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Old July 9th, 2014, 03:01 PM   #1
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Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Hi All,

Fourth thread. I appreciate everyone's help thus far as I try to avoid lemons and make good purchases.

Recent buys:
Panasonic GH4
4 95mb/s SanDisk 64GB cards
5 Manfrotto QR plates

I am currently looking at lavalier mics and pocket recorders (I'll be buying four of each).

I'm interested by the Olympus Pocket recorders (I'd spend roughly 400 on 4) and I'm looking at investing 600 on lavalier mics... I'm always going to pay for the best I can afford... and most pros seem to suggest placing as much of an investment in audio as you do in video... would anyone recommend two viable products that fall into these categories? I've considered the Shure Sm11, the Rode lavs and then some of the more expensive ones... obviously I'd need to compromise if I went with the latter... I also realise that people recommend the Sennheiser G3 system... but I still haven't got my head around this option and also think that I'd need to spend quite a lot of money on additional mics and receivers if I understand it all. I'm also aware that I'm doing weddings for people who never considered video, so I'm reluctant to shove too many bits of equipment on their bodies.

Meanwhile, I'm going to purchase a Synology server to store my films... using a G-RAID Thunderbolt drive for editing - as per Minty Slippers' advice.

That would take my investment to 2000.

I'm buying an extra Sachtler Ace so that I have two tripods for the ceremony and speeches. Investment: 2500.

Then I'm considering purchasing a Zacuto Marauder or a Glidecam HD2000 or 4000? I have a Manfrotto Video Monopod for moving around, but still need to shoot static shots or slight movement - no grand movements that you see in so many wedding films. So I'm really intrigued by the Marauder for its size and convenience with my EM5 (3rd body after GH3 and GH4) - I figure it could be a great buy. Similarly though, I'm interested in the smoothness of a Glidecam... Spending to 3000.

Finally, I'm buying 2 on board camera mics - either the VideoMic Pros or the Panasonic equivalents. I prefer the build and design of the Pannys but the VideoMic Pro sounds better. And then it'll be a case of purchasing the H5 or H6 from Zoom and getting the cables mentioned in the other thread to hook up to the main board.

Do you think all of these are sound investments? The only other thing that I wish I could afford in 2014 is a 12-35mm lens from Panasonic or the 12-40 from Olympus - both f2.8. Would either of these be more preferable over the above options?

---

I'm purchasing everything on Friday.

Would anyone be so kind as to tell me what they would advise me to do?

Thanks again. I am humbled by your help and wish that more of you would upload your videos to the video sub-forum! I miss seeing new ones and learning more!

I have two weddings within the next month and I want to improve greatly on these two after my first outing. One is an Asian wedding too, which I'm looking forward to. :)
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Old July 9th, 2014, 03:52 PM   #2
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Hi Craig

Wow that's a shopping list!

My only comment is why you need a 500 tripod for your second camera, is it going to be a static camera? A set of velbon legs would more than suit a b cam...
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Old July 9th, 2014, 04:00 PM   #3
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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Hi Craig

Wow that's a shopping list!

My only comment is why you need a 500 tripod for your second camera, is it going to be a static camera? A set of velbon legs would more than suit a b cam...
Thanks Daniel - yes, it's true - quite a shopping list. But then to have a pro collection of gear, it seems like it's a necessary evil.

I guess I'm considering a second Sachtler as I want everything to be the same. Having back ups in the event that one broke etc. Also, I may buy the new add ons for the Ace in the future (follow focus for instance) and if that's the case, then I'll be able to use it on either tripod. Also, my Quick Releases from Manfrotto work with the Sachtler too. I guess what I learned from my first outing is that time is everything. Saving minutes here and there will be a massive positive to my workflow during a day's shoot.
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Old July 9th, 2014, 04:54 PM   #4
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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Hi Craig

Wow that's a shopping list!

My only comment is why you need a 500 tripod for your second camera, is it going to be a static camera? A set of velbon legs would more than suit a b cam...
Second this. Were all Velbon with manfrotto heads. 89 legs but my fav over manfrotto anyday.

