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Old October 13th, 2004, 02:13 PM   #16
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Chris, I didn't see anything that Keith F. wrote that said you necessarily had to make money at it, only that you had to have something in the can. To use the other analogies, the painter has to finish a work, the poet has to finish the last line, the novelist has to finish the epilogue. Whether or not they have an audience is a factor in their income, not in their process. I've written three screenplays, two of which have been read by industry people. I haven't made a dime on any of them. But by the act of writing and completing them, I feel I'm a step above someone with just the intention of doing so. Therefore, I would consider myself a screenwriter. I think the same would be for 'filmmaker'.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 02:27 PM   #17
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I understand the self-actualizing value of declaration.

The genesis of my question was the observation (as one of the registrars here) that so many members register their Occupation as "Filmmaker". Nearly as many also register "Director", "DP", or "Producer". Since the definition of "occupation" is, "An activity that serves as one's regular source of livelihood; a vocation." the intent of this optional field was to record peoples' vocations, not their aspirations or avocations.

I am not scolding anyone for misuse of the field. Rather, I am truly interested to discover how many of our members feed, clothe and house themselves from income principally derived as filmmakers (or producers, directors, directors of photography, et.al.).

The amalgamation of the computer and the video camera during the past 8-10 years has driven a stampede of computer-oriented young people into the world of videography, much the same as digital photography has induced this same group into photography. So my real suspicion is that the "occupation" of many, maybe most, of our members is actually in the I.T. arena (ex: programmers, Web site developers, software analysts, et.al.). I also suspect that we have a sizable population of students here.

Again, I am not criticizing or scolding anyone. Please don't feel the need to be defensive in any way. I am just curious and thought this might make for an interesting topic.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 02:37 PM   #18
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Christopher- Being an artist, is an act of creation, whether it is music, film, sculpture, or literature. It doesn't matter what medium, as long as you FINISH it, and display it. After all, isn't that why you do it? To show others what you see? Making money is a byproduct of selling a successful creation.

I have one feature length script that made it into preproduction before stalling. I have another story I'm working on, and two more on the back-back burners. Either way, since I have not finished a film, I am not a film maker... yet.

And, while we're at it, what constitutes a film? Is it strictly film, as in 35mm, or does video and animation count? Does it have to be feature length?
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Old October 13th, 2004, 03:37 PM   #19
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Keith, Emily Dickinson wrote poetry. But only a handful of it was published until after she died. She wasn't a poet when she produced it but she was only after others recognized it?
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Old October 13th, 2004, 03:50 PM   #20
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to reiterate, doesn't film mean the actual physical "film negative"? i always thought filmmaker is misnomer. even people who are in hollywood making movies. are they chemically creating the actual physical film like kodak? i mean if you speak on a very technical basis, kodak is a "filmmaker". that's why i like to use other terms cause even filmmaker the meta-physical/symbolic term itself is changing.

keith loh, i think keith forman was sayin that emily dickinson finished the poems herself. she is a poet regardless of what society and even herself thought. at least she finished a poem (or several). what keith is asking are those (like me) who say they are making movies... but have not completed a script, shot a tape or "completed" anything. are they still one? hence i tend to call myself a 'hack' =). i should change my title to that =D.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 04:28 PM   #21
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Yi Fong,
Not to break your train of thought, but are your replying that your "occupation" is or is not that of filmmaker/director/producer/etc.?
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Old October 13th, 2004, 04:36 PM   #22
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Wow, existential discussions... metaphysical realities... self actuallized motivations...

It's a forum for "PHILOSOPHERS"!


Richard Alvarez

Producer
Screenwriter
Videographer
Photographer
Editor
Writer
Director
Actor
Mime
Disk Jockey
Stunt Coordinator
Fencing Master
Teacher
Coach
Professional Jouster
Sailplane Pilot
Scuba Diver
FILMMAKER


And.... yes, I've made at least a little bit of money at all of those...Some a LOT of money at.

Generally, when people ask, I simply say "I've worked professionally in the media all my life." My philosphy has always been, "The more you CAN do, the more you WILL do". There are those who decry being a jack-of-all-trades, but I am one who believes specialization is for insects. (Thanks RH)

Oh, and perhaps the two most important occupations... husband and father.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 04:54 PM   #23
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Your closets must be an absolute riot, Richard! <g>
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Old October 13th, 2004, 05:02 PM   #24
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You know, Richard, that some philosophers make almost as much as some poets. But I'm sure both of them make more than the filmmakers I meet.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 07:57 PM   #25
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Ken,

I almost forgot my closets! Add "Costumer/Armorer" to the list. Hey, I've made some nice change renting out armor/horses/tack/swords... you name it. Heck, I can still tack and armor six horses and men, and I've sold most of my stuff.

I keep it hanging around for this great little script I want to shoot pretty soon... "KNIGHTSBRIDGE". A script I wrote to shoot in one location... a medieval knight guarding a bridge. Soon as my XL2 arrives, I'm going to start looking for a location up here in NorCal.

Hmmmm, never made a dime as a philosopher, though I was "Class Poet" in High School.... and a cheerleader.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 09:43 PM   #26
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Funny thing for me - I decided I wanted to be a writer in college. But at the same time I really liked technology and didn't want to starve. So fast forward years later and now I make web applications for a living. Strangely enough for me, the writing desire is what brought me to filmmaking, not the technology. For me, technology was a lovely bonus that made it possible for me to make my writing ideas into a visual reality.
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Old October 13th, 2004, 10:51 PM   #27
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ken if you go futher up this thread i've already said that moviemaking is a hobby and not my primary source of income.

<<<-- Originally posted by Ken Tanaka : Yi Fong,
Not to break your train of thought, but are your replying that your "occupation" is or is not that of filmmaker/director/producer/etc.? -->>>
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