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Taking Care of Business
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Old September 2nd, 2004, 02:51 PM   #31
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<<<-- Originally posted by Jeff Donald : It's actually pretty easy for a bank to find out about other accounts you may have and put a hold on the accounts, pending court action. -->>>

What is the basis for your assertions?

Actually, a Bank will NOT put a hold on anything without a court order.

So, If PayPal gets a chargeback, and claims I owe them money, my bank will not do anything until PayPal sues me, is awarded a legal judgement, and obtains a court order for the bank to seize the funds. Even if PayPal wins a judgement it is not automatic that they will get a court order to sieze the funds because certain kinds of funds and assests are protected. In a worst-case scenario the debtor must be allowed to recover by filing bankruptcy. It's a long and hard process to actually get your hands on the money someone owes you.

Banks do not get involved in settling debt disputes. They only respond to court orders. Think about it. Otherwise, I could just claim that you owe me $10,000.00 and send a claim to your Bank that would at least tie up your funds. It just doesn't work that way.

But when you propagate false statements about anyone or any company without a solid basis to do so, you are making at least borderline slander. How would you like it if someone was making false claims about you?

All I ask is if you're going to post something very negative about PayPal, then back it up with facts, not opinions and hearsay.

By no means is PayPal perfect. If I had any other options, they would be well considered. Without PayPal, or some similar service, the online auctions and sales by small sellers would just about dry up. Because the only other option is sending a stranger cash, which is many, many times more risky than PayPal. That would end up hurting us all because we would not have a safe way to buy/sell cool equipment from one another. :-)

Look, I'm not going to continue the debate about PayPal. Just read the actual PayPal policy documents, and talk to your lawyer if you have any questions.

Let's get back to more interesting, more positive things: DV
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Old September 2nd, 2004, 03:11 PM   #32
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No one answered the question about Ebay owning Paypal now?? That makes a difference if it's true. Anyone know anything about it?

Christopher C. Murphy
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Old September 2nd, 2004, 03:32 PM   #33
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Yes Paypal is an eBay company.

About Us


Founded in 1998, PayPal, an eBay Company, enables any individual or business with an email address to securely, easily and quickly send and receive payments online. PayPal's service builds on the existing financial infrastructure of bank accounts and credit cards and utilizes the world's most advanced proprietary fraud prevention systems to create a safe, global, real-time payment solution.
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Old September 3rd, 2004, 12:10 AM   #34
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Re: Re: It happened to me...

>Did PayPal take the funds out of your PayPal account, or out >of your bank account?

Out of my Paypal account (I never gave them my bank account info)

>What did they mean by "obtained illegally"? Who obtained >the funds illegallly, and from where?
The purchaser of my goods. They wouldn't expand on the explanation, but my assumption is a stolen credit card (It was an overseas purchaser)

>Did they have the Seller Protection Policy at that time, and if >so, did you follow it?
At the time I wasn't eligable, as I was Canadian and it didn't apply to me.

>Did you ever talk to an attorney? [I know an attorney would >probably cost more than the amt in dispute :-(( ]
No, I never did for the reason you outlined.

>Did they give you an opportunity to rebut the claim?
No, there was no opportunity as I had no control over the source of the buyer's funds.

It was a fairly long time ago that this occured, it just left me with a very poor taste in my mouth. I now also no longer ship overseas as a precaution.
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Old September 15th, 2004, 10:19 PM   #35
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From the Real World

Wow. Obviously no one in this thread has ever had a real merchant account. To give you some perspective on these issues, PayPal and all other credit card processors must abide by the contractual obligations set by the credit card companies, which include the potential for chargebacks. It is a major aggravation for honest business owners, but a reality that is part of protecting all of us card holders from unscrupulous businesses.

Businesses that accept credit cards are contractually obligated to maintain a balance to cover potential chargebacks, which can be a hefty amount for even a small business.

We had one business that charged back a substantial amount not once, but three times. They admitted their fault and apologized every time, but I began to think it was a subterfuge to stay in the black at the end of the month. The last time, we had them write a check rather than having the processor reverse the chargeback.

Accepting credit cards comes with a price.
John Jackman
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Old September 15th, 2004, 10:29 PM   #36
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Part of the "confusion" is that sellers, buyers and merchants are contractually governed by different agreements. The fact that PayPal is not a "real" bank also means they are governed (or not) by a different set of laws.
Jeff Donald
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Old September 15th, 2004, 11:30 PM   #37
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So, John, what are you saying? Paypal bad or good? Chargebacks can happen even when money is in your bank account (as in, no longer in the Paypal account) or not?
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Old September 17th, 2004, 08:59 PM   #38
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Josh, I'm not saying PayPal is "good" or "bad." I'm just telling you that the potential for chargebacks is a part of the real-world risk of accepting credit cards. The PayPal agreement (which of course you agreed to when you signed up) reads:

When you receive funds through PayPal, if the sender's transaction is reversed for any reason and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy for that transaction, you will owe PayPal for the amount of the reversed transaction plus, for chargebacks, a $10.00 USD chargeback fee. You agree to reimburse PayPal from either your PayPal account or by other means

I don't know if PayPal can pull the $$ out of your bank account for a chargeback, depends on the category of their agreement with the bank. Probably they can. With a real merchant account, the gateway company can suck the money out and you only have 24 hours to dispute it with the bank, after that you have to go to court if you can't come to an agreement.
John Jackman
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Old September 17th, 2004, 09:38 PM   #39
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Still sounds suckalicious to me. Maybe I'll keep the account and use it only when I'm a buyer, and accept personal checks only or some such.
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