Gunshot FX- Where to get/make squibs? at DVinfo.net

Jeff Patnaude · March 11th, 2004, 10:21 AM

After doing some reading, and always having been curious, where do you get squibs from for gunshot effects? Is there an online place to order? Are they protected- and require a permit? Has anyone made them?

I have my own ideas of construction- usually with igniters from model rocketry and such, but I'd like to a. be as safe as possible, and b. go right to the source.

I'm also aware of the "pull string' effect, but I'm also interested in smoke and buying blanks.

Info greatly appreciated!

Jeff Patnaude

Aaron Rosen · March 11th, 2004, 12:37 PM

Check out this link - A good detailed article on squibs and fake blood.

LINK: www.dvfreelancer.com/articles/squibs.html

Joe Gioielli · March 11th, 2004, 12:48 PM

Jeff, my real thought here is to hire a pro. Gun powder, esp black powder, is touchy stuff. I am a shooter and ammo reloader and I have a healthy respect for this stuff.
Ask you local mayor who does your Fourth of July fireworks and contact them. They may know somebody.

If you make something yourself and someone gets hurt, you're going to get in a lot of trouble. You could even get hurt just creating this stuff.

Depending on what you need, remember you don't need fire to make smoke. You can use a gardening product called "diatomatious[sp] earth". If you hit a small pile of that with a burst of air, you get smoke. That's safe, just don't inhale.

Rick Bravo · March 11th, 2004, 01:43 PM

Joe's right on. Dealing with squibs and blanks is a very dangerous business. We always have a special effects technician handle all of the squibs and / or an armorer to handle all of the blank firing weapons.

Besides, when you deal with squibs, you are dealing with explosive charges, ignition charges, incendiary devices and other things that go boom!

Probably not a good idea to get stopped in this day and age with a trunkfull of "bomb making" equipment unless you are a licensed technician.

Diatomaceous Earth, also known as Fuller's Earth is used to simulate bullet hits. These are plastic capsules, filled with Fuller's and fired from a specially modified paintball gun. The same is done with Zirconium, these are called "Zirc Hits", and the difference is that they spark on impact.

Gunfire, in real life is very anticlimactic. It is nothing like what you hear in the movies.

The best sound effects that we have ever gotten were from full-load theatrical stage blanks fired from specially modified firearms. Always remember that a "blank" will kill you just as fast as a real bullet if you are not careful. This is why we have an armorer on set to handle the guns, EXCLUSIVELY! He does nothing else except that.

I have a good link for smoke effects on my other computer. I'll post it tonight.

RB

James Emory · March 11th, 2004, 02:59 PM

Try these guys. They are located in Atlanta and provide what you're needing. They work on feature projects all the time.

Bob Shelley's Special Effects: 404.622.9245

John Heskett · March 11th, 2004, 03:09 PM

Try reading these links.

non-explosive bullet hits

http://www.exposure.co.uk/eejit/blood/index.html
http://www.exposure.co.uk/eejit/blood/blood.html

Rick Bravo · March 11th, 2004, 04:49 PM

http://www.tri-esssciences.com/specialeffects.htm

Some pretty cool smoke / fire / blood effects.

RB

Keith Loh · March 11th, 2004, 09:00 PM

I guess everyone knows about that Masonic ritual gone bad? True story, happened this week. They made this inductee sit in a chair and set up bottles and targets around him. They then brought out a gun to scare him that supposedly was loaded with blanks. Only, they brought out the wrong gun ...

Jeff Patnaude · March 12th, 2004, 09:17 AM

I heard about that.
Brandon Lee- killed on the set of "The Crow" the same way.

Rick Bravo · March 12th, 2004, 02:34 PM

Brandon Lee actually got killed in another type of incident.

Apparently the barrel of the gun was fouled, by a round that was "fired" inadvertently using only the cap. The firing cap produced enough energy to force the projectile into the barrel and lodged it there.

Fast forward to when the gun was supposed to be fired using a blank, which they did...the blank caused the projectile to leave the barrel and strike Lee. Killing him.

I don't remember what the outcome of the case was, whether it was negligence on the part of the Prop Department for not having checked the barrel, or what.

