Color Correcting looks better in FCP then it does online at DVinfo.net

Jason LeFrense · August 31st, 2009, 07:40 PM

I can probably speak for most when I say, I shoot weddings with 3 different types of cameras. So matching cams becomes a problem, I seem to have the blacks look pretty close in FCP. But when I compress the video using H.264 and upload it to the Vimeo or my site they don't look nothing like they did in FCP. I posted a link and you can check out the ceremony at around the 2:58 mark and around the 3:12 mark. The blacks are way off from each other as well as the tone but when I watch it back in FCP they are really close. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong, maybe with the compression.

Thanks
Jason

http://www.vimeo.com/6370122

Beau Brotherton · August 31st, 2009, 07:47 PM

Hey Jason, I tried to look at you vimeo link, but it is private. Once you make it public we can take a look at it. :)

Beau Brotherton
Reel Memories Wedding Films
Houston Tx Wedding Videography - Reel Memories Wedding Films

Jason LeFrense · August 31st, 2009, 07:47 PM

Sorry man I forgot.

Beau Brotherton · August 31st, 2009, 08:05 PM

Hey man,

I think this looks really good, don't be too hard on yourself. Wait......ok yeah, sorry I just finished it. And yes, there is a little difference at the end (the last shot and the 3rd to the last shot). Then it also does the same thing during the brides makeup section.

All of these shots have a blue cast in the blacks, most likely because of the silhouettes. Is this what you were referring to? Of course, I was really looking for something, I most likely wouldn't of even noticed.

But yes, I have experienced my loosing contrast in my image during the compression to h264, and sometimes even a blue-ish cast as well at times. I usually just let it go, or if it is really bugging me, I'll just crush the shot and add some red to over compensate. Then I might even reedit where the shot is to hide it a little. The only thing that I was noticing was shots going from bright highlights to darker shots. Which is just viewing your timeline in multicam and really looking at each shot in the middle of the previous shot (on the left) and the next shot (on the right). A LOT OF WORK!! But it makes the difference.

Anyway, maybe it is your bit rate. What is it? I usually do anywhere from 3500k to 4500k for vimeo, exposureroom, or HD youtube.

Hope this helps! :)

Jason LeFrense · August 31st, 2009, 08:12 PM

Thanks a million, I'm going to experiment with the compressor to see what I can come up with. Its just a pain in the butt that I spend that much time trying to get them to match and when it finally uploads, it doesn't look close to what it did before you uploaded it. Actually I just played it back in Qt it looks the same as the uploaded version so I would say you are right and its in the compression.

Bill Vincent · August 31st, 2009, 08:25 PM

Compression basically takes subtle shades of color and turns them into less-subtle. If you have a master with lots of great shadows and hues you are going to be disappointed when seeing an H264 or Flash video compression job on it. It's the nature of the beast. The secret to better color on those files is to make files that have already been compressed to a comparable size/resolution of whatever the final output will be (in this case, Vimeo specs).

You may have to do special adjustments on your master to compensate for lack of detail in the compressed version - that's normal. The color on a compressed Flash video is NEVER going to compare equally to an uncompressed or barely compressed video master.

This also probably goes without saying, but edit first and make your uncompressed master on an SD or HD TELEVISION (NOT computer) monitor that has been calibrated properly - otherwise you're trying to walk through shifting sand without a proper foundation.

Jason LeFrense · August 31st, 2009, 08:42 PM

Thanks Bill, I find it mostly with HDV footage. My EX3 footage looks pretty close but my HDV footage is always off. So I usually go back crush the blacks a little more and it helps some times.

Chad Dyle · August 31st, 2009, 09:17 PM

I have been having the same problems lately. We edit in FC, but when I render out an H.264 (1280x720, 5000Kb) for Exposure Room, the video clip looks washed out when placed next to the viewer in FC. I have been adjusting the gamma in Compressor to 1.3/1.4 lately. It helps bring back the black, but isn't the best solution.

Jason LeFrense · September 1st, 2009, 05:08 PM

I agree with you Chad, it seems to only really effect my HDV footage and not my XDCAM clips. When I get some free time I will experiment a little more and hopefully come up with a solution.

