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Old August 30th, 2013, 08:00 AM   #16
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Cees ,

Sorry, I meant to say a 1" hole so that it slips neatly over the male thread of the lens.
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Old August 30th, 2013, 10:40 AM   #17
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

That makes sense. I now have a clear picture of what you mean. Thanks.
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Old August 31st, 2013, 04:08 AM   #18
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Alastair,

I suppose you have to add IR light source to this camera, or does it have a light source itself? Can you use complete black IR light, or red glow?

Same question for Bryce. Does the Canon light show a red glow, or is it completely invisible?
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Old August 31st, 2013, 06:52 AM   #19
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Cees,

The cameras I use do not have built in lights. Some Infrared LEDS put out some red that is visible. This can be a useful indicator of whether your lights are working or not.

I have downloaded some old stills that may be of interest. One shows a 25mm x 25mm camera as it comes, another shows the camera with a focusing mechanism added, one of these was used to record a platypus in its underground nesting chamber (not by me), another was used to record a Tasmanian devil in its burrow (again not by me). The platypus nest was located by radio tagging a nursing female and radio tracking her to the nest. Then a hole was bored into the chamber and lined with a plugged plastic tube. Every now and then the plug would be removed and the camera would be lowered down the tube to see what was happening. Another picture shows one of the cameras fitted with a ‘C’ mount lens and motorized belt driven remote focus. The final picture shows the same camera mounted on a ‘hothead’ which in turn was mounted on a boom supporting some infrared LED panels. It was used to record a feeding phascogale (by me).

The LED panels were only available in kit form at the time. There is a wider choice available nowadays
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Old August 31st, 2013, 10:05 AM   #20
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Wow Alastair,
That all looks very high tech. It must be very useful being able to put this stuff together yourself!
Cees, the light on the XA20 that I have is not red, at least I don't see any light at all in complete darkness. It is however, a very small light source & the camera would benefit greatly from more lights & closer to your subject at distances over a meter or so away. With anything close up, the onboard light is sufficient enough that the picture is very clear & free of noise. With your subjects further from the light source though, the grain increases rapidly due to the auto gain being on & not being able to turn it off.
Regards,
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Old September 2nd, 2013, 03:17 AM   #21
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi I have used an Everfocus C mount camera with HD-SDI
EverFocus EQH5202 Day & Night Camera EQH5202 B&H Photo Video
and a Fujinon lens
Fujinon TF2.8DA-8 15mm C-Mount Lens TF2.8DA-8 B&H Photo Video
Today there are better cameras. In Denmark I got this http://www.2bsecurity.com/Datasheet/...23_SDI-R10.pdf
but in the US you can get it under the name SHANY ELECTRONIC CO.,LTD.
I prefer to use external lights, because light coming form a short distance will vary a lot when the distance to the object shift. In a small place you will probably quickly get problems with shadows of the lens so maybe light from around the lens would be nice to have too. Problem with that type of camera is that they always are automatic. I set the infrared light so I will get a direction of the light - just as in daylight. keylight and backlight. I have thougt of doing the same recordings as you have and also with swallows that dig their nests into the river banks. I could not figure out to solve the practical problems. The birds keps digging and moving the nest further into the bank, when necesarry
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Old September 2nd, 2013, 03:43 AM   #22
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

A cheap way of getting infrared lights is to buy cheap SD IR cameraes with built in IR lights - and then just use them as lights - like these
Swann PRO-530 Multi-Purpose Day/Night Outdoor SWPRO-530PK4-US
a small IR light
Videolarm IR-10M 850nm 70&#176 IR Illuminator - Up to IR10M

Wonder if heat in the nest will be a problem?
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Old September 2nd, 2013, 08:10 AM   #23
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Bo,

Thanks for your input as well. Good idea about the cheap cameras to just use as light source.

I see advantages in the surveilance cameras, but certainly also disatvantages, the main one being that everything is in auto mode. That is more or less the same with the canon XA20.

