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Sony XDCAM PMW-F3 CineAlta
HD recording with a Super35 CMOS Sensor.


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Old February 27th, 2011, 11:09 AM   #1
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60p resolution hit?

On the Sony product page it states that the resolution for recording 60p (59.94) is 1440 x 1080. Is this normal?
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Old February 27th, 2011, 11:46 AM   #2
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Hi

Not normal, other camcorders manage 1920x1080 just fine at 50p/60p.

Just a restriction imposed by the hardware I expect.

Regards

Phil
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Old February 27th, 2011, 11:49 AM   #3
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

There has always been some kind of resolution trade off for 60p with Sony and Panasonic cameras. Depending on the camera each would handle the resolution change in a different manner. Many would use the 1280x720 resolution for 60p. Some would compromise the codec rate.

So yes this is normal or common.
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Old February 27th, 2011, 04:20 PM   #4
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

I assume this is after a camera is upgraded with the firmware to be put out in April (or thereabouts) but is this for in camera recording or is this to the 10bit 444 recorder that Sony is putting out.

I recall that 60p was to be at full HD raster of 1920 by 1080 with the 10bit/444 recorder not the squished aspect ratio they used for HDV based material.
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Old February 27th, 2011, 09:37 PM   #5
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

The camera can already output 1080 60p over dual link with no firmware needed. It just cannot record that in full raster on the cards. It seems like the 35mbps cap is hard set in the Xdcam Ex world.. So Sony fit the 60p in by reducing resolution. The F800 does something similar with a reduced vertical resolution. Now if only their was an affordable 1080 60p external recorder.

Andy
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Old February 27th, 2011, 10:15 PM   #6
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Andy,

Can you confirm that the 60p coming from the dual link is full 1920 x 1080 and not the 1440 x 1080 as stated on the Sony product page?

Thanks,
Daniel
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Old February 27th, 2011, 10:35 PM   #7
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

You're misreading a recording specification for XDCAM-EX as being the same as a camera output specification. These things are not the same at all.

http://ws.sel.sony.com/PIPWebService...p%20Manual.pdf

Bottom of page 20, in regards to the dual link output (which can only be activated when in HQ 1920 59.94i recording mode):

NTSC Area : Port A: 1920 1080/59.94P@1.5G Port B: 1920 1080/59.94P@1.5G

What does this mean? If you set your SxS cards to record 1920x1080 59.94i, then you can simultaneously instruct the camera to output a 1920x1080 59.94p signal over Dual Link HD-SDI
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Old February 27th, 2011, 11:01 PM   #8
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Ha, forum tag. I responded to your post on the other forum. You're right, I was misreading the product page but that also had to be a typo.
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Old February 27th, 2011, 11:06 PM   #9
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Shipsides View Post
So Sony fit the 60p in by reducing resolution. The F800 does something similar with a reduced vertical resolution. Now if only their was an affordable 1080 60p external recorder.
Well we'll just have to wait and see at NAB. Almost no point in speculating except for amusement. Sony reps have leaked out some vague info but not enough to hang your hat on and I am sure they will be treading this one very carefully waiting for announcements from others before releasing any info on pricing. Right now there are only a couple of reference points for them to base their pricing but obviously this is going to change within the next 8 weeks.
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Old March 1st, 2011, 09:33 PM   #10
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Yea. This forum got me going too.. starting believing it was possible. No 60p recording in 1440 or 1080 right now.

However I found that if you set the camera to 1080 59.94i and change the output to Dual Link... then you will get a 1080 60p output. No firmware needed. Now you just need a CineDeck or something similar to record it. :)
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Old March 2nd, 2011, 01:03 AM   #11
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

eye heart Cinedeck.


Cant wait to buy one.
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Old March 2nd, 2011, 05:08 AM   #12
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Any idea on how color accurate the monitor is? Can it compare to a TV Logic or samllHD? Also, does it record ProRes 4:4:4:4 or only uncompressed 4:4:4?

Thanks much!
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Old March 4th, 2011, 05:43 AM   #13
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

I have an F3 and a Cinedeck extreme. I'll give it a try, 1080 60p.
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Old March 4th, 2011, 10:32 AM   #14
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Hi guys. I'm happy to report that the 1080/60p recording with the F3 and Cinedeck works very well. After reading this thread, I was compelled to do a test. I conformed the 60p file to 23.98 for a nice slow motion effect.

To clear up some confusing things I keep hearing posted here and there in forums.

1.) The output at the dual link SDI is full raster 1920x1080
2.) This does not require a firmware upgrade (recording 4:2:2 only, no S-log)

Let me know if you have any questions.
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Old March 4th, 2011, 10:48 AM   #15
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Re: 60p resolution hit?

Aaron,

That's good news. Thanks for doing the tests. On a side note, have you had any trouble with the Cinedeck overheating? I'm considering a purchase.

Thanks,
Daniel
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