Here's our full kitbags and why we selected some of our gear. THE MINTYSLIPPERS KIT BAG | Minty Slippers
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Old July 10th, 2014, 02:50 AM   #5
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Craig, be careful not to fall into the trap - as it were - of purchasing all high-end stuff "just to be sure". Many a newly redundant IT professional amareur photographer looking to move into the stills side and with a wad of redundancy money burning a hole in their pockets has done this, only to find a few months later that all their money is gone and it hasn't worked out. I know you are not in this situation - I think you've said you are a teacher with a safe regular income - but some dangers are still there.

I would place more emphasis on figuring out what you need to get things done to a good standard. Members have already mentioned tripods as a case in point.

Lav mics are another example. Peter Rush recently posted that he is very pleased with the results from these 38 lavs on Amazon:

Pronomic LA-30 EA Lavalier Microphone Universal Black: Amazon.co.uk: Musical Instruments

You're right you don't need Sennheiser G3's for weddings as standalone recorders will do just as well. They do win you some brownie points as clients are often impressed with the actual kit, but with the limited opportunity to do anything about changing an imperfect recording scenario during a wedding the advantages of real-time monitoring are greatly diminished. You don't need any extra kit with the G3's - they just sit between the talent and the recording device you would have used anyway. You do need to ensure that Sennheiser lavs are compatible with whatever recording devices you will use as different manufacturers of mics have different ways of wiring them. You can re-solder connections but it is not easy; you can get anything modified professionally.

Nor do you need high-end audio recorders. Weddings are all about the spoken word not about the live music and this means that audio recorders do not need the range that would be desirable for music recitals.

You also need to think about the logistics of setting up and breaking down all the equipment quickly especially if you cannot get your car close to the location e.g. H6's are massive compared to H4's and H1's. Size and weight of all equipment.

Also consider your exposure to accidental damage, and loss through your own forgetfulness during the heat of the moment, and loss from theft. You won't miss a 15 lightstand but you will miss a 500 tripod; both would have functioned perfectly well as a support for your b-cam. Again, you won't mind if a staff member drops your 30 dictaphone out of the flower arrangement onto the floor when turning around the ceremony room after the ceremony but you will mind if the registrar forgets to give you back your 300 Sennheiser transmitter and shoots off to their next wedding.

BTW you're likely to find the Asian wedding a very different experience to the anglo-saxon wedding you shot earlier. e.g. expect to find a much more active area around the couple during the ceremony - guests moving around everywhere and shooting their own photos and video on ipads etc. You'll have to fight for decent positions. There are also a multitude of must-have shots which you should hammer out with the clients well before the day. And don't expect the speeches to happen at the allocated time, or one after another, plus extra speakers may well pop up anywhere in the room.

This recent Hindu gallery of mine may help you anticipate what to expect. There are detailed notes at the bottom of the page. Most Hindu ceremonies are not as involved as that though.

hindu wedding photographers videographers berkshire photography video christena and shiva ashton lamont photo galleries

Pete
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Old July 10th, 2014, 03:35 AM   #6
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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Second this. Were all Velbon with manfrotto heads. 89 legs but my fav over manfrotto anyday. | Minty Slippers[/url]
I'll third this too....
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Old July 10th, 2014, 04:22 AM   #7
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

On this, can anyone recommend a good and small pocket recorder?

We were looking at Olympus units but come to buy and discontinued. Looked at Yamaha, same again, all discontinued and the replacements are huge.

We went with some Zoom H1's in the end just because we ran out of time but there huge. I just want something to slip into the grooms pocket to take a lav mic.

Previous experience with dictaphones is that they have audio drift so a unit which can record WAV would be ideal.

On our blog we talk about the hinty gear having no wireless. Were actually about to buy them a wireless unit so they can start to tune into venue wireless systems.
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Old July 10th, 2014, 04:32 AM   #8
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Also, look at the Kingston cards. Another solid brand with a lifetime warranty and our 4 year old cards are still going strong.

They are also a third the cost of Sandisk
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Old July 10th, 2014, 05:30 AM   #9
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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On this, can anyone recommend a good and small pocket recorder?

I'm not sure if they are released yet, but these caught my eye as a good simple recorder:

New for NAB: Little DARling Distributed Audio Recorder | juicedLink
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Old July 10th, 2014, 01:54 PM   #10
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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Second this. Were all Velbon with manfrotto heads. 89 legs but my fav over manfrotto anyday.