There was a case many years back where a soap opera star was joking around and put a gun loaded with blanks against his temple and pulled the trigger thinking that it would be a great joke. I don't think I have to go into detail about what happened next.

At long distances the bullet kills you. Up close, as in a contact wound, all you need is the explosion of gases to scrammble your innards, much like a powerhead or bang stick kills a shark.

Sometimes dealing with blanks is more dangerous than live rounds as it may lead people to believe that, since no bullets are fired, no one can get hurt.

RB

Heath McKnight · February 23rd, 2005, 11:28 PM

Be creative and use cool editing. Gun fires, cut to guy bleeding. It works!

I think you need a license to use firearms and stuff.

heath

Deniz Turkmen · May 5th, 2005, 06:43 PM

I asked the same question on this board last summer. Someone gave me this link:

http://www.creative-effects.com/Spec...Guns/guns.html

They're really cool, but just to warn you -- you'll need insurance to rent one.

Heath McKnight · May 5th, 2005, 08:35 PM

Please BE CAREFUL. Brandon Lee and THE CROW come to mind in these discussions...

heath

Deniz Turkmen · May 5th, 2005, 11:08 PM

The link I posted is for a non firing gun. It's pretty cool. It uses an electric charge to ignite flash powder. I haven't actually used one, but from the video clip on the site, it looks realistic. Plus they have everything from handguns to an M-16.

As far as safety goes, sure... I'd think twice before firing at someone's head, you never know what can happen, right? But if you read through the description they provide, it seems safe. It's just that the safety it provides is gonna cost you.

Rob Gregory-Browne · May 6th, 2005, 12:17 PM

Just fake it in post. Hell, Rodriguez did a lot of that in Once Upon a Time in Mexico and you can't tell the difference. Watch his behind the scenes video.

March 11th, 2004, 10:21 AM	#1
Jeff Patnaude Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Duluth, Georgia Posts: 248	Gunshot FX- Where to get/make squibs? After doing some reading, and always having been curious, where do you get squibs from for gunshot effects? Is there an online place to order? Are they protected- and require a permit? Has anyone made them? I have my own ideas of construction- usually with igniters from model rocketry and such, but I'd like to a. be as safe as possible, and b. go right to the source. I'm also aware of the "pull string' effect, but I'm also interested in smoke and buying blanks. Info greatly appreciated! Jeff Patnaude

March 11th, 2004, 12:48 PM	#3
Joe Gioielli Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: New Port Richey, Fl Posts: 142	Jeff, my real thought here is to hire a pro. Gun powder, esp black powder, is touchy stuff. I am a shooter and ammo reloader and I have a healthy respect for this stuff. Ask you local mayor who does your Fourth of July fireworks and contact them. They may know somebody. If you make something yourself and someone gets hurt, you're going to get in a lot of trouble. You could even get hurt just creating this stuff. Depending on what you need, remember you don't need fire to make smoke. You can use a gardening product called "diatomatious[sp] earth". If you hit a small pile of that with a burst of air, you get smoke. That's safe, just don't inhale. __________________ Why ask me? I thought you were in charge!

March 11th, 2004, 01:43 PM	#4
Rick Bravo Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 574	Hire a pro. Joe's right on. Dealing with squibs and blanks is a very dangerous business. We always have a special effects technician handle all of the squibs and / or an armorer to handle all of the blank firing weapons. Besides, when you deal with squibs, you are dealing with explosive charges, ignition charges, incendiary devices and other things that go boom! Probably not a good idea to get stopped in this day and age with a trunkfull of "bomb making" equipment unless you are a licensed technician. Diatomaceous Earth, also known as Fuller's Earth is used to simulate bullet hits. These are plastic capsules, filled with Fuller's and fired from a specially modified paintball gun. The same is done with Zirconium, these are called "Zirc Hits", and the difference is that they spark on impact. Gunfire, in real life is very anticlimactic. It is nothing like what you hear in the movies. The best sound effects that we have ever gotten were from full-load theatrical stage blanks fired from specially modified firearms. Always remember that a "blank" will kill you just as fast as a real bullet if you are not careful. This is why we have an armorer on set to handle the guns, EXCLUSIVELY! He does nothing else except that. I have a good link for smoke effects on my other computer. I'll post it tonight. RB __________________ "The future ain't what it used to be." Yogi Berra. www.rbravo.com

