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Wedding / Event Videography Techniques
Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...


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Old July 10th, 2009, 06:24 AM   #1
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stack of old tapes

Hi guys,

what do you do with your old stack of tapes??

Everytime I look at them, I'm dying to go tapeless.. but then again, there's always that thought "what if you screw up the drive???" "what if the customer came in 6 months later and ask for some changes in the dvd??"

any thoughts??

Santo
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Old July 10th, 2009, 08:10 AM   #2
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Re: drive screw ups, in my opinion it's backup as you go. Either transfer the footage to a hard drive or one of those standalone data storage options.

Re: changes down the road, it can be fixed with a simple line in your contract saying that the client has X number of days after delivery to spot any technical errors, then the footage is wiped.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 08:15 AM   #3
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I agree, you do need to set a deadline in the contract for changes. After X months the data is wiped and/or the tapes are reused/pitched. I still have tapes from weddings I shot years ago, but I've decided I'm giving them to my kids for their DV camera and they can shoot over them.

You really need a decent backup solution - I recommend HP MediaSmart servers.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 08:41 AM   #4
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ok i haven't got that deadline clause yet. Will throw that in. Thanks for that.

As of back-up drive, isn't it gonna be a lot of files to be backed-up?

like.. for example one wedding i average 8 tapes right.. that would get me around 100 gig to back-up. 10 weddings and you're already at 1tb. not to mention dvd burn image and stuff. Do you just get a 4tb system and go with it?
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Old July 10th, 2009, 11:16 AM   #5
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A Mini DV tape is so small and cheap it serves as a perfect long-term storage medium in my view. It just needs careful labelling and onto the shelf it goes. 13 gb, so cheap, so small, so reliable. I'd far rather trust tape than a HDD.

tom.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 12:17 PM   #6
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I'd rather trust two HDDs than one tape. It's so big and bulky for what you get.

I've gone tapeless, myself.

What I do is I've bought a bunch of 750GB drives, a 1 TB internal drive, and an E-sata connected external drive bay.

Current project is edited on the internal drive, and copied in it's entirety to two separate 750 GB drives when it's completed. Then I can wipe the internal drive for my next project.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 12:28 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Susanto Widjaja View Post
ok i haven't got that deadline clause yet. Will throw that in. Thanks for that.

As of back-up drive, isn't it gonna be a lot of files to be backed-up?

like.. for example one wedding i average 8 tapes right.. that would get me around 100 gig to back-up. 10 weddings and you're already at 1tb. not to mention dvd burn image and stuff. Do you just get a 4tb system and go with it?
80 tapes x $3.55/tape = $284
80 tapes x 15GB = 1200 GB

Price per GB = $0.23

Two 1 TB drives x $135/drive = $270
Two 1 TB drives / Redundancy = 1024 GB

Price per GB = $0.26

------------

It's about the same price. For me, I prefer hard drives because digital media "glitches" (bad recording or bad capturing) less often in recording than tape does, it is MUCH faster to capture, and when I'm done editing the project, I can render a low-bitrate (8Mbps vs. 25 Mbps) copy of the source media and delete the original files if I think it's unlikely that I'm going to use them anytime soon.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 01:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyko View Post
80 tapes x $3.55/tape = $284
80 tapes x 15GB = 1200 GB

Price per GB = $0.23

Two 1 TB drives x $135/drive = $270
Two 1 TB drives / Redundancy = 1024 GB

Price per GB = $0.26
The real point I got out of Tom's post was that the data is *already* on the tape, so keep it there. No one is suggesting that tapeless shooters go out and buy MiniDV tapes for archiving.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 01:59 PM   #9
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Tape is just so reliable. My " reel to reels from the 1960s still play just fine, but my 45 year old HDDs (ha!) aren't so hot.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 02:39 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Hardwick View Post
Tape is just so reliable. My " reel to reels from the 1960s still play just fine, but my 45 year old HDDs (ha!) aren't so hot.
Yeah, but if you have to use tape as a backup medium, use 250GB computer tape. 15 GB is TINY.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 02:58 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Tom Hardwick View Post
Tape is just so reliable. My " reel to reels from the 1960s still play just fine, but my 45 year old HDDs (ha!) aren't so hot.
What environment are they kept in?

Get that tape wet. Get that tape hot. Get it near a TV or CRT monitor or DC Power Supply. How reliable is it then?

The base stock on 1/4 reel to reel is NOTHING like the base stock for miniDV.

I'm not much for using hard drives or anything mechanical for backups, but I'm ok with optical, and getting more comfy with solid state (CompactFlash, SDHC, etc.)
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Old July 10th, 2009, 03:09 PM   #12
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Sorry Tom, they're a humorless lot here. :)
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Old July 10th, 2009, 03:20 PM   #13
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Sorry Tom, they're a humorless lot here. :)
Er - yes. 40 years of tape development has made emulsions and substrates hundreds of times better, cheaper and more reliable. And trying to erase digital on a 'TV or CRT monitor or DC Power Supply' is wasting your time.

Of course decoding linear analogue is a lot easier than decoding slant azimuth helical scan digital, as is decoding vinyl LPs (pin between the teeth) against MP4 on SD card. Our backups need some pretty sophisticated hardware to read them.

tom.
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Old July 10th, 2009, 03:50 PM   #14
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I have been purchasing 1TB hdds in pairs. I have two USB sata dockign stations that I use to plug in both drives. Once I finish logging the footage from a wedding to internal HDD, I copy it to both externals.

After I finish a project, I get the backup HDDs out again, and copy the new media to the project (new media meaning audio cleanup-renders, soundtracks used, renders, temps, final VOBs, etc).

Then I mirror to the other drive.

That way I have everythign associated with the finished project in two places, and the source media in 3.
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Old July 11th, 2009, 12:32 AM   #15
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its getting pretty technical now (or is it???)

I'm not very technical in terms of post-production hardware. I only use my trusted WD studio drives.. haven't tried ethernet drive or NAS yet.. would love to get some info about it and some recommendation.

what about raid system??

I don't really have a clue of what I'm asking now.
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