Here's our full kitbags and why we selected some of our gear. THE MINTYSLIPPERS KIT BAG | Minty Slippers
Thanks Danny... I've literally raided your education blog and absolutely love it. I found the full 20 minute film really intriguing and also felt that it held my attention throughout - great job!! I am aware of the Velbron legs and appreciate everyone saying the same... but I just feel like grab another Sachtler and if I'm shooting from either tripod, I'm going to get great shots... considering I still live at home... I'm quite happy to splash the cash now in the hope that I'll get a long duration of time with my gear... even if that's unwise... is there any reason to select the Velbron over the Sachtler other than the price? I appreciate that you take them as being better than the Manfrottos too!

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Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
Craig, be careful not to fall into the trap - as it were - of purchasing all high-end stuff "just to be sure". Many a newly redundant IT professional amareur photographer looking to move into the stills side and with a wad of redundancy money burning a hole in their pockets has done this, only to find a few months later that all their money is gone and it hasn't worked out. I know you are not in this situation - I think you've said you are a teacher with a safe regular income - but some dangers are still there.
Very true Peter... I may shoot the next two weddings... have a shocker and realise that I'm not good enough... I just have a dream and hope that I can achieve it and become as successful as everyone else here... I never do anything half-heartedly either... and I've been researching this career for over a year now... I really think I can do a decent job... I have already loved photography for eight years... so hopefully I don't fall into the bracket of the IT redundancies...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
I would place more emphasis on figuring out what you need to get things done to a good standard. Members have already mentioned tripods as a case in point.

Lav mics are another example. Peter Rush recently posted that he is very pleased with the results from these 38 lavs on Amazon:

Pronomic LA-30 EA Lavalier Microphone Universal Black: Amazon.co.uk: Musical Instruments
But when listening to YouTube videos and the audio from the higher level mics, the sound is incredible?! I found audio to be something that I lacked with on my previous wedding... just really want to nail audio next time round and I've learned a lot about lav placement and settings, but I just need to figure out which lavs to go with... I've always steered clear of lesser known brands in the hope that reliability and quality will prevail... sense says to buy these though... I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
Nor do you need high-end audio recorders. Weddings are all about the spoken word not about the live music and this means that audio recorders do not need the range that would be desirable for music recitals.
I realise that voices must be simpler to record, but is it also true about the floor level of the mic recorder than you use generating a hissing sound? I just assumed that high-end audio recorders would capture cleaner audio with more detail and depth and make the most out of the lav mic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
You also need to think about the logistics of setting up and breaking down all the equipment quickly especially if you cannot get your car close to the location e.g. H6's are massive compared to H4's and H1's. Size and weight of all equipment.
This is very true... I have a Billingham Hadley Pro and Digital for my lenses and audio equipment, as well as two tripods, a slider and a monopod... with both bags over my head and onto the opposite shoulder, the two tripod bags on my shoulders and my slider in one hand and my monopod in the other, I can just about carry the gear... but at a push. That's why I think the Zacuto Marauder would be a great buy (Buy - Zacuto Z-DMR Marauder, Foldable Run and Gun DSLR Rig (ZDMR)) but then I'm unsure if you can achieve some wonderful shots with a shoulder rig? Or if I should just buy a Glidecam?

I agree completely about your warnings of loss and theft... my biggest fear too. Especially because I'm shooting alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
BTW you're likely to find the Asian wedding a very different experience to the anglo-saxon wedding you shot earlier. e.g. expect to find a much more active area around the couple during the ceremony - guests moving around everywhere and shooting their own photos and video on ipads etc. You'll have to fight for decent positions. There are also a multitude of must-have shots which you should hammer out with the clients well before the day. And don't expect the speeches to happen at the allocated time, or one after another, plus extra speakers may well pop up anywhere in the room.
Can you tell me about the must have shots please, Peter? Thanks if you can! It's a Chinese/Vietnamese wedding. In the morning, there will be games for the groom to complete and a tea ceremony. Otherwise, there are 3 dress changes throughout the day and a multitude of other things. Thankfully, she just wants the speeches, ceremony and a 4 minute video too (same as my previous wedding), so I'm pretty happy to deliver that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post
This recent Hindu gallery of mine may help you anticipate what to expect. There are detailed notes at the bottom of the page. Most Hindu ceremonies are not as involved as that though.

hindu wedding photographers videographers berkshire photography video christena and shiva ashton lamont photo galleries
Thanks for this Pete, a great set of photos from the day!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny O'Neill View Post
Also, look at the Kingston cards. Another solid brand with a lifetime warranty and our 4 year old cards are still going strong.

