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Old January 1st, 2015, 08:45 AM   #1
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Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

I may not have all the facts straight here, but it seems like 720p TVs came out and they were termed "HD". Then not too much later, 1080i TVs came out and they were termed "HD" as well.

Now we have this "UHD" which has been labeled "4K" but it's slightly smaller than true 4K, just like 720p was. So I wonder when we're going to get true 4K displays. All the ones I'm seeing are 3840x2160.

Yesterday I went to Sams Club and noticed that their 70' UHD TVs were only $2,448. By contrast, a 70" JDTV was $1,898. For a 70" TV I thought that was an insanely decent price.

A 65" HDTV was only $878... also incredible. We have a 55" HDTV that we bought 6 years ago and paid $1,800 for.

All this came about because I'm thinking about doing a bridal show on Sunday and another vendor who does rentals posted in our local wedding vendor facebook group that he was giving bridal show discounts. One of the items was a 70" TV with them doing delivery and setup with a truss system. So I inquired and it was $250 to rent it for the day and included everything (regularly $450). That didn't sound to bad, and then someone asked how much it was to just buy a 70" TV... so that's why I went looking around.

Anyways, overall I didn't realize how much TV prices had dropped and how "affordable" UHD TVs were becoming. It may be plausible that we could start seeing 4K wedding video requests in the near future!

Has anyone been approached about doing a wedding in 4K?
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Old January 1st, 2015, 09:51 AM   #2
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

I doubt it. We didn't upgrade from 1080 to 2K TVs. They exist(ed) side by side in the consumer (TV and bluray) and pro industries (cinema projectors and post production) at the same time. Now we have 3840x2160/UHD and 4096x2160/4K (17:9). 4K is the capture format and UHD is the home viewing format.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 10:49 AM   #3
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

I'd say there is a big difference between 1280x720 vs 1920x1080 compared to 3840x2160 vs 4096x2160, if anything 1080P will become the 720P of 4K. Everyone is saying 2015 is the year for 4K however most content is still delivered in 720P. Everyone was obsessed with 3D the next year 3D simply vanished. 2015 is definitely going to be the year we see more 4K but the masses won't care in my opinion.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 10:49 AM   #4
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

The difference between 720p (hd-ready) and 1080p (full hd) is more obvious then UHD and true hd or whatever it's called, for me when it says 4K on a camera, it's 4K, even if purists can prove it's not when comparing numbers, and if any client would request a 4K recording, that is what they will get from my 4K camera's. I"m absolutely sure I never will have any discussion with my clients because they doubt it's either uhd or true hd.

I have not yet been approached to shoot and deliver 4K for a wedding eventhough I have two 4k camera's and I don't expect any requests for a longer time but if someone would ask I could deliver a 4K mp4 file, not planning to invest in a 4K blu-ray burner or player once they become available or a 4K tv though, I"ll wait long enough until I get enough requests for 4K, currently I have a hard time even convincing my clients they are better of with a blu-ray instead of a dvd.

Last edited by Noa Put; January 1st, 2015 at 12:16 PM.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 11:43 AM   #5
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

That's the rub!
Let's face it, nobody is interested in HD apart from a few enthusiasts, because the great public are happy enough with SD. My wife watches BBC on our very big screen on channel 1 - because BBC has always been channel 1, and BBC-HD has too many digits to remember. On top of that, many repeats are not even HD, and many come from ancient analogue sources - remember when we had lines? 625 in our case. The old programmes still look good enough. The public hated fuzzy bands at the top and bottom, and drop out on their Beta and VHS and digital is just nice and solid. If the picture occasionally pixelates, they've come to ignore it. The quest for HD just never caught on with the masses. The broadcasters know, and don't really care, because the experiments when HD was being first toyed with showed them how few people noticed the difference between SD, then 720 and then 1080. BR instead of DVD never really achieved the sales it deserved, and I still have my first batch of BR discs, because no client so far wanted one! Most is still on DVD, and the online delivery done in 720, for sheer convenience and speed of transfer.

4K seems another techno-leap that people really don't appreciate!
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Old January 1st, 2015, 01:14 PM   #6
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

We've already done a 4k wedding up in New Hampshire earlier this year. I offer it as an optional upgrade for $3,000. Recently had a client torn between doing the 4k upgrade or an engagement film, they opted for the latter instead. But still, it's coming.

UHD TV's are flying off the shelves at Best Buy, I always ask those guys when I walk through how they're selling. Pretty soon you're going to start seeing more and more people asking about it so be ready. Successful entrepreneurs and businesses that really excel, are the ones who know how to pivot in a changing environment, and can foresee change. Just ask Blockbuster, Tower Records, Borders, if they could go back in time if they'd embrace the DVD-by-mail and streaming technology, MP3's, and eBooks sooner.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 01:51 PM   #7
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

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Originally Posted by Noa Put View Post
I have not yet been approached to shoot and deliver 4K for a wedding eventhough I have two 4k camera's and I don't expect any requests for a longer time....
Be happy Noa, it's giving us the freedom of reframing in post while ever this is the case. I know you already know how good that can be, so be happy.

I loved filming some nativity plays before christmas. Film in 4K, deliver DVD and more or less re-frame in post from a static camera to what ever I wanted. Easy to shoot, easy to edit, done. I'm not buying another camera for video that's not 4K.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 02:56 PM   #8
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

+1 Paul, my experiences are virtually the same as yours!

