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Old March 17th, 2007, 03:26 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Diewert View Post
Mat,

I know that you, Kevin and Meryem are volunteering alot of time on this, and despite our whining, we really appreciate the effort.
Agreed and many thanks to Kevin and Meryem -I'm thankful for the opportunity to even be in the contest. I'll deal with this like any professional or hopeful would -trial and error, lol.
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Old March 17th, 2007, 10:58 PM   #32
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Wow! I just downloaded a trial version of Sorenson Suite 4.5 and it is pretty impressive. Too bad it's watermarked heavily with the Sorenson logo or I'd re-submit my entry.

I might have to buy the suite.
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Old March 18th, 2007, 12:59 AM   #33
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I just spent quite a while today editing my video to be 70 MB, since from an earlier discussion following the UWOL 1, I thought everyone had suggested the additional 20 MB would be helpful for quality, and wouldn't strain the resources of the site.

Now, after sending the link to Kevin, I understand we are actually still limited to 50 MB. So I have spent another few hours trying to get it down to 50, and in spite of MANY different settings, it really looks horrible. There are lots of artifacts-- blockiness, focus coming and going, audio garbled, etc., etc....

I know I already made lots of suggestions on several threads, but I just want to explore the options here before submitting, since I spent a lot of time in editing both video and audio to get good quality, and now have to throw it away just to get it to the required size and format.

Basically, PC users need to download software to run .mov files, and granted this is free. But Mac users could download software to run .wmv files, and this is also free. So I don't understand why we couldn't just submit with either format- my 12 MB .wmv file looks far better than my 70 MB .mov file.

Alternatively, as was suggested when the contest was first announced, why not just upload all videos to youtube? They allow 100 MB, which would be more than enough to get reasonable quality from either file format. That would also eliminate the need for lots of work from anyone here to help in uploading files, problems with the upload software, etc.

Anyway, in case anyone wants to see the video to prove the points I am making here, I am pasting a link to my website where I have posted the video in several formats, to show differences in quality:

http://rockfowl.com/blogs/sample_web...ion-video.aspx

I am disappointed we really haven't changed anything from the first contest, given the problems many of us expressed at the time, especially from the PC side. It is very frustrating to spend a lot of time shooting good video, recording good audio, and working on putting it all together, only to see it get mangled in the compression phase.

For future contests, I would appreciate further dialogue on options. My first entry, I was able (likely because it was shot in SD) to compress it without too many artifacts, though I wasn't in the end very happy with the quality. For this contest, I am shooting for the first time in HD, and apparently the increase in video quality has created problems in compression, and resulted in an end video that is unacceptable, even after spending the better part of today tinkering with a variety of compression options. Any suggestions?

I am still happy with the opportunity provided by the contest for creative expression, and appreciate the hard work of everyone involved. I just hope we can all continue a discussion on formats so we can be proud of the videos we share.

Ruth
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Old March 18th, 2007, 01:33 AM   #34
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Ruth et al,

There is a definite advantage to using Sorenson Squeeze for compression to .mov. Using the trial version, I could not believe how easily, and what great results I got taking an 800mb .avi from Vegas and compressing it at 428x240 with a bitrate set at 1600 and ending up with an incredible finished product at 45mb. Total time from start to finish: 5 minutes.

Doing the same thing with QTpro7, I had a 70mb file that was not nearly as viewable. I too spent many hours rendering and re-rendering and ended up with a sub-standard product.

I was so impressed, I will likely spend the $500 to buy the product.
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Old March 18th, 2007, 01:51 AM   #35
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Hi Ken,

I keep hearing how great Sorenson is, but I am reluctant to spend $500 on software just for compression. But I will try downloading a trial version to see what all the discussion is about, since everyone seems very happy with it. I would like some way to avoid spending the better part of a day working on compressing a file, and at the end of the day, being disappointed. Thanks for the suggestion.

Ruth
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Old March 18th, 2007, 04:16 AM   #36
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Okay, I've been up half the night but finally after working with different files decided to upload this as MPEG-1 instead of the earlier file I did. It is actually smaller, at about 30 MB, and though not perfect, is better than the 50 MB QT Sorenson 3 version.

Ruth
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Old March 18th, 2007, 08:28 AM   #37
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Hey Ruth,

Sorry to hear of all your troubles trying to get your file compressed under the size limit.

I don't know what Meryem will decide to do to try and make things easier for all of us.

I do know, I'll never upload anything to YouTube.

I don't have an issue with WMV as long as it's playable on my Mac.

I download Steven Dempsey's WMV files but I have to convert them to QuickTime because with Flip4Mac they stop and stutter and sputeer and are pretty much unwatchable. So, I set them to convert over night then watch them and delete them.

