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Sony XDCAM PMW-F3 CineAlta
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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:06 AM   #16
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Image quality between the F3 and F800 is too close to call. I honestly don't know which one is technically better.

Right now my default camera is the F800. About the only time I use the F3 these days is for interviews or other types of shooting where I want an extra shallow DoF. But even in that regard, the difference between the two cameras is not as much as some people seem to think.

I think a lot of people who are all excited about the shallow DoF capabilites of super-35 cameras are coming from a 1/3" or 1/2" background. Yes, that is a big jump. But if you compare super-35 to 2/3" the difference is not as great as you'd think. Especially if you have a fast lens, such as my f/1.7 Fujinon on the F800 and a slower lens on the super-35mm. I think it is funny when people put a slow lens on the F3 or FS100 because it kills the whole reason for using those cameras in the first place.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:16 AM   #17
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

That Fujinon HA 22 lens looks lovely. I use a Canon HJ22 - I'm not sure if there is any real difference in quality between the two? Does your Fujinon work with the cameras CA reduction feature? I just had a shoot in Abu Dhabi, below is a short extract from a photo shoot I covered. This just couldn't have been shot on an F3!

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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:37 AM   #18
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

For about 50K you would really hope that the F800 would SMOKE a 20k camera.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:41 AM   #19
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

unfortunately it doesn't work out that way! The image you get from the F3 is so 'clean', I really do like it. It's just a pain to use with TVLOGIC monitor, 2 noga arms, Samurai on back, v lock batteries, shoulder support........
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Old February 7th, 2012, 10:27 AM   #20
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Doug, do you what the difference is between your Fujinon ZA22x7.6BERM and the Fujinon HA22X7.3BERM? Looking at getting a used HA22 for a good price.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 11:48 AM   #21
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Porter View Post
For about 50K you would really hope that the F800 would SMOKE a 20k camera.
Things changed, very quickly. The F800 is very, very good, but the F3 is THAT good, noise-wise. And now we have the F65 in a 90% usable package for $85K.

I spent 4 days with a reality producer the other week who simply knew of the F3, but hadn't seen what it can do. Some night-time shots examined on a monitor had him exclaiming a bit.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 02:29 PM   #22
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Quote:
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Doug, do you what the difference is between your Fujinon ZA22x7.6BERM and the Fujinon HA22X7.3BERM?
About $12,000.

Seriously, I don't know what the visible difference is. My contact at Fujinon pretty much steered me away from spending more than I needed to and suggested that the ZA was just as good. Yes it does have ALAC, but you have to look real, real close to see what it does.

The only thing I don't like about my lens is the breathing, but I don't know if the HA suffers from the same thing. I've gotten a little spoiled by the primes on my F3.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 02:34 PM   #23
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

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And now we have the F65 in a 90% usable package for $85K.
No doubt the F65 is a great camera. but even at that price, if I traded my F800 for an F65 I'd go out of business pretty fast. The different workflow requirements and hassles associated with the F65 would kill my productivity. I don't work in Hollywood and don't pretend to work in Hollywood. I work in broadcast television and corporate video, and the F65 is way overkill. There's nobody I work for that would have any idea what to do with those files.

The F800 & F3 combo is working out pretty well for me.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 02:37 PM   #24
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

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For about 50K you would really hope that the F800 would SMOKE a 20k camera.
And it does. Not necessarily in picture quaity, but in ergonomics, workflow, versatility and many other ways. The difference in cost between a $50K camera and a $20K camera doesn't amount to very much to a busy professional when you spread it out over 2-3 years. Especially if the more expensive camera actually allows you to get more work done faster and better. #1 thing to remember -- this is a business first. I look at every equipment decision partly based on productivity and efficiency.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 03:13 PM   #25
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

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No doubt the F65 is a great camera. but even at that price, if I traded my F800 for an F65 I'd go out of business pretty fast. The different workflow requirements and hassles associated with the F65 would kill my productivity.
I was only making a statement about how fast things are moving.

?
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Old February 7th, 2012, 03:44 PM   #26
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

I agree, they are moving fast. Sorry if I didn't get your meaning.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 06:26 PM   #27
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Well, once again I've generated a lot of conversation at my own expense.

It would be great to see some practical mini tutorials on how to color grade some material recorded with s-log, without the smart ass commentary because I can't relate to it.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:52 PM   #28
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Smart ass commentary? I didn't see any smart ass commentary in this thread. What are you referring to?
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Old February 8th, 2012, 02:23 AM   #29
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

I guess Peter doesn't like the fact that I felt his shots were over exposed. If your not prepared to get comments, it's best not to post images.

The tutorial would have to start with exposing correctly as if the original footage is over exposed, no amount of grading will ever be able to recover the lost highlights. Of course perhaps that was the look Peter was after, but blown out highlights is not a look that I like.
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Old February 8th, 2012, 09:11 AM   #30
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Re: Does S-Log need to be graded all the time?

Alister, I could not have said it better myself.
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