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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old December 31st, 2011, 11:03 AM   #1
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EX1R - record to two sources at once

Is it possible to record to two sources using the EX1R, ie to SXS internal card and external HDD, at the same time?

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Old December 31st, 2011, 11:18 AM   #2
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Sure. You can record to the internal card and at the same time record to an external recorder via HDMI or SDI.

That is an excellent way to do a proxy workflow using the internal recording as the proxy and recording a much higher bitrate externally to plug in later.
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Old December 31st, 2011, 11:25 AM   #3
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Thanks Chris.

No chance of recording from both slots at the same time though, A - SxS and B e-films HDR?

Using the HDMI or SDI will take up one of the monitor options (although Ninja and t'other one I can't spell) have monitors built in. Does the EX1 have a firewire output so I could use an MRCK1?

Haven't bought the camera yet, just pondering on some options for when I do.

Cheers again.

Peter
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Old December 31st, 2011, 11:43 AM   #4
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

You can't record to both slots at the same time.

There is firewire on the camera but it only outputs when the camera is in 25mb mode (1440x1080, HDVish). You would get the same thing recording to the internal card or though the firewire. No real benefit unless you were trying to make dual copies for backup.

Both HDMI and SDI can be used to drive multiple devices simultaneously. You can split the HDMI and send one to a recorder and one to a monitor (assuming your recorder isn't also a montor).

Many SDI devices have loopthrough ability so you can continue the signal to multiple devices.
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Old December 31st, 2011, 03:56 PM   #5
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

I use a NanoFlash a lot of the time on my EX3 and EX1R.

It uses the SDI out, and can be set to trigger rec anytime TC advances so both internal SxS and NF record whenever rec button is pushed if you set TC to advance while recording.

This is great when you only have one camera and footage is really important.

The NanoFlash also has loop through SDI so I usually monitor output on a 5, 7, 9 or 20" monitor this way you have monitoring and confidence the NF signal is good.
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Old December 31st, 2011, 04:52 PM   #6
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Actually the NanoFlash not only provides a loop-through signal (of either HD-SDI or HDMI), but gives you the other output type as well, so you can feed both HDSDI and HDMI monitors from the NanoFlash simultaneously if you wish.
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Old December 31st, 2011, 06:43 PM   #7
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

I always record to my internal SxS cards and to my Nanoflash. The SxS card footage is great if the client wants to go back and check a previous take. The Nano files are for editing. I also use one of Olof's excellent brackets to hold my Nano on my EX-1.
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Old January 1st, 2012, 06:02 AM   #8
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Thanks everybody for the replies, it's much appreciated.

I can't really afford the SxS cards and was a bit concerned about using SDHC cards for reliability. If it was an important job, I wanted someway to record to two sources, so if the card went down, I had the external source to fall back on.

Your replies have given me something to think about, so thanks again.

Peter
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Old January 1st, 2012, 07:22 AM   #9
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Most ex1r packages include a 16gb SxS card with the camera. The extraordinary reliability of the SxS is well documented here on dvinfo. That is what you are paying for: reliability. There's also SxS-1 media which just has a shorter lifespan not less reliability. They are cheaper. There's also an MxM device that let's you record to an external SSD drive instead of internal SxS but frankly, I believe it's all the same fundamental technology. I believe in an SxS card, you have the most reliable incarnation of solid state media available to us. The less expensive leans toward less reliability and that then drives the dual record feature. Why have dual record when you have reliable media? How long do you keep the second card? What's the real cost difference when you are buying two of everything? How cheap do you go on precious media? Why would you ever depend on cheap media for your reputation and business?

Last edited by Les Wilson; January 1st, 2012 at 12:24 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old January 1st, 2012, 09:12 AM   #10
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

I will say this: Global Television in Canada is currently relying on SDHC cards via SxS adapters in their PMW-350s for their ENG operations. They have had cards fail on them, but the news still makes it to air.
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Old January 1st, 2012, 09:49 AM   #11
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

I use SDHC as well as SxS cards in the EX1 and the F3.

I did have some troubles when I was experimenting with cheap cards. I purchased higher end SDHC cards and have not had any failures in more than 2 years. Obviously these cards will not have the same life as the SxS cards.
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Old January 1st, 2012, 10:02 AM   #12
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les Wilson View Post
. The less expensive leans toward less reliability and that then drives the dual record feature. Why have dual record when you have reliable media?
Lee, though I always use SxS or SxS-1 cards at this point, There are a number of other advantages to dual recording that shouldn't be minimized, such as 4:2:2, higher bit rates, use of the outboard recorder for client review purposes (while the camera is setting up/ rehearsing the next shot), and the ability to record to files that the client can open directly in an NLE.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Zhang View Post
I will say this: Global Television in Canada is currently relying on SDHC cards via SxS adapters in their PMW-350s for their ENG operations. They have had cards fail on them, but the news still makes it to air.
Many threads out there about SD card reliability. Just an additional story -- two weeks ago I was working on a multi-camera shoot where I was using an F3 (w/SxS cards) and the client had brought some DSLR's. One of their (name brand) SD cards literally fell apart when being removed from camera - and they had to go through some major contortions to get the data offloaded. No this doesn't happen every day, but even occasionally is too often for me... I was just glad it wasn't either my card or my footage...
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Old January 1st, 2012, 12:27 PM   #13
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

@Dave. Very true. I was only speaking to the redundancy issue and not the added value (as you point out) that external recorders such as the Nanoflash give.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 06:53 AM   #14
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Re: EX1R - record to two sources at once

I cannot repeat this enough: SD(HC) cards are not meant for professional use of any kind. They are flimsy, vulnerable and designed for amateur use. Not one of the pro DSLR-s I have used over the last 14 years have had SD-cards as their main recording media. As a backup, maybe, but never as as the main source.

So, unless you have a device that can use the much more reliable and sturdy Compact Flash media, SxS is the way to go.

That said, I used to be a professional stills photographer and video is only my hobby, so I tried cutting some corners by buying an adapter and SDHC-cards for my Sony PMW-320. But I sold all of the cards after only one month, because I don't trust them and I certainly don't like the way I had to insert them and release them from the adapter. Even my non-commercial amateur shots deserve better, so I bought second hand SxS cards on Ebay. Not such a huge investment, as you really only need two... Just my two eurocents...
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