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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old April 7th, 2010, 07:33 PM   #1
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SxS Pro 32GB Cards

Will my EX1 work with the Sony 32GB SxS Pro card that currently has firmware V 1.11?

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Old April 7th, 2010, 08:25 PM   #2
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It should work with Sony 32GB SxS Pro card.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 02:06 AM   #3
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It does, my EX1 with 1.11 worked great with SxS pro 32GB.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 08:30 AM   #4
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If you want to use it with the less expensive SxS-1 32GB cards you'd need a firmware upgrade. It might be worth it.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 02:46 PM   #5
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From what I'm hearing about the new cheaper SDHC cards can be a disasterous nightmare.
I have V 1.11 and I don't want to take the risk and I will purchase the more expensive SxS cards for pro work. Also, I might purchase the new 120 gig hard drive sony makes for the EX1.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 03:25 PM   #6
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SDHC has nothing to do with SxS-1. I have not seen one single bad post about them and I'm on several EX forums (and "lead" one of them).

Firmware 1.20 not only supports SxS-1 but better supports SDHC so in fact with that firmware it seems the SDHC disasters are gone. I hear excellent things about Sandisk Extreme Class 10 cards.

Personally I'd thing you'd be far better off with SDHC (and firmware 1.20) than Sony's hard drive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joel Brooks View Post
From what I'm hearing about the new cheaper SDHC cards can be a disasterous nightmare.
I have V 1.11 and I don't want to take the risk and I will purchase the more expensive SxS cards for pro work. Also, I might purchase the new 120 gig hard drive sony makes for the EX1.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 03:57 PM   #7
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I just got a Patriot SDHC 16GB class 10 (EX1 ver 1.20) and run thru twice without any warning or error. Then over crank for 20 minutes without any warning msg.
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Old April 8th, 2010, 08:18 PM   #8
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Here is a quote from another EX1 user regarding the SDHC type recording media. I am not saying that one should not use them, I just am happy with the Pro SxS cards and I don't want to take a chance until I can capture to hard drive simultanously.

"I'm primarily a wedding Videographer so needless to say long recordings are the norm. I shoot with the Sony EX3 and I'm loving it! I knew that going from the old to the new would be expensive but I figured the payoff would be the time I save by not having to digitize in real time. However, I was skimming one of the online EX forums one day and ran into a thread about SXS adapters for the use of SDHC cards in the EX1 and EX3 cameras. The moderators said they used these products and they worked fine so I thought I would give it a go as I was in the market for a 32gb card at the time. I purchased a 32gb SDHC card with the adapter and my nightmare began. I would rather not bore you with the details but I will say that I have two very unhappy clients because of this "system". I threw the adapter away and gave the SDHC card to my son to use in his $169 still camera. I shared my experience with an associate that was about to go EX and we both proceeded to purchase 4 Sony SXS 32gb cards. After many jobs without a glitch I trust this media 100% I highly recommend this product to any EX event Videographer.Of course I wish the price was lower but trust in your recording media is priceless."


Joel
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Old April 8th, 2010, 09:30 PM   #9
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Joel,
do you know that Sony is supporting SDHC class 10 card with their adaptor ? (Sandisk extreme class 10 + Sony MEAD-SD01) ?

I'm using both SxS card and SDHC (with the test suggested by Craig S.) I can shoot more than 10 hours without backup/erase the card.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 01:25 AM   #10
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Joel you appear to be extrapolating a disaster scenario from one person's experience. Search the SDHC threads here and you will find overwhelming support for them.

In summary the majority view for most gigs is: use SxS first, then use SDHC cards.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 01:58 AM   #11
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Hmmm, I'm not sure you'll find 'overwhelming support" for SD cards. Certainly there are a lot of people using them and many having no problems at all. However there are far, far more people having issues with SD cards than SxS cards. Basically SxS cards work 100% reliably while SD cards so far have proved to be less reliable and the biggest issue is that often the problems don't show up until it's too late to do anything about it.

Now the new firmware update does appear to have reduced the risk and if you stick to the Sony adapter and Scandisk class 10 cards you should be OK, but you have to consider the consequences of loosing footage. If your shooting for yourself, or things you can re-shoot then SD and adapters may make sense, if your shooting something for a client or something that will happen only once consider the consequences of loosing a key shot. What would your client say if you asked them whether they want you to use professional media designed for the camera and application or consumer grade media with an adapter that should work, most of the time.

