Monitoring S-Log color - Page 2 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Sony XAVC / XDCAM / NXCAM / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Sony Digital Cinema Camera Systems > Sony XDCAM PMW-F3 CineAlta

Sony XDCAM PMW-F3 CineAlta
HD recording with a Super35 CMOS Sensor.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 12th, 2012, 10:24 AM   #16
Vortex Media
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 2,484
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Duke, it's great that S-LOG is working for you.

I will only say that I disagree with most of what you have posted regarding your perceived problems or shortcomings of shooting with the F3 without S-LOG. Maybe if you're talking about a F3 that came out of the box with factory-default settings, but that is not what I compare S-LOG to.
__________________
Vortex Media http://www.vortexmedia.com/
Sony FS7, F55, and XDCAM training videos, field guides, and other production tools
Doug Jensen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 12th, 2012, 10:42 AM   #17
Wrangler
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 6,781
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Doug, next time you are shooting high-contrast footage (such as subject in shade, background in sun), it would be great if you could roll off and then post a full-res frame grab of your preferred profile plus s-log of the same shot, so us devoted s-log users could get an objective sense of what you are describing.
__________________
Charles Papert
www.charlespapert.com
Charles Papert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 12th, 2012, 11:21 AM   #18
Vortex Media
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New England, USA
Posts: 2,484
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Charles, I have already done that.
PMW-F3 S-LOG & External Recorders Test Drive

Besides, my point is not to talk anyone out of using S-LOG who really feels they need it. For some people is is a powerful feature of the F3. My point is that the F3 is a great camera even without S-LOG. And for many of us, that tiny difference that S-LOG might make on a few shots here and there is not enough to outweigh the extra gear required to record it, monitoring issues for clients, grading everything in post, rendering, etc.

The bottom line is that people can still get great results without S-LOG -- and often even better. Why? Because a lot of people using S-LOG obviously do not have the skills, the time, or the right software to deal with the S-LOG footage properly.
__________________
Vortex Media http://www.vortexmedia.com/
Sony FS7, F55, and XDCAM training videos, field guides, and other production tools
Doug Jensen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 12th, 2012, 07:18 PM   #19
Telecam Films
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 723
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Whoa! Impressive sampling work Doug, do you ever sleep?
__________________
Thierry Humeau, DoP
Télécam Films
www.telecamfilms.com
Thierry Humeau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2012, 10:10 AM   #20
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Westcliff-On-Sea, Essex, England
Posts: 154
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

I have to agree with Doug. I purchased S-LOG but I find it much more time consuming to use, and I have actually reverted to using the camera without it and just the picture profile I developed - which I find is giving me a great punchy sharp image from the camera. Sparky
Mark McCarthy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2012, 05:39 PM   #21
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1,684
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Would it be rude to suggest that we stick to the subject of the thread. Seems to me its kind of pointless to argue over whether or not you think sLog is worth shooting. If you don't like it don't use it. If you want to discuss pros & cons of sLog start another thread.

Would love to hear more input from people who actually s-Log as to how they monitor and whether they use LUT's.
Leonard Levy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 09:17 AM   #22
Trustee
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Atlanta GA
Posts: 1,427
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

I could have sworn there was an option to record slog out one port and monitor a corrected lut out of the second port. Am I misremembering that? Would that be a solution?
__________________
I have a dream that one day canon will release a 35mm ef to xl adapter and I'll have iris control and a 35mm dof of all my ef lenses, and it will be awesome...
Nick Hiltgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 09:39 AM   #23
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Teaneck, NJ
Posts: 659
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

You can record S-Log from the Dual Link ports and monitor a LUT from either the SDI or HDMI port. If you simultaneously record to SxS cards, the recorded signal will be S-Log
Ned Soltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 10:03 AM   #24
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Miami, Florida, USA
Posts: 479
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

FROM SONY:

