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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old May 24th, 2007, 09:07 AM   #211
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Originally Posted by Greg Boston View Post
Or maybe I misunderstood and you want the camera to change form without losing its professional features.

-gb-
Right, that's it. I want it smaller, lighter and more ergonomically designed, with the same feature set. And a large capacity hard-disk-based system would be a nice alternative to SxS cards.
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Old May 24th, 2007, 09:14 AM   #212
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At this point the physical body design is most likely locked and the moldings already cast. There may very well be some slight alterations, but the shipping date is now only a few months away, so a radical change in the shape and dimensions of the camera body is not going to happen.
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Old May 25th, 2007, 01:11 AM   #213
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I wonder how the XDCAM EX's exposure latitude will compare to the Sony V1.

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Originally Posted by Steve Mullen
I'm sure Sony wasn't happy when I reported the FX1/Z1 produced a "hi-rez DV" look -- that was "too blue."

Well the V1 blows that comment away. The difference is like:

1) going to a fine grain emulsion

2) switching from Kodachrome to Ektachrome

Today we had bright white clouds and clear bright blue skies in LV. I found I could shoot just like I was using film with 10-stops of latitude. I could underexpose for a "dark" look or go for a "bleached" look.

Not only can you shoot as though you had film because of the extreme latitude -- colors are significantly less saturated and edge enhancement was nil. I'm calling this capability "virtual film." Note, this has nothing to do with 24p.
So, will the new Sony have better exposure latitude? wow
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Old May 25th, 2007, 01:37 AM   #214
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Adam Wilt measured the lattitude of the V1 at 8.3 - 9 stops. The dynamic range of the V1 is actually pretty comperable to the current crop of CCD cameras, perhaps just marginally better.

The F330/F350 have a 7 stop range out of the box, but Cine4 brings that up to 10 stops. Plus the F330/F350 provide way more control over the highlight knee and black settings, so you can really tailor the image to the environment you're shooting in and the look you want to achieve.

Presumably the electronics in the XDCAM EX are going to be closer to the F330/F350 than the V1. I certainly hope so. The images from the F330/F350 look very naturally exposed, with a film-like noise pattern; whereas to my eye images from the V1 usually look overly hot, rather electronic, and have an ugly "shimmying" noise signature (a very un-film-like grain pattern).
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Old May 25th, 2007, 07:32 AM   #215
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The F330/F350 have a 7 stop range out of the box, but Cine4 brings that up to 10 stops.
Cine4
What is that?
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Old May 25th, 2007, 07:51 AM   #216
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Cine 4 is one of the gamma curves you can choose with the F330/F350.

Out of the box the F330/F350 doesn't handle highlights very well. But the Cine gamma curves (particularly Cine4) dramatically increase the amount of the lattitude that the camera can capture.

They have a VERY customisable image. Not just in things like knee settings and colorometry, but even down to being able to reduce the edge enhancement in the shadows so as not to make the grain over emphasise itself.

I really hope that Sony brings the same level of control to the HDCAM EX... though that may be wishful thinking given the prosumer nature of this camera.
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Old May 25th, 2007, 08:50 AM   #217
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I really hope that Sony brings the same level of control to the HDCAM EX... though that may be wishful thinking given the prosumer nature of this camera.
They might.
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Old May 25th, 2007, 08:58 AM   #218
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I know it's been said before, but I'd love to see:

1. CMOS sensors.

2. Full 1920 x 1080 sensors (like the Canon HV20).

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Old May 25th, 2007, 09:06 AM   #219
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Originally Posted by Alex Leith View Post
Cine 4 is one of the gamma curves you can choose with the F330/F350.

Out of the box the F330/F350 doesn't handle highlights very well. But the Cine gamma curves (particularly Cine4) dramatically increase the amount of the lattitude that the camera can capture.
It's no secret that I have professed my love for the Cine4 curve coupled with HISAT matrix. But Cine4 is not the best for maximum latitude. That would be Cine2. It has the most highlight compression of all. I've been trying out Cine2 lately in some stronger contrast situations and I like the way it looks under those circumstances.

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Old May 25th, 2007, 09:28 AM   #220
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I know it's been said before, but I'd love to see:

1. CMOS sensors.

2. Full 1920 x 1080 sensors (like the Canon HV20).

heath
Personally I'd be really reluctant to see CMOS sensors as I have yet to see any CMOS based camera that actually has a particularly "organic" looking noise signature.
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Old May 25th, 2007, 09:32 AM   #221
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It's no secret that I have professed my love for the Cine4 curve coupled with HISAT matrix. But Cine4 is not the best for maximum latitude. That would be Cine2. It has the most highlight compression of all. I've been trying out Cine2 lately in some stronger contrast situations and I like the way it looks under those circumstances.

-gb-
Cine 2... Yes, you're right. I haven't spent enough time playing with the F350... I was in the market for one of my own, but Panasonic's HPX500 and now the XDCAM EX have confused my purchasing decision... and now I'm just waiting until I see what Sony have in store for us with this little Camera.
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Old May 25th, 2007, 09:35 AM   #222
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I disagree, Alex. I've been shooting with the V1u the last 4 days and have really loved it. I may pick one up soon.

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Old May 25th, 2007, 09:43 AM   #223
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Cine 2... Yes, you're right. I haven't spent enough time playing with the F350... I was in the market for one of my own, but Panasonic's HPX500 and now the XDCAM EX have confused my purchasing decision... and now I'm just waiting until I see what Sony have in store for us with this little Camera.
Over in the XDCAM forum, Alex, I posted a grab of the four cinegamma curves from the Sony literature. That was awhile back, but you can look for threads with the paperclip icon at the right which indicates at least one post in that thread contains attachments. Just an FYI in case you haven't already seen that chart.

And IIRC, Cine4 is taken straight from the F900 series camera.

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Old May 25th, 2007, 10:06 AM   #224
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I disagree, Alex. I've been shooting with the V1u the last 4 days and have really loved it...
Don't get me wrong. The V1 is a nice little camera, but it's a league appart from the F330/F350.

To my eyes the noise signature in the V1 image just doesn't look natural. Because CMOSs produce more noise than CCDs Sony have applied a proprietary noise reduction technique [according to Adam Wilt]. It's a sort of coring effect, which can be quite intense in lower light, and produces a sort of mild shimmering rather than a fine "grain". Personally I don't like it.

And I also hate the electronic shutter. It's a little arbritrary I know, but I love windmills and you can't film a windmil with an electronic shutter!
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Old May 25th, 2007, 10:07 AM   #225
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Over in the XDCAM forum, Alex, I posted a grab of the four cinegamma curves from the Sony literature. That was awhile back, but you can look for threads with the paperclip icon at the right which indicates at least one post in that thread contains attachments. Just an FYI in case you haven't already seen that chart.

And IIRC, Cine4 is taken straight from the F900 series camera.

-gb-
Thanks Greg, I will search it out...
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