I found a company in the UK that does conversions of dslr's into infrared camera's. I have a GH3 that they can convert. I might opt for that one for general shootiong at night. For in the nest I will investigate RageCam's IR converted Gopro options. The canon also still is a consideration, but at this stage I think I am better off with a converted GH3.
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Old September 2nd, 2013, 08:42 AM   #24
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Bo,

Have you had any problems with the automatic IR cut filter in the Everfocus? I tried another brand and it could not decide whether it should be in or out (see my earlier post if you want more information). My current camera has automatic OR manual filter control that works ok.

Do you know the price of the Shany? I did not get a reply when I asked.

Did you use the the Swann lamps for the Halsbandmus?
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Old September 2nd, 2013, 06:45 PM   #25
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi
I had no problems with the automatic IR filter - do not remember if the everfocus can be set to B/W in the menu so it will not shift. The Shany seems to have it manually - mine can be set to B/W in the menu and it will keep the IR filter off (mine is a older model than them they have on their homepage).
I use some IR spots I bought once as lightning on the recording of the mouse. One of them is this one IR-294S/90 but have some older models too. My biggest problem is when daylight fades away and my IR lightning takes over - the different wavelength of the light demands different focus setting - so when there is both daylight and IR light the picture is not sharp. If I want to get rid of that I have to mount a daylight filter on the camera to filter IR pass - only. Most of the companies that offer the IR modification also offer to mount the daylight filter. I have a dream of filming the Beavers building their dam. I have bougt several remoteheads for that, but not yet found a IR camera that could handle my B4 lenses so I can use zoom and focus by remote. I wonder too - to get a GH3 modified to try it. I have filmed some owls and the problem was to get enough IR light on them although I almost knew where they would land on a roof. Decent recordings anyway - I will upload them so you can see them :)
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Old September 3rd, 2013, 06:05 AM   #26
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Bo,

I will keep you informed about my findings with the modification of the GH3.

Very interested to know if you succeed with the beavers. I am working on beavers here in Holland as well.

If you like, please upload your owl footage. I found you on Vimeo (must be you) with some excellent stuff!!
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Old September 4th, 2013, 05:28 AM   #27
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi Bo,

Thanks for the information. I now have 4 lamps that seem similar in power consumption and external characteristics to your IR-294S/90 To save bulk and weight I have removed the panels from their housings and I am in the process of making mounts so that they can be used individually or ganged together. I have also a couple of IR spotlights. I hope that at last I will have more than enough illumination.

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Old September 7th, 2013, 10:47 AM   #28
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo Skelmose View Post
I use some IR spots I bought once as lightning on the recording of the mouse. One of them is this one IR-294S/90 but have some older models too.
Hi Bo,

Is such a light significantly better than the cheaper lights you mentioned in your earlier post? I want to have good light for owl filming.

Saw your owl film on Vimeo. Looks very interesting (though I don't understand Danish). What camera and light did you generally use for the small owl at night? Some footage is quite noisy, other footage much cleaner.

I was also very impressed by the dragonfly you did (Kongeguldsmed). I'd like to do something like that with dragonfly in the Kingfisher film I am making. Probably you can give me some advise. I will send you an e-mail for that shortly.
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Old September 8th, 2013, 09:58 AM   #29
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Hi
The problem is that there must really be a lot of IR light if the camera should not start gaining. Most IR Lamps state a distance they can light up. This is a specification that is difficult to use because you cannot know how much gain there is needed to film in the specified distance from the IR Lamp. Flood lights only have light enough to film a few meters away without the need of gain - specially with a HD camera - remember every pixel is only about a quarter of the size than in a SD kamera. I needed to light up a large area so I was shure to have light where the owl would land. I did not dare to put the stands and lights to close - if it would frighten the birds.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 04:48 AM   #30
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Re: Infrared wildlife filming at night

Realized that a lot has happend to HD IR cameras since I did the film about the owls. Ordered different newer ones to try out. Everfocus seems to be making the best and cheap IR HD 's for now. Bigger IR lamps are also available now. Tonight I tested a cheap everfocus with too much light. The iris was not available because the camera is with a fixed lens - so it got too bright. Next week I get another one to try.

Last edited by Bo Skelmose; September 25th, 2013 at 08:22 AM.
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