March 11th, 2004, 02:59 PM	#5
James Emory Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 1,892	Bob Shelley's SFX - Atlanta Try these guys. They are located in Atlanta and provide what you're needing. They work on feature projects all the time. Bob Shelley's Special Effects: 404.622.9245

March 11th, 2004, 03:09 PM	#6
John Heskett Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Terre Haute Indiana Posts: 181	Try reading these links. non-explosive bullet hits http://www.exposure.co.uk/eejit/blood/index.html http://www.exposure.co.uk/eejit/blood/blood.html __________________ Illuminate the Vision

March 11th, 2004, 12:37 PM	#2
Aaron Rosen Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: HB, CA - USA Posts: 298	Check out this link - A good detailed article on squibs and fake blood. LINK: www.dvfreelancer.com/articles/squibs.html

March 11th, 2004, 04:49 PM	#7
Rick Bravo Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 574	Here it is. http://www.tri-esssciences.com/specialeffects.htm Some pretty cool smoke / fire / blood effects. RB __________________ "The future ain't what it used to be." Yogi Berra. www.rbravo.com

March 11th, 2004, 09:00 PM	#8
Keith Loh Air China Pilot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 2,389	I guess everyone knows about that Masonic ritual gone bad? True story, happened this week. They made this inductee sit in a chair and set up bottles and targets around him. They then brought out a gun to scare him that supposedly was loaded with blanks. Only, they brought out the wrong gun ... __________________ -- Visit http://www.KeithLoh.com \| stuff about living in Vancouver \| My Flickr photo gallery

March 12th, 2004, 09:17 AM	#9
Jeff Patnaude Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Duluth, Georgia Posts: 248	I heard about that. Brandon Lee- killed on the set of "The Crow" the same way.

March 12th, 2004, 02:34 PM	#10
Rick Bravo Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 574	Jeff, Brandon Lee actually got killed in another type of incident. Apparently the barrel of the gun was fouled, by a round that was "fired" inadvertently using only the cap. The firing cap produced enough energy to force the projectile into the barrel and lodged it there. Fast forward to when the gun was supposed to be fired using a blank, which they did...the blank caused the projectile to leave the barrel and strike Lee. Killing him. I don't remember what the outcome of the case was, whether it was negligence on the part of the Prop Department for not having checked the barrel, or what. There was a case many years back where a soap opera star was joking around and put a gun loaded with blanks against his temple and pulled the trigger thinking that it would be a great joke. I don't think I have to go into detail about what happened next. At long distances the bullet kills you. Up close, as in a contact wound, all you need is the explosion of gases to scrammble your innards, much like a powerhead or bang stick kills a shark. Sometimes dealing with blanks is more dangerous than live rounds as it may lead people to believe that, since no bullets are fired, no one can get hurt. RB __________________ "The future ain't what it used to be." Yogi Berra. www.rbravo.com

February 23rd, 2005, 11:28 PM	#11
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Be creative and use cool editing. Gun fires, cut to guy bleeding. It works! I think you need a license to use firearms and stuff. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

May 5th, 2005, 06:43 PM	#12
Deniz Turkmen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CA Posts: 166	I asked the same question on this board last summer. Someone gave me this link: http://www.creative-effects.com/Spec...Guns/guns.html They're really cool, but just to warn you -- you'll need insurance to rent one.

May 5th, 2005, 08:35 PM	#13
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Please BE CAREFUL. Brandon Lee and THE CROW come to mind in these discussions... heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

May 5th, 2005, 11:08 PM	#14
Deniz Turkmen Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CA Posts: 166	The link I posted is for a non firing gun. It's pretty cool. It uses an electric charge to ignite flash powder. I haven't actually used one, but from the video clip on the site, it looks realistic. Plus they have everything from handguns to an M-16. As far as safety goes, sure... I'd think twice before firing at someone's head, you never know what can happen, right? But if you read through the description they provide, it seems safe. It's just that the safety it provides is gonna cost you.

May 6th, 2005, 12:17 PM	#15
Rob Gregory-Browne Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 107	Just fake it in post. Hell, Rodriguez did a lot of that in Once Upon a Time in Mexico and you can't tell the difference. Watch his behind the scenes video.