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Old August 17th, 2009, 01:24 PM   #61
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Hey Marj:

Nice work as always. You have a flair for close-ups and the use of the turn-table is VERY effective. You really are putting together a great foundation for the end product. I am very interested to see the next round when it will have a more finished feel to it and we can put the illuminating information together with the imagery.

Fascinating topic!

All the best,

Cat
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Old August 19th, 2009, 02:34 AM   #62
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Thanks for your comments, everyone. Glad the turntable idea has improved things.

My biggest task now is to work on the story and find those missing shots. Time is really running out - especially when all this has to be done in spare time. Most of us are in the same boat though - so wish you all success.
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Old August 25th, 2009, 08:30 AM   #63
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Marge,

Can you post a picture of your turntable?? I like to build stuff, sounds intriguing!
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Old August 27th, 2009, 02:10 AM   #64
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Hope this helps Dale - send me an email if you have any questions.
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Atkins - By design - UWOL long form-turntable-top.bmp   Atkins - By design - UWOL long form-turntable-underside.bmp  

Atkins - By design - UWOL long form-turntable-side-view-motor.bmp  
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Old August 28th, 2009, 09:09 PM   #65
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Marge,


thankyou for the pictures, that is enough for me to understand and build one this winter.

It also gave me some ideas for a donut shaped one for full circular shots of an object.
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Old October 15th, 2009, 03:52 AM   #66
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Uwol Long Form - By design #4

My video is up at the Uwol Challenge site - will put it up at Vimeo later today.

This is the first ROUGHCUT. It was my intention to have the entire movie up but I ran out of time to finish so you have approximately a third to half of it - will only know once the entire thing is laid out on the timeline. (This may have to be cut drastically.)

The introduction is incomplete but gives you the main premise upon which I have based my film - Galileo’s quotation. The exposition is missing - it will introduce Math’s place in the natural world today.

The animation following the quote is a rough idea of one idea I had for the background for the exposition.

All animations except the first two are rough ideas of what I want - place holders till the final ones are completed. Please ignore the quality of the animations just judge the effectiveness for the concept they are putting across.

Please would you note some of the following while watching my film - I really need your input.

How easy is it to follow?

Did it hold your attention or did you lose concentration - if so - where? Do you think the stories are interesting or inconsequential? Are they structured in an interesting way?

Is the pace too fast/slow. Where?

No matter how hard I tried I could not seem to cut down on the talking. Most of the concepts seem to need to be explained. Is there too much? Is it too tedious with so much narration?

My film will follow the following structure:

Introduction
The geometric shapes around us
Spirals and helices in nature
Number sequences in nature
Golden math in nature
Conclusion

I will try to give a musical interlude like the one in this section at the beginning of each section to give the narration a break. Not sure if that is going to work or not but one needs time to digest some of this stuff before moving on.

Any and all suggestions would be welcome! Many thanks.

Really looking forward to seeing what you have all been up to.

Marj
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Old October 15th, 2009, 03:22 PM   #67
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We will be offline from midnight tonight till Monday night. I will not be able to post my link to Vimeo before then but if you go to one of my previous links it will take you there if you wish to view my video- should be up at Vimeo sometime tomorrow.

Marj
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Old October 18th, 2009, 05:01 PM   #68
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Hi Marj:

Wow! O.K! This is Marj at her best, and no one does this like you do. Now a few things come to mind as general overarching suggestions. Please forgive me, as these will spill out in random thoughts as they come to mind.

First, the opening animation absolutely blew me away and I would love to hear how you put something like it together. The second animation was good, but a comment here is it was distracting to try and read Galileo's quote scrolling from bottom to top and watch the small electron circling the nucleus (or whatever it was). The quote is all important for it is the basis of your entire film. It is imperative you make that quote as easy as possible for the viewer to read and absorb what it says. Finally, the "filler" animations I actually didn't mind and thought they served their purpose.

Now, for understanding the content. For this type of film and the mathematical nature of it, don't be shy but pick your specific audience and then go for it. Just by who you are and the nature of your film, you have narrowed your audience from the general audience and casual viewer to an audience that doesn't mind working their minds as they watch this masterful film. There is nothing wrong with that. I wouldn't worry too much whether people are getting it or not and thus potentially water down what you have to say. Your focus should be on organizing your film clearly and concisely, explaining mathematical principles and then backing them up with your stunning video. As long as you are clear and organized, you will captivate your audience.

Part of the problem we uwolers have by viewing your works in progress is that we don't have yet the clearly organized fundamentals to base our viewing on. We have only received snippets without the fortified building blocks to get us there. That being said, this entry was fairly clear. You were giving us stunning examples of why nature chooses the shapes it does: because the particular shapes are the most efficient, requiring less energy and is the perfect shape for the job at hand.

