CMOS Sensor and wedding? at DVinfo.net

Denny Kyser · July 22nd, 2009, 11:25 AM

Is anyone having good luck with the EX1 and weddings. I have read there could be a problem when a flash goes off with a CMOS sensor?

If that is not an issue I am going to pick up one of these cameras.

Denny

Charles Newcomb · July 22nd, 2009, 05:23 PM

First off, I do not do weddings. I can't imagine a more frustrating way to make a living. But I did one last week because a friend whom I owed a favor called me at eight in the morning, freaking out: "My daughter's getting married this afternoon and the video guy just called to say he can't make it. Please, help!"

Okay... so I won't bore you with details such as making him rush to the church to show me the layout, getting my ladyfriend up to speed on my Z1U to backup the EX3, getting shots of hair being done at the last second, etc. You want to know about rolling shutter.

It was god-awful. I can't describe how bad it was. Hundreds of flashes... all those horizontal rectangles across the video. I used a lot of footage from the Z1U to cover the worst of it.

But for some reason I'm the only one who seemed to notice. Go figure.

My hat's off to wedding shooters, by the way. Not me. Huh-uh. I'd rather eat worms.

Charles Newcomb · July 22nd, 2009, 05:35 PM

Here. See for yourself.

rolling shutter on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Vaughan Wood · July 23rd, 2009, 02:22 AM

Had one of the first EX 1's into Australia.

I do about 80 single camera weddings per year, although at 59 y.o. the EX 1 is really not good for my back....esp with a light hanging off the front of it.

In short, rolling shutter...awful.....esp. for slow motion....has anyone else noticed? ....NO!!!

Images......awesome......esp. low light receptions!

Now....if it was only as light as a V1!

Cheers,

Vaughan

L.J. Morelli · July 23rd, 2009, 12:17 PM

Been shooting weddings for 28 years, and with the EX for since June '08. It's absolutely not an issue for me. There are a few times where I use the flash as an effect, that is I'll freeze on it. Depending on where the shutter is, sometimes it will give you a full frame flash, other times the still frame will be half flash. Having said that, I found if I put the "deinterlace" filter on in FCP, I'll often be able to get the full flash frame effect by picking one of the choices in the deinterlace filter tab, like odd, even, etc.

Charles Newcomb · July 23rd, 2009, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L.J. Morelli

Been shooting weddings for 28 years, and with the EX for since June '08. It's absolutely not an issue for me. There are a few times where I use the flash as an effect, that is I'll freeze on it. Depending on where the shutter is, sometimes it will give you a full frame flash, other times the still frame will be half flash. Having said that, I found if I put the "deinterlace" filter on in FCP, I'll often be able to get the full flash frame effect by picking one of the choices in the deinterlace filter tab, like odd, even, etc.

That's a lot of work when there are hundreds of flashes.

L.J. Morelli · July 23rd, 2009, 09:58 PM

Really? I only do the effect about 5 times, on the 50 weddings I shoot a year.

Scott Hayes · July 26th, 2009, 05:45 PM

i was worried about it at first, now I don't care. my bigger concerns are the horrible white balance and focus with this camera.

Vincent Oliver · July 27th, 2009, 02:13 AM

Try using a preset white balance, i.e. 3200k for tungsten or 5600k for outdoors. On a wedding you need to work fast, so constantly adjusting the WB settings you could miss some key moments.

The EX auto focus is not the best, try using manual assisted focus. Or, set the camera to manual focus and keep a finger near the push for auto focus button.

I have been using the Canon XH A1 for wedding work, but shot my last one on the EX3 and the results were outstanding.

I am also using the new DM shoulder mount and this does make life a lot easier for the handheld work.

Buba Kastorski · July 27th, 2009, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denny Kyser

If that is not an issue I am going to pick up one of these cameras.

it is an issue, but I never heard anything from my clients, to them it's just a photoflash light.
but the picture is just great!

Charles Newcomb · July 27th, 2009, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hayes

i was worried about it at first, now I don't care. my bigger concerns are the horrible white balance and focus with this camera.

I've not had a problem with those two issues. But I always shoot full manual; and I do not use the auto white balance.

Jose Bucaro · July 27th, 2009, 03:59 PM

Newbluefx makes a filter that removes the flash from the video.

David Heath · July 27th, 2009, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denny Kyser

I have read there could be a problem when a flash goes off with a CMOS sensor?

If that is not an issue I am going to pick up one of these cameras.

It's funny - the way the rolling shutter behaves when a camera flash goes off is exactly the same as tube cameras used to behave with a camera flash, for those old enough to remember the era! Nobody even mentioned it at the time - it was just how video cameras behaved.

Likewise there was little comment passed when CCD cameras appeared, and rendered flashes a little differently. (Vertical streaking was far more an issue!) So why is such a fuss being made about rolling shutter now?

Vaughan Wood · July 27th, 2009, 06:01 PM

So why is such a fuss being made about rolling shutter now?

I do think things have changed a lot in the last few years.

Every guest has a digital camera, and every camera has at least one "pre-flash" or more likely, a series of them to relieve red-eye!

This can make a normal cake cutting look like a Hollywood media circus!!!!

Likewise I recently did a surprise wedding where guests thought it was an engagement and so the guests were all standing around the couple in the middle of a hotel ballroom.
When they were pronounced Husband and Wife the flashes went completely insane!
I really couldn't use "that" kiss at all, and had to get them to kiss again later for me.

Likewise last year we did a school concert where the new school Principal did not warn people there was to be no flash photography during the event.

After they complained about the quality of the video we went back and counted 165 camera flashes in the first 5 minutes of the concert footage, (@25 f.p.s.)

