Half Inch Lens Test... Surprising Result!!

Nate Weaver · October 2nd, 2006, 01:45 PM

The 1/2" Canon H9ax3.8IRS I just bought is amazing.

It's like a 1/2" version of a J11x4.5 with a heavy build, and it's sharp. More importantly though, it's consistent throughout the zoom range. It only softens up on the long end of the extender WFO.

I'd seriously stake out Ebay looking for one of these.

Greg Penetrante · October 2nd, 2006, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brett Sherman

There are a few varieties of the YH19x6.7 lens, they are:

IRS for $8000
KTS for $4400 and
KRS for $2000

Are there significant quality differences between them?

The IRS has an extender. The KRS has no extender. Aside from that, there should be no major quality differences.

Greg Penetrante · October 2nd, 2006, 06:40 PM

Hello,

I did a comparison between pro-grade 1/2" lenses from Canon and Fuji. Like most, I am leaning towards keeping the SD lens for now.

The lenses were:
1. Canon Kh20x6.4 (HDgc mid-grade HD lens) $8000
2. Fuji S16x6.5 (mid-grade SD lens) $3000

Each shot was at f4 at 15mm using a Sony F350 camera. Screen was Cinema Display 20" from about 5 feet. Tried my best to level the whole thing. There was a 20% brightness enhancement of the TIFF files in Photoshop. From there I exported "10" quality jpeg files for upload to the webserver. Native resolution was 1440 x 1080. Please keep in mind that I am shooting a computer screen and not a physical resolution chart.

Here are the links:
http://ttf.sdsu.edu/Canon_KH20x6.4.jpg
http://ttf.sdsu.edu/Fuji_S19x6.5.jpg

My initial conclusion: The two lenses are surprisingly close! The Canon was marginally sharper in the corners, but not $5000 sharper IMHO. Makes me wonder about the whole HD marketing madness. There was also mild pincusion distortion on both lenses at 15mm. I suspect both lenses would do worse if they were at f2 or above f11. Both lenses need minor white-shading correction. Does anbody know how to use the white-shading menus on the f350 (I own vectorscope and home-made lens box)...??

It looks like I will not purchase an HD 1/2" lens initially for my own system. My Fuji S lens works for my needs right now. It goes just as wide as the HD lens and at f4 appears just as sharp. "Live" tests of both lenses confirmed my suspicions regarding sharpness. To be sure, more tests will be carried out in the future. I want to test the Fuji Xs18 series and Canon JH series to see what all that extra money gets... ;-)

Cheers,
-Greg

p.s. Thanks to Val Reynolds at Sony for the generous loan of the XDcam system.

Thierry Humeau · November 3rd, 2006, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thierry Humeau

.... I tested 3 lenses, Fujinon XDCAM HD 1/2" lenses ...... See the screen grabs at:

www.telecamfilms.com/hdlenstests.html

Thierry

I updated the test page with more frame grabs for lens sharpness, chroma aberation and gain. The new link is:

www.telecamfilms.com/xdcam.html

Enjoy!

Thierry.

Bob Willis · November 4th, 2006, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alister Chapman

All half inch SONY mount lenses should fit the XDCAM HD range. Lenses with a half inch Panasonic mount will not fit. Most of the sony lenses have a series of contact pins that electrically connect the lans to the camera, but a separate lens connector is also fitted to the camera body for 2/3inch lenses and lenses that use a cabled connection.

I have a Fuji S8.5X4.2BERM 1/2 "lens that has a Panasonic B4 mount. I am planning to use the Sony lens adapter (B4 to Sony mount)to mount the lens and then use the 12 pin cable to obtain lens control. I don't know why this shouldn't work but I plan to put it to the test this next week. Hope it works because this is a beautiful piece of glass.

Michael Knight · November 5th, 2006, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thierry Humeau

I updated the test page with more frame grabs for lens sharpness, chroma aberation and gain. The new link is:

www.telecamfilms.com/xdcam.html

Enjoy!