They are also a third the cost of Sandisk
Thanks Danny, I was thinking about 4K and I know 95mbs is going to be good enough, even if the card isn't working at its full capacity... but I will definitely consider the Kingston cards from now on if they have a lifetime guarantee! I've just always shot SanDisk with photography too.

---

Ultimately, am I right in buying four lavs and pocket recorders? Do I get omnidrectional lavs? Which Olympus Pocket recorders would be best? And finally, should I get a steadicam or the Zacuto Marauder, or neither? I don't have a lens that will be stabilised, so I could also go with the 12-35 with IS instead of a steadicam or Marauder.

Otherwise, I'll go with the Synology drive as per Danny's advice and get two VideoMic Pros. I realise the H6 is massive, but I think it's something I can make my way into eventually... and I'll just leave my two TASCAMs on the tables.

Fortunately, my next two weddings are in lovely places that I don't imagine will result in theft.

Thank you everyone and please continue to help! :)
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Old July 11th, 2014, 03:26 AM   #11
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Our new kingston cards are these ones

SD/SDHC/SDXC Flash Cards | Kingston

They do 45mbs write which is more than enough for our C100's which only actually need 4mbs at full quality.
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Old July 13th, 2014, 10:18 AM   #12
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Thanks to everyone again, I've completed my purchases and I know that I've spent more than most would consider, but hopefully the better gear will stand up to the test of time - as long as nobody steals anything from me! :/

Either way, I look forward to showing you my second and third wedding videos next month, before I finally make edits using the 3 wedding days with 3 licensed songs that I can purchase to post on my eventual website. Next summer I hope to do a few weddings for a small fee. Depending upon how successful they are, I may decide to pursue this as my future.

Appreciate everyone's time and wisdom, as I have taken everything into consideration. I am aware that I'm in a fortunate position with a steady income to make more purchases, more comfortably, than having to worry about bills and business.

For those who are interested, I listened to Danny and bought a Synology DS513+ server, along with five 4TB WD Red drives. 1 Rode Videomic Pro, 3 Sanken COS 11D mics with 3.5mm attachment, 3 Sony PCM 10 recorders and another Sachtler Ace. I know people said to buy the 40 mics, a Zoom H1 and a much cheaper tripod, but I figured that I'll have only one period of my life where I can invest in the best gear, and that time is now.

Hopefully I can improve my skills with my videos and continue to pursue in your footsteps. Future buys will include a better editing machine than my current 2011 MacBook Pro and a glidecam / shoulder rig, + lights etc. But for now, I think I have the basics to go ahead and make wedding films that are solid. So with that in mind, I thank you all for being able to reach this point. Hopefully I can make two more successful wedding films and progress from there.

Thanks again to everyone.
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Old July 13th, 2014, 10:52 AM   #13
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Riding View Post

BTW you're likely to find the Asian wedding a very different experience to the anglo-saxon wedding you shot earlier. e.g. expect to find a much more active area around the couple during the ceremony - guests moving around everywhere and shooting their own photos and video on ipads etc. You'll have to fight for decent positions. There are also a multitude of must-have shots which you should hammer out with the clients well before the day. And don't expect the speeches to happen at the allocated time, or one after another, plus extra speakers may well pop up anywhere in the room.
hindu wedding photographers videographers berkshire photography video christena and shiva ashton lamont photo galleries

Pete
Ditto - In my experience, if it's an Indian wedding is that the speeches will be during the meal at random times - you may well be told when they will occur but them timings almost certainly will be wrong - roll at least one safe camera and all your audio gear for the entire meal to be sure. Also the last one I did they played music over the speeches mixed from the PA and for some reason when played back from my recording of the PA speaker was quite loud and impossible to mix out. Luckily I had placed my H1 recorders near all the speakers (8 in all so no way could I have a lav on each one) but a few random ones popped up as well - Prepare for the unexpected!

