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Old November 28th, 2007, 05:24 PM   #16
Fred Retread
 
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Bob, I agree with the guy at the store. If you take a mic signal, put it through the superior preamps of the SD 302, then knock it back down to mic level, put it through the inferior preamps of the HV20 and record it as an MP2 file (!!??) then what have you gotten for your $1300? Extra gear to haul around and hook up. The top three reasons listed in a post above for using a mixer don't apply to you.

However, I have to agree with Martin that you'll have a fine piece of equipment in your kit to use with anything that you purchase or rent later, so if you've got money burning a hole in your pocket, go for it. But be aware that your videography is likely to suffer a bit due to the distraction until you get a handle on it. Personally, I'd go for some better mics and a standalone recorder and experiment with mic placement. If you can afford to do it all, great!
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Old November 28th, 2007, 05:37 PM   #17
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Bob, I agree with the guy at the store. If you take a mic signal, put it through the superior preamps of the SD 302, then knock it back down to mic level, put it through the inferior preamps of the HV20 and record it as an MP2 file (!!??) then what have you gotten for your $1300? Extra gear to haul around and hook up. The top three reasons listed in a post above for using a mixer don't apply to you.
Depends on the circuit. My Canon XL2 only has Mic inputs. No problem with quality. Is this camera one of those HDV format cameras?

Regards,

Ty Ford
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Old November 28th, 2007, 05:41 PM   #18
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There's also modules that pull SMPTE out of the LANC signal that many prosumer cameras have.

Ty Ford
Ty, I was looking for one of these but couldn't find one (no longer available, ...). Do you know which company currently produces such a thing and where to get it?
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Old November 28th, 2007, 05:43 PM   #19
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After the help here from different members and investigating I use the follwing with my HV20:
Beachteck DXA2 adaptor, mixpre, Sennheiser G2 wireless, Rode NTG-2 and Sennheiser ME64.
This is a good basic setup and will last for when I step up to better cam. It pretty much gives me flexibilty in any situation, solo, or with boom op.
The ME64 goes on cam and is perfect for verité. If I use the beachteck in combo with mixpre then this gives me 3 channels too. The option is also there for total wirless if need be.
I know the big guys dont like beachteks and whatnot, but I'm happy so far with this for my level of work.
Hope thats of some help. Ben
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Old November 28th, 2007, 06:02 PM   #20
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Ty, I was looking for one of these but couldn't find one (no longer available, ...). Do you know which company currently produces such a thing and where to get it?
Have you put "SMPTE" anf "LANC" in Google?

Regards,

Ty
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Old November 28th, 2007, 06:28 PM   #21
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Depends on the circuit. My Canon XL2 only has Mic inputs. No problem with quality. Is this camera one of those HDV format cameras?
Yes it is.
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Old November 28th, 2007, 07:08 PM   #22
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Well then you won't win any awards for the audio.

Ty Ford
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Old November 28th, 2007, 08:29 PM   #23
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Excellent. I'm glad there is a consensus :))

It sounds like I won't know until I test it. So plan A is to rent a 302 and run some content from it into the camera, compared with mic directly into camera. Does that sound reasonable?

Plan B is to give up and try to resurrect the era of silent movies!!

Cheers,
Bob
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Old November 28th, 2007, 08:43 PM   #24
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Bob,

That's a VERY, VERY good idea. Just make sure you give it a good shot by using a good set of monitors and listening deeply with a good set of headphones. Computer speakers won't do.

Regards,

Ty
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Old November 28th, 2007, 09:21 PM   #25
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Plan B is not an option, Bob 8>). But Plan A sounds like a winner. Please let us know what you find.
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Old November 29th, 2007, 01:23 AM   #26
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Depends on the circuit. My Canon XL2 only has Mic inputs. No problem with quality. Is this camera one of those HDV format cameras?

Regards,

Ty Ford
The HV20's audio circuit is, unfortunately, rather bad, even by consumer camera standards.

I've done some things with a HV20 and a SD702, also partly as a solo shooter. My solution was in the end to go double system, and film the SD702's counter at the beginning and/or the end of each take. During post I added an aux TC track to the video (in Final Cut, using the offset from the filmed counter and a little applescript for the maths), then multiclipped audio and video tracks.
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Old November 29th, 2007, 05:59 AM   #27
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The HV20's audio circuit is, unfortunately, rather bad, even by consumer camera standards.
Due to HDV or something worse?

Regards,

Ty Ford
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Old November 29th, 2007, 08:14 AM   #28
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Due to HDV or something worse?

Regards,

Ty Ford

No. I can live with HDV 192Kbit. The HV20 (at least mine) has a very noisy mic-in. Much noisier than my old TRV900, which was still noiser than the lousy PD150, wich was in turn worse than the Z1, which is still far from sony's pro cams, which still play in a different league than Sound Devices or HHB or whatever.

I love it, the HV20. Great little camera. But in my view, HV20 sound is hopeless. To feed it with a all the love and care that comes out of a SD302 does not get one very far, imho.
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Old December 1st, 2007, 11:37 AM   #29
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I love it, the HV20. Great little camera. But in my view, HV20 sound is hopeless. To feed it with a all the love and care that comes out of a SD302 does not get one very far, imho.
I'm affraid you may be correct. I went back the the audio shop yesterday with the HV 20 to rent an SD302. We spent some time trying to to find the right cables and plugs to make it work. The plug hardware on your run of the mill audio cable is way beefier than the jack on the HV 20; it would barely seat properly in the hole. It took some trial and error to find the right set of cables with a small enough mini plug.

Then there were issues with configuring the two. The mic stage of the HV 20 is really not set up to take input from a mixer, it seems, as the tech had to make numerous adjustments to the 302 to get it right.

My initial impression is that the 302 is a fine piece of gear that would be an investment in any kit...any kit where the camera has a serious audio stage. We were both left wondering: Why do you want a $1000 mixer plugged into your $800 camera with amateur audio stage?

I keep focusing on the word "investment" ......... The audio tech salesman suggested dumping the camera, that anything I buy toward the more pro end would have sufficient audio to eliminate my desire to fuss around with a mixer.

So I'm going to spend today testing the quality of mixer vs no mixer to see if I can tell a difference. More to follow.
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Old December 1st, 2007, 07:10 PM   #30
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::Sigh::

The switch to mic level out is in the menu, not a hard switch on the unti itself.

Once you do that and calibrate the mixer to the camera, you should be fine.

Regards,

Ty
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