Thierry.

Since I have the same 18x5.5 lens, "enjoy" I did indeed:-)

Made me think that perhaps when buying such expensive glass a person should purchase under the caveat that the lens must pass certain tests otherwise it will be returned or exchaNGED FOR SOMETHING THAT DOES MEET CERTAIN INDUSTRY STANDARDS OR CAMERAMAN EXPECTATIONS FOR THE MONEY.

(oops..there goes that caps lock shouting thing again).

BTW....should those standards include a test involving shooting a train with a carbine, or the more extreme test of actually blowing up both a train and a tunnel? I might find that a little difficult to emulate:-)

Great shot......

Michael

Alister Chapman · November 5th, 2006, 03:14 PM

Bob, you will not be able to use the Panasonic B4 1/2 inch lens. The Panasonic 1/2 inch lenses have a standard B4 mount the same as you would find on a 2/3 inch B4 lens. The F350/330 uses a mount that looks at first galnce to be the same as a B4 mount but is in fact a different size. The Sony/Optex adapter converts from the Sony 1/2 inch mount to a 2/3 inch B4 mount but also alters the Flange Back distance to match 2/3 inch lenses. Because of the different Flange Back distances you can't use the Panasonic lens.

Bob Willis · November 6th, 2006, 09:19 AM

Alister, you are correct. I checked and the back flange distance is different (about 10mm). I do know a broadcast lens technician that may be able to change the panasonic mount to a sony mount. Thanks for the input.

Greg Boston · November 10th, 2006, 10:28 PM

Having seen soft image issues reported here and in my own experience, I took my Hs18X5.5ERD lens in to the local service center. Tech put it on the collimator and confirmed my suspicions.

He did all the adjusting he could, but still thought it was a bit 'hazy'. After speaking with the main service center in NJ, my lens was overnighted for diagnosis where they have the 'really expensive', testing capabilities.

After two days, got a call back from local tech saying that my lens was back, but it wasn't the one I brought in. The serial number was identified as being a pre-production version of the lens and they want to get as many of those out of circulation as possible.

They asked me to put the word out that if you think you have one of these lenses (Thierry), to contact Eddie at the main service center in NJ and they will swap it for a brand new one.

We put my replacement lens on the local tech's collimator and it was a nice, tight dot. My original had a flare emanating towards 11 o'clock. The images I'm getting now are stunningly beautiful.

Just thought I would share my experience for the benefit of the community.

regards,

-gb-

Michael Knight · November 10th, 2006, 11:17 PM

Is there a serial number reference for what is "pre-production" and what is not?

Interested, because we have an HSs18x5.5BRM....and I am not totally stoked with the pictures.

Michael KNight.

Greg Boston · November 11th, 2006, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Knight

Is there a serial number reference for what is "pre-production" and what is not?

Interested, because we have an HSs18x5.5BRM....and I am not totally stoked with the pictures.

Michael KNight.

Best bet Michael is to put in a call to NJ and ask for Eddie. You need to check into it for sure.

Service centers and contacts can be found here.

http://www.fujinonbroadcast.com/service.shtml

good luck,

-gb-

October 2nd, 2006, 01:45 PM	#16
Nate Weaver Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 2,100	The 1/2" Canon H9ax3.8IRS I just bought is amazing. It's like a 1/2" version of a J11x4.5 with a heavy build, and it's sharp. More importantly though, it's consistent throughout the zoom range. It only softens up on the long end of the extender WFO. I'd seriously stake out Ebay looking for one of these. __________________ My Work: nateweaver.net

November 5th, 2006, 03:14 PM	#22
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	Bob, you will not be able to use the Panasonic B4 1/2 inch lens. The Panasonic 1/2 inch lenses have a standard B4 mount the same as you would find on a 2/3 inch B4 lens. The F350/330 uses a mount that looks at first galnce to be the same as a B4 mount but is in fact a different size. The Sony/Optex adapter converts from the Sony 1/2 inch mount to a 2/3 inch B4 mount but also alters the Flange Back distance to match 2/3 inch lenses. Because of the different Flange Back distances you can't use the Panasonic lens. __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

