In camera filmlook at DVinfo.net
DV Info Net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Techniques for Independent Production

Techniques for Independent Production
The challenges of creating Digital Cinema and other narrative forms.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old January 27th, 2008, 07:27 PM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 265
In camera filmlook

iam using the hvx200 to shoot a short, i know its better to keep the image clean
for post. i want to attempt to colorize and commit to a filmlook incamera. Is there something to watch out for that i dont overdo, someone mentioned saturation. thoughts?
Roshdi Alkadri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 28th, 2008, 02:26 AM   #2
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 1,961
Anything that causes you to lose detail either in the exposure or the color should be avoided. If you choose to crush the blacks or blow out the highlights in the camera, you might not be happy once you get to the editing bay.
Marcus Marchesseault is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 28th, 2008, 03:04 AM   #3
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Billericay, England UK
Posts: 4,711
If you're really serious in wanting to create the look you're after in camera rather than in post, best thing you can do is connect up your camera to a good monitor or well set up TV.

Now you can tripod the camera, point it out the window and fiddle about in the menu all day long. You'll quickly see what gains and losses come with all the various options, and can make decisions based on the pictures you see. Of course if you're monitoring on a CRT then it'll look different on an LCD or plasma, and also once upscaled from SD DVD.

With that in mind I'd say go for the look you want as every display device will show it somewhat differently.

tom.
Tom Hardwick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 30th, 2008, 11:16 PM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 265
ok thanks guys
Roshdi Alkadri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31st, 2008, 12:37 AM   #5
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sydney New South Wales
Posts: 34
Hey Roshdi
With never seeing the camera please dont quote me, but the hardwork may have ben done for you. If it is capable of loading scene profiles then hunt around on the net for a film look scene that you can download and the save to your camera via a sd card or something.

I agree with Tom, you should hook the camera up to a monitor untill your happy with the look

I would try shooting as wide open as possible and back from your subject to get as little depth of field as possible. This will give you that film look.. Correct the color in post

Hope i could help
Allan Coy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31st, 2008, 04:45 AM   #6
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 1,961
I just remembered the most important aspect of getting a good look with video. Make sure you get technically accurate exposure and don't ruin it by overcompensating for difficult shooting conditions. For instance, don't increase the exposure because you are having a tough time seeing the LCD in a bright place. Use the zebra bars (and histogram if you have it) to make sure your exposure is within the limits of your camera. You want to ensure that you have as much information gathered as possible with few clipped highlights and crushed blacks. You can make some adjustments to the color and exposure curves in the camera but you always want to get the most information captured as possible.

The reason to get the most information as possible is due to one of the fundamental weaknesses with video cameras compared to film. Film has a greater exposure latitude so anything that limits your video exposure latitude further moves you away from the film look.
Marcus Marchesseault is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31st, 2008, 05:59 AM   #7
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sydney New South Wales
Posts: 34
determine filmlook

When asking for a film look from a dv/hdv cam, it would have to be depth of field. If you cant mount some fixed lenses i would try and shoot as wide open as possible in a controlled lighting environment and as far away from the subject to achieve this. Of course if you cant control lighting you would alway expose for the best result.

The problem with hdv is the extreame depth of field this taking it to the other end of the scale from film (with some nice prime lenses attatched)
Allan Coy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 31st, 2008, 03:00 PM   #8
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Billericay, England UK
Posts: 4,711
For the shortest D o F you need to be close to your subject with the background as far away as possible. Is this what you mean Allan? Also use very wide apertures and long focal lengths.

But most of all use big chips. HDV doesn't have extreme depth of field Allan, it's simply an MPEG recording system.

tom.
Tom Hardwick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2008, 09:14 PM   #9
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: california North and South
Posts: 642
I use my electronic ND at it's highest setting (outside) then even add a ND or two on the lens to force the aperature nearly max wide open... of course shooting 24p at 1/48th or 1/60th of a second.
Alex Humphrey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 5th, 2008, 01:31 AM   #10
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sydney New South Wales
Posts: 34
True tom i should of narrowed it down to the smaller chipped HDV cams
Allan Coy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 5th, 2008, 03:33 AM   #11
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Billericay, England UK
Posts: 4,711
What on earth's an electronic ND, Alex? You can't mean you shorten the shutter speed as you go on to say you shoot at 1/48th sec.
Tom Hardwick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 5th, 2008, 06:35 PM   #12
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 265
my gatherings: use cinelike gamma curve at 24pa with a shutter of 1/48.
Use ND when outside forcing the opening of the iris for shallower depth of field, go far from subject, or open iris wide or be close to subject who's far from the background for the shallow depth of field. Light it like film, dont overxpose or crush the blacks, record to the dynamic of the camera. Use an external monitor if possible to see how it really looks like. Light like film, record sound like film, let the actors do real acting to make it like a film, edit and post like film
Roshdi Alkadri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 6th, 2008, 09:03 PM   #13
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sydney New South Wales
Posts: 34
Hey Roshdi

Only use the amount of ND that applies for the lighting conditions. You dont want to knock down the amount of light by 4 stops (for example) only to have to open it up 4 stops to achieve optimal pics.

DEPTH OF FIELD (FOCUS)

The zone in the front and back of the area focused upon that will remain in focus. Anything within this depth of field will appear sharp. Depth of field has the following features:

1. Larger F-numbers give shallower depth of field. The more the iris is stopped down the greater the depth of field.
2. Shorter focal lengths give greater depth of field.
3. Greater subject distance gives greater depth of field.
4. Depth of field is greater behind the subject than in front.

http://www.isorainbow.com/tech/depth.html

See link for formula

Last edited by Allan Coy; February 6th, 2008 at 09:04 PM. Reason: adding link
Allan Coy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 7th, 2008, 05:58 PM   #14
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 265
thanks allan
Roshdi Alkadri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 8th, 2008, 08:19 PM   #15
New Boot
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South Haven, MN
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allan Coy View Post
Hey Roshdi

Only use the amount of ND that applies for the lighting conditions. You dont want to knock down the amount of light by 4 stops (for example) only to have to open it up 4 stops to achieve optimal pics.

DEPTH OF FIELD (FOCUS)

The zone in the front and back of the area focused upon that will remain in focus. Anything within this depth of field will appear sharp. Depth of field has the following features:

1. Larger F-numbers give shallower depth of field. The more the iris is stopped down the greater the depth of field.
2. Shorter focal lengths give greater depth of field.
3. Greater subject distance gives greater depth of field.
4. Depth of field is greater behind the subject than in front.

http://www.isorainbow.com/tech/depth.html

See link for formula
I believe you copied #1 wrong from the website. The larger the f-stop, the larger the depth of field. So if you want that film like shallow depth of field, you want the f-stop to be as low as possible, which opens up the iris as wide as possible.
Adam Sparks is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY USA

Scan Computers Int. Ltd.
+44 0871-472-4747
Bolton, Lancashire UK


DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Techniques for Independent Production

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:15 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2024 The Digital Video Information Network