Sometimes you just can't control this stuff, and it is getting OUT of control.

Cheers,

Vaughan

Denny Kyser · July 27th, 2009, 06:29 PM

What ever happened to no flash during the ceremony.

We do a few weddings at a church where this is NOT allowed, even by the photographer, even at the kiss. The pastor will state this at the beginning of the ceremony. He has been known to stop the ceremony and ask a guest to please put there camera away. Word gets around quick that you follow the rules.

July 22nd, 2009, 11:25 AM	#1
Denny Kyser Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Warren, Pa Posts: 785	CMOS Sensor and wedding? Is anyone having good luck with the EX1 and weddings. I have read there could be a problem when a flash goes off with a CMOS sensor? If that is not an issue I am going to pick up one of these cameras. Denny __________________ 2 Canon XF305's Kyser Photography www.kyserphoto.com

July 27th, 2009, 02:13 AM	#9
Vincent Oliver Trustee Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Chislehurst, London Posts: 1,724	Try using a preset white balance, i.e. 3200k for tungsten or 5600k for outdoors. On a wedding you need to work fast, so constantly adjusting the WB settings you could miss some key moments. The EX auto focus is not the best, try using manual assisted focus. Or, set the camera to manual focus and keep a finger near the push for auto focus button. I have been using the Canon XH A1 for wedding work, but shot my last one on the EX3 and the results were outstanding. I am also using the new DM shoulder mount and this does make life a lot easier for the handheld work. __________________ Eyes are a deaf man’s ears. Ears are a blind man’s eyes

July 27th, 2009, 03:59 PM	#12
Jose Bucaro Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: San Jose, California Posts: 32	Newbluefx makes a filter that removes the flash from the video. __________________ JB

July 27th, 2009, 06:29 PM	#15
Denny Kyser Major Player Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Warren, Pa Posts: 785	What ever happened to no flash during the ceremony. We do a few weddings at a church where this is NOT allowed, even by the photographer, even at the kiss. The pastor will state this at the beginning of the ceremony. He has been known to stop the ceremony and ask a guest to please put there camera away. Word gets around quick that you follow the rules. __________________ 2 Canon XF305's Kyser Photography www.kyserphoto.com

July 22nd, 2009, 05:23 PM	#2
Charles Newcomb Major Player Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Salida, Colorado Posts: 561	First off, I do not do weddings. I can't imagine a more frustrating way to make a living. But I did one last week because a friend whom I owed a favor called me at eight in the morning, freaking out: "My daughter's getting married this afternoon and the video guy just called to say he can't make it. Please, help!" Okay... so I won't bore you with details such as making him rush to the church to show me the layout, getting my ladyfriend up to speed on my Z1U to backup the EX3, getting shots of hair being done at the last second, etc. You want to know about rolling shutter. It was god-awful. I can't describe how bad it was. Hundreds of flashes... all those horizontal rectangles across the video. I used a lot of footage from the Z1U to cover the worst of it. But for some reason I'm the only one who seemed to notice. Go figure. My hat's off to wedding shooters, by the way. Not me. Huh-uh. I'd rather eat worms.

July 22nd, 2009, 05:35 PM	#3
Charles Newcomb Major Player Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Salida, Colorado Posts: 561	Here. See for yourself. rolling shutter on Flickr - Photo Sharing!

July 23rd, 2009, 02:22 AM	#4
Vaughan Wood Major Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 278	Had one of the first EX 1's into Australia. I do about 80 single camera weddings per year, although at 59 y.o. the EX 1 is really not good for my back....esp with a light hanging off the front of it. In short, rolling shutter...awful.....esp. for slow motion....has anyone else noticed? ....NO!!! Images......awesome......esp. low light receptions! Now....if it was only as light as a V1! Cheers, Vaughan

July 23rd, 2009, 12:17 PM	#5
L.J. Morelli Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Hicksville, NY Posts: 122	Been shooting weddings for 28 years, and with the EX for since June '08. It's absolutely not an issue for me. There are a few times where I use the flash as an effect, that is I'll freeze on it. Depending on where the shutter is, sometimes it will give you a full frame flash, other times the still frame will be half flash. Having said that, I found if I put the "deinterlace" filter on in FCP, I'll often be able to get the full flash frame effect by picking one of the choices in the deinterlace filter tab, like odd, even, etc.

July 23rd, 2009, 09:58 PM	#7
L.J. Morelli Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Hicksville, NY Posts: 122	Really? I only do the effect about 5 times, on the 50 weddings I shoot a year.

July 26th, 2009, 05:45 PM	#8
Scott Hayes Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 692	i was worried about it at first, now I don't care. my bigger concerns are the horrible white balance and focus with this camera.

July 27th, 2009, 06:01 PM	#14
Vaughan Wood Major Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 278	So why is such a fuss being made about rolling shutter now? I do think things have changed a lot in the last few years. Every guest has a digital camera, and every camera has at least one "pre-flash" or more likely, a series of them to relieve red-eye! This can make a normal cake cutting look like a Hollywood media circus!!!! Likewise I recently did a surprise wedding where guests thought it was an engagement and so the guests were all standing around the couple in the middle of a hotel ballroom. When they were pronounced Husband and Wife the flashes went completely insane! I really couldn't use "that" kiss at all, and had to get them to kiss again later for me. Likewise last year we did a school concert where the new school Principal did not warn people there was to be no flash photography during the event. After they complained about the quality of the video we went back and counted 165 camera flashes in the first 5 minutes of the concert footage, (@25 f.p.s.) Sometimes you just can't control this stuff, and it is getting OUT of control. Cheers, Vaughan