Pro" was out and i'm considering it. The idea for me would be to :
- use it for HD capture from the EX1 : EX1 HD-SDI out -> HD-link -> HDMI adapter -> intensity for prores 422 10 bits acquisition
- monitor (play) the movie from FCP to a 46" Sony Bravia TV.

What do you think of this setup ? Do you have any experience ?
I'm shooting 1080p@25 (France), will this be a problem, knowing that HD-SDI only support 1080i. How do you set the card or FCP to stay (rebuild) the progressive frame ?

Thanks.
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Old July 18th, 2008, 06:08 AM   #12
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I got it solely for monitoring, and it's OK. Have never used it to capture.

As for its bugs, I sometimes have to restart the computer to get it to respond (send out video). And it can't play EX 720/24p footage in real time. I do use it for audio and it works well there.
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Old July 18th, 2008, 08:45 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Collins View Post
I got it solely for monitoring, and it's OK. Have never used it to capture.

As for its bugs, I sometimes have to restart the computer to get it to respond (send out video). And it can't play EX 720/24p footage in real time. I do use it for audio and it works well there.
When you say it can't play EX 720p files, do you mean you can't play a FCP timeline defines for XDcamEX 720p footages ?
What if you have XDcamEX 1080p footage ?
What if you are using prores 422 1080p HQ timeline ?
Is the limitation from the CPU or disks or it really from the Intensity ?

Many thanks for your clarifications. I'm kind of lost with problems you can have with such hardware.
Also, i'm sorry to "disturb" this thread. I can open another one if you (Michael) think this have no affair with your first question.

Thanks.
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Old July 19th, 2008, 10:28 AM   #14
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I think I am missing something here (new to the camera). If I output from the camera via component video to a display capable of displaying 720 or 1080 (my video projector), how do I output the audio to a sound system if the A/V output is disabled in the process?

John
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Old July 19th, 2008, 01:05 PM   #15
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I think I am missing something here (new to the camera). If I output from the camera via component video to a display capable of displaying 720 or 1080 (my video projector), how do I output the audio to a sound system if the A/V output is disabled in the process?

John
I think I'll post this as a separate question to see if anyone knows the answer.

John
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