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Old January 1st, 2015, 04:32 PM   #9
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

I've been shooting in Full HD 1080p for over 4 years and had only had one client ever request that I deliver their video in Blu-Ray format. Lots of people have Blu-Ray players in the US right now but it just doesn't seem to be something that my clients are concerned about. I don't think most in people in my area really care about the difference in sharpness between Blu-Ray and DVD unless they're really into technology and gadgets. So I would be VERY surprised if I get people in the next 3 years asking for 4K delivery.

However, I think one of the biggest advantages to shooting in 4K is being able to tell clients "We shoot in 4K". You can then explain to them why they will want a 4K wedding video, how this is the newest and best thing, and probably make quite a bit of money just by using the term 4K. If they get excited about it then they might notice that it is sharper and more detailed and when they post the video on Facebook they might say "Check out our 4K wedding video!".

In reality, if one were to never mention 4K to the bride, I think almost all of them will be just as happy with a great wedding video shot on a Canon 6D as they will if it were shot on a Canon 1DC. As long as you get all the shots they want and provide them a creative and technically sound video then they're probably not going to care if it was shot in 720p, 1080p or 4K.

So in my opinion, in most situations for the next few years 4K will make a difference only if the videographer make sure to mention it and uses it as a selling point. Otherwise, I think it's far less important to most brides than it is to the videographer.

I think many of them are more concerned with good sound, good lighting, great customer service, and just an overall positive experience for them.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 04:52 PM   #10
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

All good points.

Walking in, I expected a 70" UHD TV to be around $5,000 or more and was just completely shocked that they were only $2,500.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 05:04 PM   #11
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

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Originally Posted by Christian Nachtrieb View Post

UHD TV's are flying off the shelves at Best Buy, I always ask those guys when I walk through how they're selling. Pretty soon you're going to start seeing more and more people asking about it so be ready. Successful entrepreneurs and businesses that really excel, are the ones who know how to pivot in a changing environment, and can foresee change. Just ask Blockbuster, Tower Records, Borders, if they could go back in time if they'd embrace the DVD-by-mail and streaming technology, MP3's, and eBooks sooner.
Flying off the shelf at Best Buy? What are they watching on it? Do they even understand the availability, restrictions, and capabilities of what they bought?

Being a technician I once thought that anyone who was willing to invest the extra cash it takes to own the latest and greatest in high tech products "must understand the technology behind the purchase". I now realize how wrong that assumption is. Owning high technology products now carries "status" with it among a certain class of egocentric consumers. The phone you carry and the LCD TV in your living room now matters as much to them as the label on their clothes and the car they drive. I promise you that on Black Friday there were many fickle Americans that came home from Best Buy with a 4K TV and absolutely no clue about what it is or what it will do.

Do you think the sales guy was explaining that no major network in the US is broadcasting in 4K yet. Not a chance. The technical side of the sales pitch at Best Buy went like this: "Dude, it's 4K, that is the best you can get, it will blow your mind and it is 30% off, today only. Just in time for your Super Bowl party." SOLD!

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At one of the annual corporate shows I worked on my client would put a big banner on the stage that said "Poor people have big TVs, rich people have big libraries." IMHO so true!
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Old January 1st, 2015, 09:37 PM   #12
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

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Originally Posted by Steven Digges View Post
Do you think the sales guy was explaining that no major network in the US is broadcasting in 4K yet. Not a chance. The technical side of the sales pitch at Best Buy went like this: "Dude, it's 4K, that is the best you can get, it will blow your mind and it is 30% off, today only. Just in time for your Super Bowl party." SOLD!
Really not sure, it's not my responsibility to be the moral police at Best Buy haha. I just know they ARE selling, doesn't matter to me why. I believe that one of their selling points is that the TV can upscale 1080p content to 4k, like how Blu-ray players "upscaled" regular DVDs back in the day.
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Old January 1st, 2015, 09:48 PM   #13
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

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Originally Posted by Michael Silverman View Post
So in my opinion, in most situations for the next few years 4K will make a difference only if the videographer make sure to mention it and uses it as a selling point. Otherwise, I think it's far less important to most brides than it is to the videographer.
I think it would be more important to them if they were probably educated. They're investing a lot of money already with us, why shouldn't they be informed of all options available to them, especially if it might mean a higher quality wedding film with a longer shelf life?

Ultimately the market will eventually dictate what they want. None of us will have a say in it no matter how much we shove it in their face, OR if you choose to pretend it's not an option.
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Old January 2nd, 2015, 07:46 AM   #14
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

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Originally Posted by Steven Digges View Post
The technical side of the sales pitch at Best Buy went like this: "Dude, it's 4K, that is the best you can get, it will blow your mind and it is 30% off, today only. Just in time for your Super Bowl party." SOLD!
Exactly, most people will believe whatever the salesperson whispers in their ear, it's only we seasoned videographers that know when they are lying. :)

I have not seen it yet but from what I have read 4K tv's also upscale well and I"m sure that blu-rayplayers, just like dvd players, will upscale HD well to 4K. It's only us videographers that worry about resolution and it's the client that worries about content.

Last edited by Noa Put; January 3rd, 2015 at 03:15 AM. Reason: typo
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Old January 3rd, 2015, 03:04 AM   #15
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Re: Not sure if UHD is going to be like 720p was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Digges View Post
Flying off the shelf at Best Buy? What are they watching on it? Do they even understand the availability, restrictions, and capabilities of what they bought? Owning high technology products now carries "status" with it among a certain class of egocentric consumers. I promise you that on Black Friday there were many fickle Americans that came home from Best Buy with a 4K TV and absolutely no clue about what it is or what it will do.
That's just a tad snarky. And a bit puzzling, since WE are always whining about consumers who seem happy with older tech. Now YOU are whining because they're a step ahead. They can't win.

4K content will trickle out, and they will be ready for it. That's all that matters.
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