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Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old July 30th, 2009, 10:12 PM   #16
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I have 2 MxR adapters and two 16gig Transcend cards. I just recorded a series of shots with 720/30p files ranging from 10 sec, 20, 30, 1:00, 5:00 and 10:00 minutes in length. The write time (red to green) was 4-1/2 to 5 sec. on average for all file lengths....fwiw.
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Old July 31st, 2009, 07:19 AM   #17
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Dave,

Very interesting! I'm, going to order some MxR adapters. Sounds like its worth a shot. Does it make any sense why there would be a difference in the adapters? Sure doesn't to me!

Where are folks getting MxR adapters anyway? Is there a DVinfo sponsor?
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Old July 31st, 2009, 07:41 AM   #18
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Dave,

Does it make any sense why there would be a difference in the adapters? Sure doesn't to me!
Here is why I think it does:

The experimentation done by the dedicated members of this forum after it was discovered that firmware 1.11 allowed the use of SDHC cards instead of SxS cards went on to over 1200 posts.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/sony-xdca...sxs-cards.html

It was clear from this that after so many adapter and card combinations were tried very few worked. Thus it would appear that tiny little differences in either the card internals or the reader internals led to incompatibilities and failure. The change in the Delkin adapters are a clear example of this. It would appear that even a slight internal change in either an adapter or a card even though they may appear the same on the outside could lead to problems IMO.

John
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Old July 31st, 2009, 12:53 PM   #19
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FWIW, I have a Hoodman adapter and Hoodman 16gb card.

On a recent event I started recording for a long record time and got a "media error" after about 15 minutes.

The exisiting footage was there, but the recording stopped with the error message.

This is random as I tested these cards a few months ago and everyhting was fine.

I was recording at 720p60.

In a way, all of the SDHC setups can not be fully trusted as I have had similar errors using Transcend 32gb + M&R adapters.

The Transcend errors ocurred upon the switch between cards when one was full.

SxS or Flash XDR seem like the best way for payed work.
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Old July 31st, 2009, 01:42 PM   #20
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I got the Hoodman SDHC card today. It has a 4-5 second delay at the end of recording which is about half of what the Transcends were doing. I tested write speed from my Mac and it was 13 MB/sec compared to 10 MB/sec for the Transcends.

I also did a test where I started recording a couple seconds before the red light went out. It recorded fine, but I'd want to test it more times to see if I accidentally do that in the field what is the likelihood that I'll loose footage.

Still waiting on the MxR to arrive and will test it after vacation.

To me the 4-5 seconds is workable. 8-11 seconds was not. I'm still concerned about reliability, but won't know about that until I use it for awhile. It might be a situation where I use SxS cards mostly, but when I need a little extra recording time or can't download a previous days shooting, I have my SDHC cards available.
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Old July 31st, 2009, 01:47 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Tim Polster View Post
On a recent event I started recording for a long record time and got a "media error" after about 15 minutes. ...The Transcend errors ocurred upon the switch between cards when one was full.
It would be interesting to know if anyone else has had similar problems with the Hoodman setup. One time is a fluke, more than one is an issue.

I also had some troubles with card switching. It seems like card switching is in the same category as starting to record before the red light goes out. You can try it, but don't expect it to work. It's probably safer to stop recording, wait till the light goes green, switch cards and start recording again.
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Old August 1st, 2009, 03:05 AM   #22
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It seems like card switching is in the same category as starting to record before the red light goes out. You can try it, but don't expect it to work.
I've got 16 Transcend cards, and regularly have shots spanning cards - current record is 5 cards (don't ask...). Copy the BPAV folders to a hard disk and XDCAM Transfer recognises the sequence and joins them all up with nary a hitch.

OTOH, a colleage who's just bought an EX1 with MxR adaptors and some Transcend cards from Amazon.co.uk had a problem on Thursday which meant two lost shots. It sounds like problems are surfacing with newly purchased cards. Is there a bad batch or a change to the card spec, I wonder?
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Old August 12th, 2009, 12:08 PM   #23
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I got my MxR card and tested about 4 Transcend SDHC cards. The result - the delay after stopping the recording ranged from 7-11 seconds. This is not appreciably different than when I use the Hoodman adapter, maybe a second faster in the best case scenario. With the Hoodman card I consistently get 4-6 second delay with either the Hoodman or the MxR adapter.