You also might want to think about sandbags. I now use sandbags on all my tripods and light stands - a must when there are kids belting around - not only for the safety of the guests and your gear but the safety of your carefully framed shot if it's a B cam - I learned early on that once you set it rolling you won't notice if someone knocks it and then the shot is scuppered - if it's at the very beginning of a ceremony it's a real bummer! I have had guests trip over the legs of my light stands on 2 occasions and the sandbags saved it from falling over!
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Old July 13th, 2014, 11:10 AM   #14
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

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Ditto - In my experience, if it's an Indian wedding is that the speeches will be during the meal at random times - you may well be told when they will occur but them timings almost certainly will be wrong - roll at least one safe camera and all your audio gear for the entire meal to be sure. Also the last one I did they played music over the speeches mixed from the PA and for some reason when played back from my recording of the PA speaker was quite loud and impossible to mix out. Luckily I had placed my H1 recorders near all the speakers (8 in all so no way could I have a lav on each one) but a few random ones popped up as well - Prepare for the unexpected!

You also might want to think about sandbags. I now use sandbags on all my tripods and light stands - a must when there are kids belting around - not only for the safety of the guests and your gear but the safety of your carefully framed shot if it's a B cam - I learned early on that once you set it rolling you won't notice if someone knocks it and then the shot is scuppered - if it's at the very beginning of a ceremony it's a real bummer! I have had guests trip over the legs of my light stands on 2 occasions and the sandbags saved it from falling over!
Hi Peter,

The wedding that I'm shooting is a Vietnamese wedding. That Indian wedding sounds insane. I'll be wary of those!

Thanks Peter, where did you buy the sandbags? I will consider getting one, as that is a real worry.

I'm really excited to have another two weddings coming up! The first was an amazing experience, and I think I've learned a lot from it... now it's all about making the next two even better!
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Old July 14th, 2014, 03:08 AM   #15
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Re: Purchasing Equipment Imminently: Storage, Audio and Support

But when listening to YouTube videos and the audio from the higher level mics, the sound is incredible?! I found audio to be something that I lacked with on my previous wedding... just really want to nail audio next time round and I've learned a lot about lav placement and settings, but I just need to figure out which lavs to go with... I've always steered clear of lesser known brands in the hope that reliability and quality will prevail... sense says to buy these though... I agree.

Elephant trap alert. The owners of high end expensive mics are more likely to know the ideal recording conditions and act accordingly. This might include specially designed recording booths / placement to avoid soundwave reflections / placement of soundwave absorbing materials such as blankets etc. And the residual recording device sound via preamps has to be very bad to be relevant at weddings because there is almost always desirable ambient room noise that drowns it out. As with photography there are lots of variables which can render well-meaning under-resourced limited-knowledge tests irrelevant.

But you've got your kit now and paying a bit more for peace of mind can of course help your own confidence.

A lot of audio equipment is over-engineered for wedding purposes. And its not helped that when a relative newbie posts a question in audio rooms often straight away it turns into a piss--- match between various audio professionals recommending solutions that are never going to see the light of day at weddings.

I'm not sure what your main teaching subject is, an analogy might be tanks in WW2. The Tiger was fearsome but over-engineered, far too heavy and requiring far too much fuel. The wrong tool. Only around 1800 were produced. Compared to over 50,000 "inferior" Shermans and I forget how many T34's.

with both bags over my head and onto the opposite shoulder, the two tripod bags on my shoulders and my slider in one hand and my monopod in the other, I can just about carry the gear

Don't forget it rains a lot :- )

must have shots ..... It's a Chinese/Vietnamese wedding

Chinese connection weddings are at the easier end of the scale for Asian weddings. You are still likely to have guests crowding you out especially during the tea ceremony. And the tea ceremony tends to take place in smaller rooms or private houses so your space can be severely restricted. Other than that, in general there is a much greater reverence for older relations. For example there would be more emphasis on the grandparents including starting with the grandparents in the photo shoot. And the reception can last an extremely long time with multiple courses. There are some great shots to be had in the kitchens whilst the food is being prepared.

where did you buy the sandbags?

I would recommend boom arm counterweights rather than sandbags as the weight to volume ratio is much higher making them easier to transport. And potentially less messy. Search for counter weights on Calumet. You simply attach them to the lightstand / tripod near the floor. Easier to move the entire rig as well if you need to do that at short notice.

https://www.calphoto.co.uk/product/c...counter|weight

Pete
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