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The TOTEM Poll: Totally Off Topic, Everything Media
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Old April 6th, 2004, 05:55 PM   #1
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No more Disney hand-drawn animation

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What do you think? Good, bad, neutral?
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Old April 6th, 2004, 06:24 PM   #2
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Short-sighted. The problem has been Disney's creative management, not the the medium. They probably won't be able to match Pixar in 3D either, the problem being the product, not the method of delivery.

Across the ocean, anime is still massively 2D.
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Old April 6th, 2004, 07:06 PM   #3
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I agree. 2D animation has just as much kick as Pixar's 3D masterpieces. "Treasure Planet" and "Atlantis: The Lost Empire" were both beautifully animated.

I can understand them needing to switch to digital animation. Hand drawing is very time consuming work, and it is sad to see it go. Haven't they been using 1/2 hand drawn and 1/2 digital for a while now?

Here's what I'm thinking though. Do you remember the Simpsons episode when Homer fell into the 3D world, and how strange it was to watch that? It was the same voices, same humor, same characters, but not the Simpsons. So much, in fact, that (personal opinion here) it was just wrong. I love that show, but if they switched to the 3D computer animated style, I wouldn't be able to adjust for quite some time simply because I've grown so attached to the current 2D.
Now imagine if Disney switches its decades of cartoon personality to a 3D medium. Mickey Mouse in 3D? Weird.
I have a feeling that, if they switch to 3D, Disney will sink quite a bit further. Hopefully their name and reputation will pull them through.
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Old April 6th, 2004, 07:40 PM   #4
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From what I've seen of anime (and I've seen a lot of it) there ain't a whole heck of a lot of actual animation going on. Usually the character is completely still while only the mouth moves. And when they do move (especially slow movements) the frame rate is very low. There are scene-by-scene exceptions, of course. And anime looks pretty, being backlit and all that. And 95% of all anime deals with good vs supernatural evil. Tired.
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Old April 6th, 2004, 09:43 PM   #5
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South Park went totally digital but still retains that hand-drawn, paper cut out look
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Old April 6th, 2004, 11:39 PM   #6
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And isn't Pixar starting up a 2D division?
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Old April 7th, 2004, 01:30 AM   #7
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Ted, the trouble is, there is SO MUCH anime produced that there is also a lot of mass produced and/or bad stuff. But there is also a lot of excellent, incredibly-well animated material that you may not have seen. What you describe is a function of the speed at which many series are produced in which static frames with little movement is used for time-saving in production. It's not like western animation never does that. But for every mass produced TV series there are many that have a lot greater budget or time involved.

And the breadth of stories in anime is much broader than what you would see in fantasy or science fiction portrayed in western film or TV, as a comparison.

What is your opinion of Miyazaki's films? Or of the TV series: Cowboy Bebop, Wolf's Rain, Last Exile, Haibane Renmei, or the Ghost in the Shell TV series?
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Old April 7th, 2004, 01:47 AM   #8
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I never really refer to films by the director's last names. The only TV series I have watched was the Vision of Escaflowne. I am a huge fan of Yoko Kanno's music. The story was not that great, but not bad, either. I didn't like how the main female protagonist looked like a guy. It was also cumbersome to watch since I had to do so with 10 separate videotapes. I saw the REAL Ghost in the Shell but never saw the TV series. I was fine with the way the movie ended. I also know that Escaflowne continued, but I don't really care to see more of that. Cowboy bebop may be OK... I've heard some of the music.

So you're tellin' me that US efforts like He-Man were NOT masterpieces?????? Anything done by Filmation ruled!!!!! OK they most certainly didn't. :)
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Old April 7th, 2004, 02:02 AM   #9
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Forgive me, Ted, but when you say that "95% of anime deals with good vs supernatural evil." yet the only TV series you've ever seen is Escaflowne it really doesn't sound like you have seen enough to make such a sweeping statement.

Anyway, you have my recommendations. I'm not even much of an anime nerd, I just happen to have seen a handful of great series that are the best that the medium has to offer.
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Old April 7th, 2004, 02:04 AM   #10
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Some of the talent that worked at Disney have started their
own company and should be coming out shortly with a trailer
that is supposedly going to kick *ss.

It's an unbelievable loss that those people aren't at Disney
anymore (not due to themselves mind you). There isn't even a
Disney at the helm anymore.

Disney also acquired all the rights to the "muppets"...
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Old April 7th, 2004, 04:28 AM   #11
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Perhaps I should have said "It seems like... blah blah blah..." But it's true. It sure does seem like it. From Voltron (awesome) to Robotech to Princess Mononononononke (easy title to stutter on) to Akira to Ghost in da Shellz to Transformers the Movie to Fist of the North Star. Very very few animes deal with "realistic". But that's OK. I DEFINITELY prefer movies to series, though. I like to watch a single long feature instead of a bunch of little ones UNLESS it is a comedy like Lupin da 3rd, which is cool. That's a good one for the kids. :) DVD does make the series concept much easier, though. And I've only ever watched anime series' on big bulky annoying VHS tapes. I guess I have seen more series than just Escaflowne... I suppose I didn't consider it "anime" if it showed in US broadcast TV.
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Old April 7th, 2004, 09:26 AM   #12
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According to the article Michael linked to, the laid-off animators' company is named Legacy Animation Studios. That's awesome that they have a project in the works. Most likely, especially with this first project, their goal will be to completely blow Disney out of the water. Here is an article on their upcoming short film, "Lucky".
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Old April 7th, 2004, 11:55 AM   #13
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<<<-- Originally posted by Ted Springer : Perhaps I should have said "It seems like... blah blah blah..." But it's true. It sure does seem like it. -->>>

Ted, how can you qualify your statement by saying 'it seems like it' and then in the same line you say something is 'true'? Either it is a fact or it is an opinion which, earlier in the thread, you grant is based upon your seeing very little series work.

<<<<--- I suppose I didn't consider it "anime" if it showed in US broadcast TV. --->>

Eventually even the Cartoon Network will eventually bring over something like "Cowboy Bebop". Why does this make it lose its anime status?
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Old April 7th, 2004, 12:13 PM   #14
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Hey! Nobody knock on the Transformers. Ahhh that takes me back...
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Old April 7th, 2004, 12:19 PM   #15
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I've been corrected by my more knowledgeable anime friend. "Transformers the Movie" was in fact originally a Japanese production.
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