Finally, in your intro you provided for us in the lower left corner the geometric shape that was exampled by the natural wonder in the film. I didn't catch the geometric shapes the first time viewing your film. Perhaps that can be more prominent so we won't miss your intention here?

And what is this that you are concerned that we might lose interest? Get bored? Think this is inconsequential??? Are you kidding?? All of it is in the realm of fantastic! I've heard someone say that, "God is a mathematician of the highest order" and you are proving it here.

Anyway, all just off-hand impressions. Your mastery of close ups and being able to seek out the subjects of interest is exceptional. Well done!

Oh yeah, the dung beetle was comic relief for me. Not the one doing all the work but the one going for the ride and getting rolled over time and again! Ha!

Awesome work, if I didn't make sense in some of this let me know and I will try again!

Cat
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Old October 18th, 2009, 06:42 PM   #69
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Marj,
I loved this. Simply loved it. There is so much drivel on TV and on line. Thank the Lord for something with a brain in it.
You wanted comments. In your quote from Galileo is the past tense of "learn" "learned"
or did some old translator put it into Old English as "learnt"? I find the whole thing to be jerky, and assume that has something to do with Vimeo. How big are your files? I find similar behavior when I try to put too big a file into Vimeo. Your closeups are so pretty and sharp. Wish I could do that.
It is very difficult in a piece this long to stay on subject all the time, and, when you started this work, I'll bet you didn't realize just how complicated it was going to become. You might do well to follow the old advertiser's mantra. First tell them what you are going to tell them, then tell it, then tell them what you told them. In other words, a brief summary setting up order of the shapes and equasions as it will be related in the piece, then the body of the work, finally a summarizing conclusion. I can't wait to see the whole thing. You've already taught so much.
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Old October 19th, 2009, 01:09 AM   #70
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Marj... I had to watch this several times...the content and presentation is masterful... it is a lot to digest on the first time through. I agree with CAT, don't be afraid to pick your audience...yet at the same time I think you can/may and are reaching potentially several audiences all at the same time in different ways. I guess I just don;t want to see you dumb down something that you fear may escape reaching ALL viewers.

I laughed when I saw Steve's post for I too hung up on "learnt" - to the point of stopping the film and getting out my dictionary, wherein I saw it WAS a proper spelling, and only then when restarting did I see it was a quote.

Your closeups leave me agog*. Simply fantastic work. This film is shaping up to be a winner for sure.

Chris

* Since I had my dictionary out I needed a good word to express my sense of excitement and intense interest. Hence agog.
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Old October 19th, 2009, 10:15 PM   #71
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Marj- I think the pace is much improved this time. The narration holds my attention and is easy to follow. I love the second animation! I think your proposed structure is logical. The usual way to break up narration is with music, just as you are doing. I think it will be OK. For me, it wasn’t too much narration anyway! I’m looking forward to watching the whole thing next time.
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Old October 21st, 2009, 07:47 AM   #72
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Thank you so much Cat for the time you have taken to answer my questions and for giving me exceedingly helpful comments and encouragement! I have been slogging away at this rather intensely for two weeks now trying to get something logical together and, being so immersed in it, I honestly did not know if I was sitting with a complete disaster here or not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Catherine Russell View Post
First, the opening animation absolutely blew me away and I would love to hear how you put something like it together.
Cat this animation arrived for me as an email entitled “Prezzie for Mom”.

When I told my youngest son, Greg, about my project and asked for his help to do a very complicated animation for the sunflower section, this first section somehow caught his imagination and unbeknown to me he went off and did this animation for me. He was really chuffed with it and I was so over the moon that I make absolutely no apology for using it rather than something I created myself! How he put it together only he can explain. (Greg wanted to study 3D animation after high school but opted for electrical engineering instead - I wanted to give him an opportunity to use some of his animating talents in my film. He has come through for me in an amazing way.) I will let him know how much you liked it. :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catherine Russell View Post
The second animation was good, but a comment here is it was distracting to try and read Galileo's quote scrolling from bottom to top and watch the small electron circling the nucleus (or whatever it was). The quote is all important for it is the basis of your entire film. It is imperative you make that quote as easy as possible for the viewer to read and absorb what it says.

You have confirmed my thoughts on this Cat - I had felt the animation was okay until we added the moon, then it became too busy. (This is a model of the earth, sun and moon actually, but you have just given me the link I needed to show the universe in macro and micro so I will try morphing it into electrons circling a nucleus.)

