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Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 12:14 AM

EX1 to SD Problem solved!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold (Post 979955)
Why don't you post results you get with your methods together with examples which look great on your tv? I guess it will be possible for us to tell you what you have to do, to let your results look like them.

Dominik (and everyone else who has kindly tried to help me with this) I must apologise for not posting back. I thought I had replied to all threads about my EX1 to DVD issue, but I clearly missed this one.
_______________

This is a copy of my "solution" to the problem I was having converting my EX1 footage to SD for use on DVD:
_______________

At last, thanks to Kevan Holdsworth over on the Apple FCP Forum, I read through the XDCAM Transfer Instruction PDF very carefully and there it was all the time!

XDCAM Transfer is the Sony plugin for importing footage - but it also EXPORTS loads of stuff - including either DV PAL / NTSC @ 48k

OR

IMX50 625 (which is Ancient Dutch for Cracking SD) IMX PAL / NTSC @ 50Mb/s
(Choice of other rates available).

My settings are here:
http://www.workingsheepdog.co.uk/video/picture_01.png

This gives you an XML file which you then Import back into FCP using XDCAM Transfer.
EXCELLENT SD footage!

Dominik Seibold December 18th, 2008 04:18 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Nickless (Post 980122)
IMX50 625 (which is Ancient Dutch for Cracking SD) IMX PAL / NTSC @ 50Mb/s
(Choice of other rates available).

My settings are here:
http://www.workingsheepdog.co.uk/video/picture_01.png

This gives you an XML file which you then Import back into FCP using XDCAM Transfer.
EXCELLENT SD footage!

I tested it with 1080p footage. The left attachment is the xdcam-export result. The right is the Compressor result.
The details in the result of Compressor looks much smoother.
I really can't understand your preference, Andy.

Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold (Post 980184)
The details in the result of Compressor looks much smoother.

I don't know what you mean by "smoother" Dominic.

To me there is very little difference in the two images, but I think the Compressor image is very slightly "sharper" and that is what I'm looking for.
(As a professional photographer, I would interpret "smoother" as meaning "softer").

Would you please tell me what your exact Compressor settings are for this please?
Then I will do more tests and post back.

Thank you for your help.

Dominik Seibold December 18th, 2008 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Nickless (Post 980188)
I don't know what you mean by "smoother" Dominic.

With smoother I mean that the edges have less (actually no) aliasing. I actually would call them softer (but not soft, because Compressor approximates the nyquist-limit very closely).
What kind is your footage of? Is it 1080i? Because Compressor has a bug which prevents it from rescaling interlaced footage correctly, if the output is interlaced, too. If you have 1080i and you want 576i as output you have to do the following workaround:
1. Export with Compressors motion-adaptive deinterlacing and high-quality scaling to progressive 576p50 (Apple ProRes-codec recommended).
2. Convert the result with Compressor to interlaced 576i with your dvd-mpeg2-settings.

If your footage isn't 1080i you can do it as simply as I show it in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSw9JfVmIpI&fmt=22
(you have to skip the first seconds because of a youtube-flash-player bug)

Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold (Post 980194)
If you have 1080i and you want 576i as output you have to do the following workaround.

No all my footage is progressive but if you can give me the full workflow, that will help a lot. Even if there is no difference in quality, it's a lot less hassle to export using compressor - rather than export using XDCAM transfer, then re-ingest as SD, then export again.

Dominik Seibold December 18th, 2008 05:19 AM

sorry, I edited my post after you posted. Read the end of my last post.

Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold (Post 980194)
If your footage isn't 1080i you can do it as simply as I show it in this video:
YouTube - high-quality HD to SD-DVD conversion with FCP
(you have to skip the first seconds because of a youtube-flash-player bug)

Sorry, I didn't notice this link when I made my last post.
I have watched the video and will try your method but I'm sure I've tried this before.

Dominik Seibold December 18th, 2008 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Nickless (Post 980199)
I'm sure I've tried this before.

If you get different/unsatisfying results, please post them here. Perhaps then I can tell you what's going wrong.

Dominik Seibold December 18th, 2008 05:35 AM

Btw, you can export stills from mpeg2-files very easily with mpeg-streamclip (don't forget to select "unscaled" in streamclips frame-export-dialog).

Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold (Post 980200)
If you get different/unsatisfying results, please post them here. Perhaps then I can tell you what's going wrong.

Unfortunately, my version of Compressor (3.0.5) does not allow me to change settings in the DVD MPEG2 presets.

I exported with Custom Compressor setting (to MPEG2) selecting "Best" for rescaling (as I always do).

I must admit, under close examination, the Compressor results are slightly better.
So I don't know how I came to the conclusion that the IMX was better!
I will preserve this custom compressor setting carefully

I will do more tests soon but for now, I really must get back to the project.

Once again, Dominik, thank you for your help.

David Heath December 18th, 2008 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Nickless (Post 980196)
No all my footage is progressive .......

After hearing Dominiks comments about the bug in Compressor not handling 1080i - 576i material well (which I wasn't previously aware of), and after my comments in the other thread, I'd be prepared to make a bet that your problems are down to your material being treated as 1080psf/25, not 1080p/25.

Data wise, the two are identical - the line order is just rearranged. It's quite conceivable that some devices won't distinguish between the two. But although psf material is the same content as p, the reordering means that it must be flagged the same as i - that's the whole reason for it.

Vincent Oliver December 18th, 2008 08:33 AM

Andy,

Glad to hear you now have the results that you were after.

I took delivery of an EX3 yesterday and after having spent several hours trying to render a short test project, I too am not seeing a 6000 advantage in this camera. It works superb in HQ, but like you Andy, I still have to supply my output in bog standard SD format.

I use Premierre Pro CS3 for windows, if anyone has a similar sollution to Andy's, I would appreciate hearing from you.

Many thanks

Andy Nickless December 18th, 2008 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Heath (Post 980250)
I'd be prepared to make a bet that your problems are down to your material being treated as 1080psf/25, not 1080p/25.

David, after I read your post on the Z7 page, I checked the item properties in FCP and sure enough it was 1080p - with Field Dominance "None".

BUT.
If I try to export a QT file as almost anything other than XDCAM EX, it goes out as interlaced - even if I specifically select progressive in the export options.

Any comments welcome!


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