A 32Gb SxS-1 card, if you shop around three times the cost of a class 10 32Gb card and adapter. Is that really worth risking your rushes over, your going to be using the cards over and over, even if the scandisk card is 99% reliable, that's till 1 in 100 uses that may end up corrupt. SxS for me at least has been 100% reliable. I was one of those that discovered an the original Kensington adapter that worked with SD cards. I purchased a bunch of adapters and cards, but now they sit in a box and never get used, I just don't like the uncertainty. With SxS I don't even think about it, just put the card in and use it.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 02:30 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
Hmmm, I'm not sure you'll find 'overwhelming support" for SD cards. Certainly there are a lot of people using them and many having no problems at all. However there are far, far more people having issues with SD cards than SxS cards. Basically SxS cards work 100% reliably while SD cards so far have proved to be less reliable and the biggest issue is that often the problems don't show up until it's too late to do anything about it.
Most SD problems are user error or not listening to advice on here. I'm using the old firmware and use the ATP cards in a mix of MxM and MxR adaptors. No problems at all since I started shooting on ATP since September.

Of course I had problems before that with the Transcend cards. But there are SDHC solutions out there that seem to be 100% reliable. You need to do your research before you use them and not jump in with both feet believing that are a magical cheap panacea. You need to have a workflow and have confidence in the cards before you shoot on them.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 03:22 AM   #13
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You need to do your research before you use them and not jump in with both feet believing that are a magical cheap panacea. You need to have a workflow and have confidence in the cards before you shoot on them.
But with an SxS card you just stick it in and use it.

There are many tales from people that have used SD cards for months and then suddenly the get a problem that results in the loss of footage. Hopefully the new firmware will alleviate many of these problems, but the fact remains that SD cards are consumer media, mass produced to a meet a low price point. SxS cards are designed from the ground up for professional use and incorporate features such as capacitors that hold enough charge to allow any file writing to complete if the card looses power mid shot.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 07:06 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
the fact remains that SD cards are consumer media,
Not to the professional photographers who know which brands to get and depend on them. Not to the JVC HM camera users that depend on them.

SDHC is much like the tape stock of old. There is good stock and bad stock and stock that changes formulation without informing the buyer. That is the risk. Transcend has made changes. Sandisk Ultra has changed. Sandisk Extreme is reliable. ATP is reliable.

I have been using two 32GB Sandisk Ultra Class 2 (yes class 2 . . . it was the change to class 4 that became unreliable) since January 2009 and they've been 100% reliable. That does not mean I would get Ultra today. I would not. I'd get Sandisk Extreme or ATP.

Yes you have to be more brand (and state of the brand) conscious than you would be than with SxS. Forgetting about speed issues for the moment, if a given card is reliable for a high end photog, then the card is reliable. With the EX if the card is fast enough it should remain fast enough. The new EX firmware improves all that. Sony still does not recommend overcrank but I strongly doubt you'll find reliability issues with Sandisk Extreme Class 10.

BTW I've not heard of any reliability issues with SxS-1 cards. Supposedly they have a shorter usable life but otherwise seem to be as reliable as SxS cards.

The "other" reliability issue that I hear though is that if, in the rare case an SxS card does fail (and they do), it seems to be much harder to rescue the media than on a failed SDHC card.

That said the economy of the cards has changed a lot since the EX was introduced.
B&H prices
SxS 32GB is now $800
SxS-1 is $580
Sandisk Extreme - $213 (plus $40 rebate for with 2 cards)

If you're buying only two cards it's not as difficulty to get return on investment over the lifetime of the camera now. On the other hand if you need a couple of extra cards for a particularly long shoot it's much easier to run to a local quality store and get a Class 10 card than an SxS card.

But also note that with the new firmware it seems Transcend Class 6 16GB at $40 for a single use and hand to a client after the shoot can work.
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Old April 9th, 2010, 10:44 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alister Chapman View Post
But with an SxS card you just stick it in and use it.

There are many tales from people that have used SD cards for months and then suddenly the get a problem that results in the loss of footage. Hopefully the new firmware will alleviate many of these problems, but the fact remains that SD cards are consumer media, mass produced to a meet a low price point. SxS cards are designed from the ground up for professional use and incorporate features such as capacitors that hold enough charge to allow any file writing to complete if the card looses power mid shot.
I would never, ever, use any card without testing it first. Don't care if its a SxS, SDHC or whatever. I test it.

Once I have faith in the card I will use it. And my SDHC cards all sit in their own adaptors and are treated like SxS cards. Cards are never removed from their adaptors.

There are cheap consumer SDHC cards and more expensive cards. The ATP cards I use cost considerably more than the cheaper Sandisk or Transcend cards and are oddly enough the cards recommended by MxM as although they aren't the fastest they seem to have a very high build quality.

And no amount of capacitors are going to guard against the frankly larger issue of people ejecting cards before they have been written to or other user problems.

Since I've had the card issue nailed, I've been using SDHC cards flawlessly since September. In fact as I type another days worth of shooting is transferring in. Prior to that I did have problems but I spent time looking into it and found a solution that works for me (i.e only using the ATP cards).

ATP SHDC cards in lockable MxM adaptors can pretty much be handled the same as an SxS card. At Christmas I even managed to accidentally record 2 minutes of overcranked material to such a combo (the SxS was in slot B but I must have forgotten to switch). Camera didn't miss a beat despite being on the old firmware. I only realised when I got home.
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