While I didn't get any Media Rebuild Errors on this brief test, I think it is likely given the slower and variable performance with the Transcend cards that it would happen at some point. I don't presume to tell anyone how to interpret this. But, my reaction is that I will not use these Transcend cards in any capacity for fear of unreliability with MxR adapters(I already know they're unreliable with Hoodman adapters). And I will not be wasting any more money on Transcend cards. I will be buying more Hoodman cards. They are worth every penny in my opinion because they actually test them for this specific use.
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Old August 12th, 2009, 06:33 PM   #24
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Thanks for this input Brett! I was thinking of getting some MxR cards, but if the results are the same as with the Hoodmans (more or less), then I agree, the Transcends aren't worth it!

What happened? Must be the newest Transcends aren't made to the same spec as the older ones? Lot sof other people reported great results with them.

I just ordered a couple more Hoodmans. Several more days of use and my original hoodmans are chugging away, no problems yet, and 4 second write times...they may cost more, but they are worth it!
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Old August 13th, 2009, 02:40 AM   #25
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The couple of times I had problems with shots spanning two transcend 16gb cards (got the incomplete media notice) I shortened the first clip by a couple of frames in xd transfer and no more problem. Not great, but it worked and as it was b-roll...
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Old August 13th, 2009, 03:01 AM   #26
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I have done some tests with media.

Test One:
Time for green light to come on after stopping recording:
SxS card 4.0 seconds
Sandisk Ultra II 16 GB SDHC C4 6.2 seconds
Transcend 32Gb SD HC C6 8.0 seconds

Test Two:
Time to swap from one slot to the other while recording using the same media.
SxS card 4.0 seconds
Sandisk Ultra II 16 GB SDHC C4 8.0 seconds
Transcend 32Gb SD HC C6 16.0 seconds (Note: light goes out after 8 seconds but then comes on after 2 seconds for a further 6 seconds).

These results are an average of 10 tests of each type. Camera used: Sony EX1 & 3. Card reader MxR.

Ian Semmens
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Old August 17th, 2009, 11:45 PM   #27
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Hello
My first purchase of Transcend 16GB SDHC cards had V3.1 printed on the rear of the paper insert.
The last batch had V3.2 printed on rear and slightly different printing on front.
I am not sure if this relates to the insert or the SDHC card.
Has anyone matched this difference to card performance or reliability.
I have not tested the V3.2 cards yet.

Update :I filled a V3.2 card today. Played it back and deleted the three clips with no problems.
Malcolm

Last edited by Malcolm Dyer; August 18th, 2009 at 08:37 AM. Reason: Update
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Old September 4th, 2009, 08:56 PM   #28
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Malcolm,

What card adapter are you using? The Hoodman or an MxR? It seems to make a difference for some.
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Old September 5th, 2009, 11:36 AM   #29
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SDHC reliable?

I got a couple MxR adapters and four or five Transcend 16GB cards, and they actually worked most of the time. When I was learning and testing the EX3, I used one and got the "restore media" warning, but the media couldn't be restored. I assumed that I had done something wrong.

Then on an actual job (after I had already used a Transcend card for an entire interview) I got the "restore media" warning, but luckily at the very beginning of an interview. Again, the media couldn't be restored.

Is the system reliable? If you mean can you count on them, I'd have to say no. I've put the MxR adapters and Transcend cards on a shelf, never to be used again.

The S x S cards, on the other hand, have given me no problems whatsoever.
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Old September 5th, 2009, 12:21 PM   #30
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they actually worked most of the time.
Not the sort of review you'd want to read on a parachute or airbag. Or a video recording medium for that matter.

I'll add that a colleague with a Compact Flash recording device attached to a Z7 had a spate of problems with various brands of CF card though of course he had a tape backup.

I wonder how folks with JVCs and the new breed of video SLRs that record direct to SDHC are getting on? Is it the cards? Is it a software thing? How close does this solution push the available technology?
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