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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
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Old December 14th, 2008, 03:05 PM   #16
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You might need to try using Compressor's Frame Controls Retiming feature which uses Optical Flow technology.

The first step is to check results on the computer. It should play back 25p smoothly on your computer before uploading.
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Old December 14th, 2008, 05:13 PM   #17
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To convert 50p to 25p there's nothing more to do then to drop every second frame. You don't need advanced techiques like optical flow for that. 50p to 24p conversion for vimeo of course will benefit a lot from optical flow, but it will take a lot of render time.
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Old December 14th, 2008, 07:54 PM   #18
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Having "choppy video" on Flash video playback may be caused by the speed of your CPU. I know that on my previous MacBookPro (single processor G5) it would have to work really hard just to play a Flash video without dropping frames. One thing to check (if you're on a Mac) is to launch the Activity Monitor and then Window>CPU History. This will show you how hard your CPU is running when viewing a Flash movie. If the graph is showing that your CPU is maxed out, that may be why you're dropping frames.

On the other hand, if you're NOT having trouble viewing other people's Flash videos, then forget everything I just wrote above. :)
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Old December 14th, 2008, 07:58 PM   #19
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Hey just a thought but why not upload to your own site and let them download it or play it there? I encoded a few versions of a 5 min production to mp4 and it worked well coming from a EX3 1080I source. I encoded in compressor (Mac) converting to progressive frames (25fps). If you have your own site or ftp isn't this easier?

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Old December 15th, 2008, 08:41 AM   #20
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Mitchell for me it is not CPU with dual quad core 3.0 and 16GB of ram the machine is not even working when it views the footage. It is a Vimeo problem.

Evan I do upload to a hidden page but letting them download is not an option since most of the footage is right protected from a few TV shows. That is what intrigued me with Vimeo Plus you could have it play on your site only and no download. For me high quality is a must and their footage is not there yet.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 10:23 AM   #21
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Dominik, Carlos said he used Compressor without any special settings (optical flow) and was not happy with the results. Sometimes theory and practice are very different. If dropping every second frame doesn't look good (after all you are changing the temporal resolution) there's no reason why not trying optical flow. Maybe it's created frames based on the motion estimation will do a better job, maybe not. With technology NEVER assume the "white paper" matches reality.

In fact if dropping every 2nd frame where fine that Carlos' 50p wouldn't look too bad as a Vimeo convert. I suspect Vimeo going from 25p to 24p drops fewer frames than 30p to 24p.

Basically Vimeo has a serious frame rate conversion issue and one must do the frame rate conversation yourself if you are to use Vimeo. Not of this is necessary with YouTube.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominik Seibold View Post
To convert 50p to 25p there's nothing more to do then to drop every second frame. You don't need advanced techiques like optical flow for that. 50p to 24p conversion for vimeo of course will benefit a lot from optical flow, but it will take a lot of render time.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 11:32 AM   #22
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Craig, I do it like you said and the results are far better. No perfect but not bad. I upload a clip to Vimeo and though that 25p>24p don't would be very agressive but it was a disaster. Now I'm uploading to expossure room. In an hour or less I post the link
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Old December 15th, 2008, 11:59 AM   #23
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Carlos, looking forward to the ExposureRoom link.

Other experiments might be: once you convert 50p to 25p, do a speed change to 24p and use that as your source to upload. Another might be go directly from 50p to 24p using optical flow. Of course you could try uploading your 50p to YouTube and see how that handles it. At the very least YouTube should handle 25p better than Vimeo since it doesn't do any frame conversion at all.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 12:45 PM   #24
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Because with optical flow the 50>25p conversion was better I'll try that you said, directly to 24p. You now if youtube will allow in the futures view 720 footage without upscale to 1080?

The video in expossure room. It's the better I find at the moment. Let me know if you find it jerky or something. I think is so good vs vimeo
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Old December 15th, 2008, 01:40 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Sometimes theory and practice are very different.
I wouldn't accept that. ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Maybe it's created frames based on the motion estimation will do a better job, maybe not.
The results will be in both cases 100% identical. Try it, if you don't believe me.
Btw, the biggest error-source there is: the user.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos Padilla View Post
You now if youtube will allow in the futures view 720 footage without upscale to 1080?
Which upscale? Do you mean full-screen-mode?
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Old December 15th, 2008, 01:54 PM   #26
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Dominique I had done the 50>25p conversion with and without using Compressor's Frame Controls Retiming and obtained better results with this option without dubt.

Quote:
Which upscale? Do you mean full-screen-mode?
sorry, you are right. I'm refer to the full screen mode (in my monitors 1920x1080), and the not option to view 720 footage in his size.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 02:02 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos Padilla View Post
Dominique I had done the 50>25p conversion with and without using Compressor's Frame Controls Retiming and obtained better results with this option without dubt.
There are two possibilities:
1. You did a mistake (did choose frame-blending instead of optical flow or didn't do a 50p->25p-conversion but something else)
2. placebo-effect

Can you post examples? I just tried it myself and the results are 100% identical like expected (I subtracted the frames in AFX to be sure there's no difference).
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Old December 15th, 2008, 02:23 PM   #28
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Dominique I delete the video without optical flow because the movements were jerky. The conversion with optical flow is the video you can see above. The difference is not little.
1- I choose optical flow in the second one and not in the first.
2- Placebo effect... ok, I was finding a solution and this seems work to me. If anyone that view the video has the same placebo effect that me, are fine.

If you obtains the same results don't do it. Its easy, but believe me, in my case the difference isn't a little interpretation, is fluid movements vs jerky movements.
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Old December 15th, 2008, 02:44 PM   #29
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I'm pretty sure there's a mistake around here. But without comparing both of your results I won't be able to tell.
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