August 31st, 2009, 07:40 PM	#1
Jason LeFrense Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sydney Canada Posts: 126	Color Correcting looks better in FCP then it does online I can probably speak for most when I say, I shoot weddings with 3 different types of cameras. So matching cams becomes a problem, I seem to have the blacks look pretty close in FCP. But when I compress the video using H.264 and upload it to the Vimeo or my site they don't look nothing like they did in FCP. I posted a link and you can check out the ceremony at around the 2:58 mark and around the 3:12 mark. The blacks are way off from each other as well as the tone but when I watch it back in FCP they are really close. Any ideas on what I am doing wrong, maybe with the compression. Thanks Jason http://www.vimeo.com/6370122

August 31st, 2009, 08:05 PM	#4
Beau Brotherton New Boot Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 11	Hey man, I think this looks really good, don't be too hard on yourself. Wait......ok yeah, sorry I just finished it. And yes, there is a little difference at the end (the last shot and the 3rd to the last shot). Then it also does the same thing during the brides makeup section. All of these shots have a blue cast in the blacks, most likely because of the silhouettes. Is this what you were referring to? Of course, I was really looking for something, I most likely wouldn't of even noticed. But yes, I have experienced my loosing contrast in my image during the compression to h264, and sometimes even a blue-ish cast as well at times. I usually just let it go, or if it is really bugging me, I'll just crush the shot and add some red to over compensate. Then I might even reedit where the shot is to hide it a little. The only thing that I was noticing was shots going from bright highlights to darker shots. Which is just viewing your timeline in multicam and really looking at each shot in the middle of the previous shot (on the left) and the next shot (on the right). A LOT OF WORK!! But it makes the difference. Anyway, maybe it is your bit rate. What is it? I usually do anywhere from 3500k to 4500k for vimeo, exposureroom, or HD youtube. Hope this helps! :) __________________ Beau Brotherton - Reel Memories Wedding Films www.reelmemories.ws

August 31st, 2009, 09:17 PM	#8
Chad Dyle Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 410	I have been having the same problems lately. We edit in FC, but when I render out an H.264 (1280x720, 5000Kb) for Exposure Room, the video clip looks washed out when placed next to the viewer in FC. I have been adjusting the gamma in Compressor to 1.3/1.4 lately. It helps bring back the black, but isn't the best solution. __________________ www.chaddyle.com www.chaddyleproductions.com

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August 31st, 2009, 07:47 PM	#2
Beau Brotherton New Boot Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 11	Hey Jason, I tried to look at you vimeo link, but it is private. Once you make it public we can take a look at it. :) Beau Brotherton Reel Memories Wedding Films Houston Tx Wedding Videography - Reel Memories Wedding Films

August 31st, 2009, 08:12 PM	#5
Jason LeFrense Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sydney Canada Posts: 126	Thanks a million, I'm going to experiment with the compressor to see what I can come up with. Its just a pain in the butt that I spend that much time trying to get them to match and when it finally uploads, it doesn't look close to what it did before you uploaded it. Actually I just played it back in Qt it looks the same as the uploaded version so I would say you are right and its in the compression.

August 31st, 2009, 08:25 PM	#6
Bill Vincent Major Player Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 253	Compression basically takes subtle shades of color and turns them into less-subtle. If you have a master with lots of great shadows and hues you are going to be disappointed when seeing an H264 or Flash video compression job on it. It's the nature of the beast. The secret to better color on those files is to make files that have already been compressed to a comparable size/resolution of whatever the final output will be (in this case, Vimeo specs). You may have to do special adjustments on your master to compensate for lack of detail in the compressed version - that's normal. The color on a compressed Flash video is NEVER going to compare equally to an uncompressed or barely compressed video master. This also probably goes without saying, but edit first and make your uncompressed master on an SD or HD TELEVISION (NOT computer) monitor that has been calibrated properly - otherwise you're trying to walk through shifting sand without a proper foundation.

August 31st, 2009, 08:42 PM	#7
Jason LeFrense Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sydney Canada Posts: 126	Thanks Bill, I find it mostly with HDV footage. My EX3 footage looks pretty close but my HDV footage is always off. So I usually go back crush the blacks a little more and it helps some times.

September 1st, 2009, 05:08 PM	#9
Jason LeFrense Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Sydney Canada Posts: 126	I agree with you Chad, it seems to only really effect my HDV footage and not my XDCAM clips. When I get some free time I will experiment a little more and hopefully come up with a solution.