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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old February 28th, 2009, 07:08 PM   #16
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I have one 8GB SxS card. Rarely touched. SDHC works, is simple, cost effective, and has been reliable for me.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 03:02 AM   #17
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I'm going to start using the MXR adapters next week. I will still do some overcranking on my SXS cards, but I'm thinking that the high writing speed is only necessary for the live recording. Once the clip is recorded on the SXS card I can then copy it over to a SDHC card in the other slot. Is there any reason this wouldn't work? I would then have all of my clips on SDHC cards that I could keep if I want to.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 03:46 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Joy View Post
It's a bit like using normal DV tape in an HDV cam, it usually works just fine but you know the first time it loses you footage will be the worst time it could possible happen.
Very well stated, Paul. Ok for non paying gigs, but if money and reputation are on the line, it seems only prudent to stick with what the manufacturer designed for the camera.

-gb-
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Old March 1st, 2009, 04:01 AM   #19
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1 x 8G SXS card and the rest,MXR with the SandDisk Ultra 2 15MB 16GB cards.
So far no problems and this is recording at a weddings, gigs, etc... and then upload to MBP in the same session, delete and then reuse.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 05:46 AM   #20
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hell, might sell my SxS cards then. cant get them to mount on my MBP, both
the delkin and kengsington adapters mount perfectly and transfer speeds through
expresscard are FAST!
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Old March 1st, 2009, 09:54 AM   #21
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Jason eludes to a problem I've never heard about when using SDHD cards.... They are slower to transfer data off of when compared to SxS? Is that true? Jason makes it sound like they are a lot slower.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 10:01 AM   #22
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if you are using a USB2 reader, then yes, going to take a bit. If you have a notebook
with an expresscard slot, one of those adapters should speed it up.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 10:20 AM   #23
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I have a MBP laptop with an express card slot. I know that using the express card slot is always faster, but....

If I download clips using a USB adaptor and SDHD card compared to downloading from a SxS card......do clips download at the same speed?
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Old March 1st, 2009, 11:35 AM   #24
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I wouldn't sell the only SxS card unless the recouped money is really important. For one, it's selling off a possible diagnostic avenue. If something happened such that the camera can't handle the KxR or MxR cards, then you can test the original card. I doubt Sony repair would test against these unofficial recording media and might not find a problem, send it back but still charge you a fee. Maybe what I'm saying is silly, I don't know.
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Old March 2nd, 2009, 10:09 AM   #25
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SxS 6.8x versus MxR 2.5x download times via Exp34 slot

I ran a quick test of 8 mins of 1080p/HQ from an SxS and then from an MxR. The SxS was a Sony 16gb and the MxR had a Transcend 16gb Class 6 card in it. The results were as above. This was using a MBP 2.4/4gb/stock internal 250HD/ unibody with the cards in the Express 34 slot, importing into FCP directly, as we usually do. Your mileage may vary, but looks like Sony is more than twice as fast in the transfer.

So if you only have a small amount of material or don't have clients breathing down your neck, it's no big deal, but on several recent shoots with multiple cameras, we would have been very unhappy with the slower download times. Time is money, when a client is paying.

I'm using the MxR's as back up to my SxS cards. Great to have them, just in case we need an hour or two of additional recording time, but certainly not time to sell any SxS cards.
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Old March 2nd, 2009, 10:15 AM   #26
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I think John really drives home the point here.

If you are using the camera professionally, and you are charging clients, then you have the potential to recoup the costs of your SxS cards. Thus using them, especially when you're on the clock, makes perfect sense.

For those who are shooting for themselves, or who, like me, have no hard deadlines to deal with in terms of laying that footage off to other media, then the SDHC cards make sense. In my case, my employer could not afford an investment in SxS cards and thus I was going to be shooting to a Firestore that I previously owned. The addition of the SDHC recording allowed me to use the camera properly.

This situation will not be mirrored by others most likely, so we all have to make our best choices.
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Old March 2nd, 2009, 10:26 AM   #27
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Agreed.

So far the only argument against the SxS substitute has been that transfer is slower. Considering that the SDHC cards are a fraction of the cost, it doesn't seem to be a factor. I can buy enough of them cheap enough that I can transfer them at home instead of in the field. How many of us brought laptops with us in the beginning so we could re-use the SxS cards? Now we don't need to. We just buy more adapters and SDHC cards dirt cheap and shoot away.

As far as the notion that we shouldn't "gamble" with SDHC cards for "paying gigs" show me the evidence that they aren't as dependable and reliable as the SxS cards. Anyone had a failure on a job with these? No one has posted it that I can tell.

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Old March 2nd, 2009, 10:44 AM   #28
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I have been shooting SD cards pretty much exclusively since October. When I got my Delkin adapters I tested them for about 4-5 hours each card (for 6 cards), ran them hard and put them up wet. I was pleased so I used SD on a series of interviews shooting 3-5 hours a day. I offloaded to a MBPro each card took about 40-50 min to download with full verification. The SxS cards were faster by 2-3X but I can live with the time in most cases. My clients were really happy with the job. I have had more issues with the SxS cards not switching slots reliably than any problems with the SD cards. In most cases I just stop and change slots then hit record again at around 55-57 min (with the 16GB cards). I need to do some more testing with the SD cards on slot switching.

For out of town clients I'll just sell the SD cards to them so they can walk away with the media. For shooting 24-30fps the SD cards are awesome, close in cost to tape so in a lot of cases can be treated as an expendable.
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Old March 2nd, 2009, 11:16 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert C. Fisher View Post
For shooting 24-30fps the SD cards are awesome, close in cost to tape so in a lot of cases can be treated as an expendable.
I'd be real curious to know how you were writing 1080p to tape for $35!
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Old March 2nd, 2009, 12:32 PM   #30
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SxS ingest maybe twice as fast as SDHD via USB2, but SDHC via USB2 is still at least twice as fast as digitising from tape. And more efficient.

I go out and shoot an advert in a day and get an hour of footage. This might take 30 minutes to bring into FCP instead of 15 minutes. No big deal to me or my clients. Until I bought the EX1 it took an hour.

I'll be creating motion graphics or working in Photoshop whilst it's importing anyway.
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