So, I doubt I'd watch most of the WMV entries.

I'd love to compress in H.264 but then I guess it causes problems for the PC people.

I'm not sure if we'll ever find an answer unless we divide the challenge into Mac and PC challenges.

I know on another forum where I've entered films before it was 40meg H.264 files period.

Gotta run, I have a few hours to take the footage I shot yesterday and create something out of it for this challenge. Then the fun begins with my getting mine compressed. :)
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Old March 18th, 2007, 10:09 AM   #38
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ruth et. al.

all of your complaints are completely valid. all i can do this is apologize, at this point, for the failure to get the issues worked out by UWOL #2. i have extended the deadline to attempt to accommodate the hairball i have created. it was never my intent...ease of use was the original goal, and we've failed to create that in a 4-month period, but i promise you that we will get there--the systems are in place, just not quite yet....

see this post for answers....

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=89222
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Old March 18th, 2007, 12:48 PM   #39
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Meryem,

I'm sure Sundance had issues in the early days... You shouldn't take the blame, I distinctly remember the discussions we had at the beginning when we were deciding on formats, etc. You never claimed to be an expert at web compression.
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Old March 18th, 2007, 12:56 PM   #40
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I tried to get the password and username to work, but they don't. Having spent literally 24 hours working on compression and upload, I am reverting to plan B. I have put up 4 formats of my file on my website, and I put a link on the thread you pointed to in your message above. I am about to go out to shoot video for the afternoon, and literally don't have time to work on this anymore now.

What I would suggest is something like the standard DV Info contest, which I haven't entered, but have looked at lately as a point of reference. We should post videos to our own sites if we choose, in the format we want, and provide alternate formats. That way, we could work on our videos to compress them in a way that matches what we are trying to express, instead of trying to squeeze (literally with Sorenson) into a format that may really not hold the video.

Compression is a part of the video experience these days, and I think for it to be a fun and productive part of the process, there needs to be some allowance for different formats. I would be happy to provide multiple formats for this contest, ensuring both PC and Mac users could view them. But I would have enjoyed the whole thing a lot more if I had spent the last 24 hours making creative compression choices, instead of trying endlessly to compress and render a video to a format that clearly really doesn't like my video, for whatever reason.

Sorry to be complaining, but it just seems there must be a better way to resolve our Mac and PC divide than the way this is currently being set up to compress and upload files.

I do appreciate everyone's efforts in setting up this contest, and to be honest, these two videos have brought me a long way toward understanding video editing. So it has been great for me. I just would like to figure something out that works better for the final compression phase of the project, since it has been hugely frustrating for me both times.

Thanks.


Ruth

Last edited by Ruth Happel; March 18th, 2007 at 01:10 PM. Reason: typo
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Old March 18th, 2007, 01:20 PM   #41
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this is a good opportunity to remind everyone, the user name and password that i sent everyone are case-sensitive. that's lower-case "i" and upper case "M" --there is nothing wrong with the FTP instructions. i tested them myself.

yes, we're having issues, but the files *are* getting posted and we are doing everything we possibly can to solve the issues we have created, including an entire shift in how we will proceed with UWOL #3. no one who wants to participate will get left behind due to technical difficulties. we're committed to getting every file online.

thanks for your patience.
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Old March 18th, 2007, 01:47 PM   #42
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I uploaded my entry via FTP using this username and password last night. Worked like a charm. Using Windows...FTP to the url from explorer. A window should pop up asking for username and password. Enter those. Then you can simply drag and drop your entry to the explorer window and it should upload. You're done!

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Old March 18th, 2007, 06:03 PM   #43
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it should be as easy as rick says...to add to his easy instructions.


if you can't use Explorer as your FTP client....

then google search Cyberduck and download the free and user-friendly client. you don't even have to have the website open to use the Cyberduck client.

do the following:

open Cyberduck
at the "quick connect" window, type in "uwolchallenge.com"
go to the action window, pull down "Upload"
click on your file
a new prompt will appear, asking you for a username -- type in the username we sent you--and at
password --type in the password.

exactly as they appear in the e-mail-- and most of all, remember--

they're case sensitive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

you need to have upper case where we wrote upper case, and lower where we wrote lower case....
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Old March 18th, 2007, 08:34 PM   #44
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Downloading page?

I went to uwol.com
Went to downloader
Page not available (tried on both of my computers.

do I need to do something different than last time???
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Old March 18th, 2007, 09:44 PM   #45
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I've tried three times to upload. Is it possible the page is only available when someone else isn't uploading a video? I am definitely using the case sensitive username and password you sent, but am still having no luck with the uploading.

Ruth
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