November 10th, 2006, 10:28 PM	#24
Greg Boston Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: DFW area, TX Posts: 6,117 Images: 1	Fujinon replaced my lens with a brand new one... Having seen soft image issues reported here and in my own experience, I took my Hs18X5.5ERD lens in to the local service center. Tech put it on the collimator and confirmed my suspicions. He did all the adjusting he could, but still thought it was a bit 'hazy'. After speaking with the main service center in NJ, my lens was overnighted for diagnosis where they have the 'really expensive', testing capabilities. After two days, got a call back from local tech saying that my lens was back, but it wasn't the one I brought in. The serial number was identified as being a pre-production version of the lens and they want to get as many of those out of circulation as possible. They asked me to put the word out that if you think you have one of these lenses (Thierry), to contact Eddie at the main service center in NJ and they will swap it for a brand new one. We put my replacement lens on the local tech's collimator and it was a nice, tight dot. My original had a flare emanating towards 11 o'clock. The images I'm getting now are stunningly beautiful. Just thought I would share my experience for the benefit of the community. regards, -gb-

November 10th, 2006, 11:17 PM	#25
Michael Knight Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mossyrock Wa USA Posts: 65	Is there a serial number reference for what is "pre-production" and what is not? Interested, because we have an HSs18x5.5BRM....and I am not totally stoked with the pictures. Michael KNight. __________________ All media since 1960. Formerly CP16/Nagra. Currently learning F350/Fujinon HSs18 x 5.5BRM, Mac G5 Quad and FCP Studio.

October 2nd, 2006, 06:40 PM	#18
Greg Penetrante Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 70	Hello, I did a comparison between pro-grade 1/2" lenses from Canon and Fuji. Like most, I am leaning towards keeping the SD lens for now. The lenses were: 1. Canon Kh20x6.4 (HDgc mid-grade HD lens) $8000 2. Fuji S16x6.5 (mid-grade SD lens) $3000 Each shot was at f4 at 15mm using a Sony F350 camera. Screen was Cinema Display 20" from about 5 feet. Tried my best to level the whole thing. There was a 20% brightness enhancement of the TIFF files in Photoshop. From there I exported "10" quality jpeg files for upload to the webserver. Native resolution was 1440 x 1080. Please keep in mind that I am shooting a computer screen and not a physical resolution chart. Here are the links: http://ttf.sdsu.edu/Canon_KH20x6.4.jpg http://ttf.sdsu.edu/Fuji_S19x6.5.jpg My initial conclusion: The two lenses are surprisingly close! The Canon was marginally sharper in the corners, but not $5000 sharper IMHO. Makes me wonder about the whole HD marketing madness. There was also mild pincusion distortion on both lenses at 15mm. I suspect both lenses would do worse if they were at f2 or above f11. Both lenses need minor white-shading correction. Does anbody know how to use the white-shading menus on the f350 (I own vectorscope and home-made lens box)...?? It looks like I will not purchase an HD 1/2" lens initially for my own system. My Fuji S lens works for my needs right now. It goes just as wide as the HD lens and at f4 appears just as sharp. "Live" tests of both lenses confirmed my suspicions regarding sharpness. To be sure, more tests will be carried out in the future. I want to test the Fuji Xs18 series and Canon JH series to see what all that extra money gets... ;-) Cheers, -Greg p.s. Thanks to Val Reynolds at Sony for the generous loan of the XDcam system.

November 6th, 2006, 09:19 AM	#23
Bob Willis Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Posts: 292	Alister, you are correct. I checked and the back flange distance is different (about 10mm). I do know a broadcast lens technician that may be able to change the panasonic mount to a sony mount. Thanks for the input.