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Old February 7th, 2015, 10:48 PM   #16
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Film soccer highlights

I tend to agree with the others who say it's unreasonable, but not *that* unreasonable. There are lots of other crappy jobs people do for less than $12.50/hour. It doesn't require a $50k camera, you can certainly do it with a $300 vidcam and a $25 tripod. They're not shooting for ESPN, they just want a highlight reel for the team/the kids/the parents. Not every job pays $1,000/day.

I can't stand people who insist on "educating" clients. They have a budget. I have a dayrate. If the two intersect, we have a deal. If not, there are people out there with lesser dayrates. If they are not happy with the quality they're getting at that rate, they either need to come up with more money, or learn to live with what they can afford. They don't need to be "educated". They'll figure it out on their own.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 10:18 AM   #17
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Clients don't need to be educated. It's the guy who shows up with a Red Epic to do this gig at that rate who needs to be pulled aside.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 12:36 PM   #18
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Let's just say the ignorance can go both ways.
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Old February 8th, 2015, 07:19 PM   #19
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

By saying "a small period of education," I mean in the most general sort... such as, they ask "can you make the commercial have John Goodman and Randy Quaid having a light saber battle to Scorpions 'Rock You Like A Hurricane' and have it to me tomorrow for $250?" and I might say "for $250 I'll have my PA film you and your business's AR exec having a slapfight over some buyout stock music. Goodman's wage alone might be slightly more, unless you can sweet-talk him." Not all learning is done with a white board, $168 text, and series of scantron sheet exams, but sometimes instead by a short and simple explanation of reality.
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Old February 10th, 2015, 12:39 PM   #20
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Quote:
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They have a budget. I have a dayrate. If the two intersect, we have a deal.
I'll wade into this more carefully than I usually do...

"They have a budget..."

Yes, but folks increasingly make arbitrary decisions around budget these days without considering what stuff actually costs... INCLUDING videographers. "What's the best 4k RAW capable camera with 1000 fps that has remarkable low light performance that I can buy for $100?" isn't all that farfetched from what I read almost daily, including here on DVInfo.

Just because someone has set a budget doesn't mean they have a hot clue whether it is accurate or not.
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Old February 10th, 2015, 12:42 PM   #21
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Thank you. to me its like any other product or service, you SHOULD research it and find out if your expectations are way out of whack before trying to purchase.
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Old February 10th, 2015, 02:06 PM   #22
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

One of the things that is never considered until it is too late is the issue of liability. I guarantee you that if something was to happen to a spectator or a player, the hired video person would get sued and the whole "but I was ONLY making $12.50 an hour..." excuse wouldn't hold up at all.

Sad but true.
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Old February 10th, 2015, 02:28 PM   #23
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

thats why we're supposed to have that insurance that most of us dont have.
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Old February 11th, 2015, 12:06 AM   #24
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich View Post
I'll wade into this more carefully than I usually do...

"They have a budget..."

Yes, but folks increasingly make arbitrary decisions around budget these days without considering what stuff actually costs... INCLUDING videographers. "What's the best 4k RAW capable camera with 1000 fps that has remarkable low light performance that I can buy for $100?" isn't all that farfetched from what I read almost daily, including here on DVInfo.

Just because someone has set a budget doesn't mean they have a hot clue whether it is accurate or not.
I would put educating someone who calls *you* on a different level than picking through ads on craigslist, then calling them to give them a piece of your mind.
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Old February 11th, 2015, 06:13 AM   #25
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

yes of course...when its an ad on CL you see it, chortle and move on. when someone contacts YOU, different story.
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Old February 11th, 2015, 08:55 AM   #26
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

A lot of youth sporting events like Hockey Tournaments and figureskating competitions I'll do on spec and take my chances selling the video to individual participants (well their parents actually) and over the years it has worked out to roughly 20% will buy a disc of the game
with respect to the OP's question, a hundred bucks is a guarantee which is nice to have, covering the gas etc. Now if there are 15 players on a team, or whatever it is x 6 teams = 90 players and if 20% buy their own disc that would be 18 x $25.00 = $450.00 + the 100 from the organizer . So now $550.00 is starting to look like a decent Sunday. Then of course the archived video will sell again over the years to others on the teams who want the video for posterity
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Old February 11th, 2015, 09:54 AM   #27
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

what about time spent burning all those discs, packaging, etc.?
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Old February 11th, 2015, 10:08 AM   #28
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

I have duplicators and use mailing sleevs so it's not an issue time wise and happy to have the work
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Old February 11th, 2015, 11:21 AM   #29
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

Personally, I've never replied to a CL ad, and it's rare that I would even look at them. Legitimate clients (at least in my market), don't look for a video professional via craigslist. I'm fortunate that I have forged some lasting relationships with good clients over the last 9 years. But I also had other sources of income... And now, through service, perseverance, and a relatively good reputation - I can nearly rely on my business income. I can at least be choosy about the work that I do, or not do.

When I came out of film school in 1992, the cost to buy-in to the video production game was about 70k for a broadcast quality video camera, and about 150k in edit suite - or over 100 and hour to rent it.

The reality is that the world, she is a-changing... just ask pro photogs who used to command big dollars, about how their field is now littered with amateurs doing very nice work for very cheap prices. I was talking to a nice photographer the other day, who shoots weddings for 375.00!!! and she does nice work. I pleaded with her to charge more, telling her that she is devaluing the service.

But, Free country - Free enterprise... What used to cost tens of thousands, now costs thousands, and what used to cost thousands, now costs hundreds.
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Old February 11th, 2015, 11:35 AM   #30
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Re: And this shows exactly how far from reality people are when hiring people for vid

CL is certainly a grab bag. Plenty of aspiring hip hop producers and indy zombie film directors with no money that can somehow promise excellent future contacts, but also the occasional really good opportunity. My current largest client, who four years later books enough business to almost double my circa-2008 full time salary, was secured by responding to a Craigslist posting.

I used to comb through rolls of half dollars and quarters looking for the odd pre-'64 silver coin... there might be an analogy there.
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