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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old September 23rd, 2008, 01:23 PM   #226
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just ordered a Kensington from Amz.com
will test the Panasonic 8gb when it arrives tomorrow.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 01:35 PM   #227
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Ray, why Kensington and not Cables Unlimited one?

Just wondering, since CU was reported to be a bit faster, and is 2x cheaper.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 01:41 PM   #228
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Although the unlimited may report faster on your PC, it may not be any different in the EX1.

I asked Keith in my last post if he could run a quick test to determine if the Unlimited card is faster in the EX1.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 02:40 PM   #229
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The news keeps coming thick and fast. Sandisk have now announced a 45Mbs Extreme 4 card. This will surely be fast enough for variable frame rates.

SanDisk announces 16GB CFcards: Digital Photography Review

I would also add to this that Pretec are just lanching a 64Gb and 100Gb card!

Continuing the revolution in the field of flash memory card speed and capacity, Pretec today releases 64GB and 100GB, 233X CF cards with access speed of up to 35MB/s, overtaking the Pretec 48GB CF card, the previous world’s record holder for highest capacity CF card; and super high speed 333X 32GB and 50GB CF cards capable of running up to 50 MB per second of Read/Write speed, the highest speed CF card in the world.
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08...b_100gb_cf.asp
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 03:10 PM   #230
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But these are both CF cards - aren't we all talking about SD cards?
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 03:20 PM   #231
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Yes but it won't be long before the technology moves across to SD cards.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 03:48 PM   #232
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Just thought I should let you know the results of my test with the Kensington adapter and Transcend Class 6 8Gb card. The card will record at 720P S&Q 32fps continuously without errors. For short clips you can get up to 40fps, but longer than a few minutes and it throws up media errors. So that means the Transcend 8Gb card is good for 48Mbps. In my opinion thats a reasonable amount of headroom for 35Mbps HQ mode recording. I have some 16Gb cards arriving in the next few days.

I have a shoot this weekend where the client want's to take the rushes away. So I'm shooting on SD cards and will charge them on to the client exactly as I would tapes or discs.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 03:56 PM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Thomas View Post
So Keith,
will the Cables Unlimited Card Reader ExpressCard 34mm (IOC9750) allow the EX1 memory compartment to close?


Here's a quick test to determine if the Cables Unlimited Reader is a bit faster in the EX1:

Set the EX1 to 720 24P S&Q ON at 40 FPS. (Almost half speed)
With the Kensington, I had no errors. I tested it for about 5 minutes.
It failed when S&Q was set to 45.

Check to see if the Cables Unlimited Reader will run at S&Q set to 45. If so, incrementally increase to determine when it fails.

Thanks for the update!
Hi Steven

Unfortunately the Cables Unlimited Reader is physically exactly the same as the Kensington, therefore, no door closure.

I tried with S&Q on 40-45 FPS. I got failures at 40 FPS. On the Kensington it seems error-free at 42FPS at least. So I guess the Cables Unlimited Reader, though a bit faster on the Mac, is not as compatible with the EX1. However, I'm not convinced that the SDHC card speed is completely responsible for the failures at slow motion, higher bitrate storage. Now I'm thinking its a limitation of the EX1's Expresscard USB 2.0 interface. Expresscards have 2 ways of communicating, via the PC-Express Bus, a super-fast bus similar to the internal slots in a modern PC or MAC, or using USB 2.0, which is theoretically very fast but it depends on implementation and other factors. It may explains why the Sony Expresscard hard drive unit doesn't perform well at slow-mo.

So the SOHOUSB expresscard adapter is going back. No need for something that isn't as compatible as the Kensington. So far the Kensington Adapter is the best.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 04:00 PM   #234
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Thanks Alister.
So it appears the SanDisk Extreme III 30M/s verison offers more headroom.
I'm capable of overcranking at 40FPS @ 720 24P.

Tonight, just to test, I'm going to try a SanDisk Ultra II 4GB 15MB/s version.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 04:09 PM   #235
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Yes Steve, I'm guessing the Extreme III cards will have more headroom. I will keep testing the Transcend cards as they are so much cheaper, great for giving to clients. I also think much of the speed restriction is down to the Express USB interface rather than the cards themselves.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 04:19 PM   #236
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I agree.
Based on Sony's PHU-60K which is also not fast enough to run S&Q mode, I have the feeling the problem is how Sony is transferring data though the USB interface via expresscard.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 05:48 PM   #237
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
Yes Steve, I'm guessing the Extreme III cards will have more headroom. I will keep testing the Transcend cards as they are so much cheaper, great for giving to clients. I also think much of the speed restriction is down to the Express USB interface rather than the cards themselves.
The Transcend 8gb card could not read directly to the SD slot on my HP lap top I had to use the express slot with adapter to read in the clips.
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 09:14 PM   #238
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Well, I tested the SanDisk Ultra II 4GB 15MB/s version SDHC with the Kensington 7-in-1 .
It works just like the SanDisk Extreme III. It was also able to overcrank at 40 FPS at 720 24P without an error. So, it has the same amount of headroom the new Extreme memory offers in this combo expresscard/SDHC.

This is GREAT news since 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s cards cost only $60 USD!
Ultra II 32GB cards are $150 USD!

110 minutes of HQ video for less than $200 including the Kensington 7-in-1 reader, unreal!
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 09:21 PM   #239
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...and can you fill the entire 32gb card without errors?
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Old September 23rd, 2008, 09:54 PM   #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Moreau View Post
Hi Steven

Unfortunately the Cables Unlimited Reader is physically exactly the same as the Kensington, therefore, no door closure.

I tried with S&Q on 40-45 FPS. I got failures at 40 FPS. On the Kensington it seems error-free at 42FPS at least. So I guess the Cables Unlimited Reader, though a bit faster on the Mac, is not as compatible with the EX1. However, I'm not convinced that the SDHC card speed is completely responsible for the failures at slow motion, higher bitrate storage. Now I'm thinking its a limitation of the EX1's Expresscard USB 2.0 interface. Expresscards have 2 ways of communicating, via the PC-Express Bus, a super-fast bus similar to the internal slots in a modern PC or MAC, or using USB 2.0, which is theoretically very fast but it depends on implementation and other factors. It may explains why the Sony Expresscard hard drive unit doesn't perform well at slow-mo.

So the SOHOUSB expresscard adapter is going back. No need for something that isn't as compatible as the Kensington. So far the Kensington Adapter is the best.

Keith, I'm just reading this post now... LOL.. You must of just posted this before my 2PM post.... We ARE thinking the same thing regarding where the limitation is coming from.
I agree, It's Sony and how they are using the USB 2.0. These fast SDHC cards are fast enough to run the EX mode even at S&Q. Heck, we are able to overcrank 40 to 45 FPS of the max S&Q (60) FPS as it is now.

Based on my calculations the MAX data rate overcranking at 60FPS on 720 24P is 100mbps or 12.5MB/s. The Ultra II SDHC cards can sustain 15MB/s read and write.

Also, if Sony wrote the extra code needed for the new Extreme III to allow it to reach its 30MB/s data rate, this would be great. The Nikon D90 was designed to access the new Extreme III 30MB/s capability. I'm sure Nikon could easily program this in a firmware upgrade.
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