As an image using S-Log gamma has low
contrast, it may be unsuitable for image checking
at the shooting location. MLUT (Monitor Look
Up Table) converts the contrast of the image
recorded on the camcorder and the output image
except Dual-Link output (image output from the
HD/SD SDI, HDMI OUT i.LINK, or VIDEO
OUT connector) to produce an image suitable for
checking. Use MLUT when you shoot images
using S-Log gamma without any adjustments, on
the assumption that the images will be output as
Dual-Link output and recorded on an external
device to be processed to post-production.
Notes
• If the setting of “S-Log LUT Select” of the
VIDEO SET menu is other than “Off,” MLUT
is applied to images recorded on the camcorder.
• MLUT conversion does not affect Dual-link
output.
• MLUT can be used only for the output with SLog
gamma.
The camcorder is provided with four preset
LUTs. In addition to the preset LUTs, LUTs that
the user has created independently can be loaded.
A user LUT must be created with
CvFileEditorTM 1) and loaded into the camcorder
via an SxS memory card.
For details, refer to “CvpFileEditor V4.20 User
Guide.”
You can download the latest version of
CvpFileEditor from the“eCSite” software
download site for the professional and business
products of Sony Corporation.
Note
The camcorder supports user LUT data of RGB
10-bit format. LUT data of 12-bit format or
having different RGB values cannot be managed
by the camcorder.
1) CvpFileEditor is a trademark of Sony Corporation.
To select MLUT
When selecting MLUT other than S-Log EI mode
Set “S-Log LUT” of the VIDEO SET menu to
“On” then select the desired MLUT with “S-Log
LUT Select.”
__________________
Douglas Villalba - director/cinematographer/editor
Miami, Florida, USA - www.DVtvPRODUCTIONS.com
Douglas Villalba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 11:45 AM   #25
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Efland NC, USA
Posts: 2,315
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ned Soltz View Post
You can record S-Log from the Dual Link ports and monitor a LUT from either the SDI or HDMI port. If you simultaneously record to SxS cards, the recorded signal will be S-Log
On mine the recording on the SxS cards is not S-Log when a monitor LUT is selected. It is the monitor LUT that is recorded on the SxS card.
__________________
http://www.LandYachtMedia.com
Chris Medico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 02:24 PM   #26
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Teaneck, NJ
Posts: 659
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Sorry, Chris. I meant to say that the LUT will be recorded to the SxS card.

It is what happens when a single-tasking brain attempts to multi-task.

Thanks for catching it.

Ned
Ned Soltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 02:45 PM   #27
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Malibu, CA
Posts: 480
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Lenny, maybe a previously discussed suggestion but have you tried out the Hypergamma's? HG 33 & 40 I've found them to look pretty good with a minimal amount of monitor tweeking. I've even recorded them instead of S-Log with good results.

Interested to hear other people's take on these two special LUT's.
Bruce Schultz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2012, 05:39 PM   #28
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1,684
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Thanks Bruce,

Glad to have your input.

I haven't tried them except to look at them briefly. Do you find recording the hypergamma LUT's better than just recording cinegammas?

The major issue I have with all of the LUTs though is that they all seem quite desaturated to me and I'm wondering what other people do about that. I like to see my color and find it helpful.
You mentioned a "minimal amount of monitor tweaking". What are you tweaking ? Is it mainly the saturation ? Do you set it and leave it or tweak for individual shots with an awareness in the back of your mind that you know what's on the sLog and it doesn't matter if you bounce your monitor around a bit.
Are you using the Red and Blue SLog adjustments? I've found them pretty easy to use and quite helpful.
Leonard Levy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2012, 09:27 PM   #29
Trustee
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,554
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Does anyone have the link to download the CVP editor? I looked for it a couple months back, but I couldn't find it.

From what I have read, I believe the F3 uses 3D LUTs which means you have full control over color including saturation. I have some experience with 3D LUTs from vfx work, and I want to create some LUTs to use within the F3 as well as certain software such as After Effects and Resolve.

For basic grading, I use a Curves effect (a S curve) in PPro which works great to boost contrast and saturation.

For monitoring, I sometimes use the Rec709 (800%) LUT when someone else needs to watch while filming> When its just me and a Director who is experienced with S-Log footage, I don't use a LUT.
Steve Kalle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 15th, 2012, 10:52 PM   #30
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Guayaquil, Ecuador
Posts: 58
Re: Monitoring S-Log color

Here you have...

Index of /manuals/Sony/CVP File Editor

Courtesy of Stephen Cocklin at DVXuser.com
Henry Epstein is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Sony XAVC / XDCAM / NXCAM / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Sony Digital Cinema Camera Systems > Sony XDCAM PMW-F3 CineAlta

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:36 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network