The significance of this second animation will only be made clear with my exposition. (It was done by my son Gary who has recently finished a course on 3D animation for his auditorium design work. He appreciated the opportunity to practise and I am so grateful for his contributions which are in a later section.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Catherine Russell View Post
Now, for understanding the content. For this type of film and the mathematical nature of it, don't be shy but pick your specific audience and then go for it. Just by who you are and the nature of your film, you have narrowed your audience from the general audience and casual viewer to an audience that doesn't mind working their minds as they watch this masterful film. There is nothing wrong with that. I wouldn't worry too much whether people are getting it or not and thus potentially water down what you have to say. Your focus should be on organizing your film clearly and concisely, explaining mathematical principles and then backing them up with your stunning video. As long as you are clear and organized, you will captivate your audience.
This bothered me a bit when I read it , because I want to bring this topic into the living room of most folk - a general audience - not just to people who can understand the topic. I have a few ideas that may help in this regard without watering it down - thanks to all the helpful comments I have received.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catherine Russell View Post

Part of the problem we uwolers have by viewing your works in progress is that we don't have yet the clearly organized fundamentals to base our viewing on. We have only received snippets without the fortified building blocks to get us there.

That being said, this entry was fairly clear. You were giving us stunning examples of why nature chooses the shapes it does: because the particular shapes are the most efficient, requiring less energy and is the perfect shape for the job at hand.
As long as this particular entry is clear, that’s all that matters to me, because I am now working according to a strictly ordered story structure - the other submissions, as you correctly say, were floating outside any planned story.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catherine Russell View Post

Finally, in your intro you provided for us in the lower left corner the geometric shape that was exampled by the natural wonder in the film. I didn't catch the geometric shapes the first time viewing your film. Perhaps that can be more prominent so we won't miss your intention here?
Agreed. This section was a real headache for me - trying to find a way to put across what I am trying to demonstrate with these shots but without TALKING is difficult. That was a last minute idea. I thought afterwards - it might have been better to do it boldly and not as an excuse on the side. I would love some suggestions if anyone can think of a better way of doing it.

Many thanks Cat - your comments are amazingly perceptive and soooo helpful!
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Old October 21st, 2009, 08:04 AM   #73
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Hi Steve - Thank you so much for you comments - they are very helpful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Siegel View Post
You wanted comments. In your quote from Galileo is the past tense of "learn" "learned"
or did some old translator put it into Old English as "learnt"?
:) As Chris has said, there are two acceptable spellings for this word. I too looked it up (Oxford English Dictionary) just to make sure. Perhaps I had better put everything into quotation marks - may help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Siegel View Post
I find the whole thing to be jerky, and assume that has something to do with Vimeo. How big are your files? I find similar behavior when I try to put too big a file into Vimeo.
Thanks for letting me know Steve I wasn’t aware there was a problem. This is the first time I have put such a big file up at Vimeo. I will try to get them smaller in future. I wonder if everyone had the same problem - not nice to watch a jerky video for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Siegel View Post
It is very difficult in a piece this long to stay on subject all the time, and, when you started this work, I'll bet you didn't realize just how complicated it was going to become.
Tell me about it. I would never have chosen this subject had I known how much work it was going to be. I have had to find hundreds of shots, never mind organize them into a logical sequence! It has also been difficult because there is just so much to cover and you can approach the topic from so many different directions. I have had to select the most important things to do.

Could I ask you to clarify something? Have I gone off the subject or did you find your concentration wandered from the subject? If I cut it down/changed it to solve the problem where do you think it would be best to do it?


Once again thank you so much for your help.
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Old October 21st, 2009, 08:13 AM   #74
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Hi Chris
Appreciate your compliments - this is one time when I actually did not know how my movie was going to be received - I can see though that there is still a lot of work to be done on this section to sort it out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Swanberg View Post
I agree with CAT, don't be afraid to pick your audience...yet at the same time I think you can/may and are reaching potentially several audiences all at the same time in different ways. I guess I just don;t want to see you dumb down something that you fear may escape reaching ALL viewers.
I will try to add a few more narration transitions just to help out in this regard. I never realized it was quite so brain-draining to watch!!! I am so glad everyone has commented on this though because it is quite difficult, after doing so much research, to get it all disentangled and and laid out in simple terms.
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Old October 21st, 2009, 08:20 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Sims View Post
Marj- I think the pace is much improved this time. The narration holds my attention and is easy to follow. I love the second animation! I think your proposed structure is logical. The usual way to break up narration is with music, just as you are doing. I think it will be OK. For me, it wasn’t too much narration anyway! I’m looking forward to watching the whole thing next time.

Hi Mike

Thanks so much for your very helpful responses to my questions. Glad at least you didn't find the narration too overwhelming - that was my main concern - too much talking again - and I 'm not even an overly talkative type of person!

I am sure Gary will be pleased to know you appreciate his animation when I tell him. Thanks Mike.
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