events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future? - Page 5 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Wedding / Event Videography Techniques

Wedding / Event Videography Techniques
Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 19th, 2015, 03:51 PM   #61
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LIncolnshire, UK
Posts: 1,872
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

The thing is with DVD, just about everyone can sit in front of their TV and with no fuss at al,l just sit down and watch the content. With USB things aren't quite so straightforward, as many TVs, particularly older ones, just won't play them. In addition, DVDs have basically stayed the same for many years, whereas USB drives have constantly evolved though USB 1/2/3 each one offering an improvement in transfer speeds, but only if the playing equipment has the appropriate facility. So giving someone a USB 3 stick when they only have USB 1 playback could be a problem, that's assuming they even know what they have got.

Then there are other factors such as no facility for menus, which could be seen as a backward step and the small size could also be seen as diminishing the value in some people's eyes. I do like the fact that a DVD can be face printed, attractively packaged and presented as a nice personalised shiny disc with perceived value. A USB stick is just a very small piece of electronic gadgetry that just doesn't quite strike the same chord to my mind. We need something that is efficient, attractive and and is exciting to unpack and play in a way that is available to everyone. I think we still have a long way to go to achieve that at HD and beyond quality. Maybe we never will reach the global acceptance that DVD has found and delivery will have to tailored to individual client's playback facilities.

Roger
Roger Gunkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2015, 04:45 PM   #62
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Romsey, UK
Posts: 948
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

I can watch HD via iplayer on my PC, TV and tablet, plus I have a Google Play account with a couple of TV series and movies, many of them HD. These can be viewed via my tablet or via my TV using chromecast. In many ways its better than DVD - more portable, and much easier than bluray, where many disks lose their place if you stop or accidentally switch the thing off rather than pause or just because the player is having a funny five minutes. The only issues I have are variable download speeds and software updates that can cause glitches. Though this is more to do with Google Play. I plan to join Netflix at some point - I have a vast bluray collection and a dwindling DVD collection as blurays replace them, but some movies I've seen only once or very little, so Netflix would work better and that offers 4K, though few can take advantage of it.

So really are we that far off. As for menu; I find them annoying on DVD's and chapter selection is only used to find a place after the DVD has restarted; whereas online video tends to remember where you last stopped viewing - for the most part. :)

There was global acceptance of vinyl records, audio cassettes and video cassettes; how often do you play any of those.
Steve Burkett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2015, 07:54 PM   #63
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 7,826
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Hi Steve

I DO notice technique whilst watching TV but I'm pretty sure Bride's would NOT! The biggest thing that catches my eye constantly is the older programs have rock steady cameras (I guess even a tiny wobble was frowned upon with traditional movie making) Nowdays the camera crew seems to have discarded tripods, hoisted the camera on their shoulder and taken over ....the BBC even seems to have taken to using handheld cameras a lot more. Watch any newer drama and keep an eye on the top frame and you can see the guy is using a handheld camera even for big closeups!!

USB certainly should be the future but we still need to get to the stage where people actually know what to do with a USB drive and where to plug it in! They now know what to do with a DVD but I bet hand a USB over to the average person and say "Watch this movie" and they will be lost ... Maybe some education is needed?? A disk is still a familiar object but a USB sadly is not ... especially if the user is not a big computer person. How do we educate brides to show them how great USB's can be???

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 12:28 AM   #64
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Romsey, UK
Posts: 948
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
I DO notice technique whilst watching TV but I'm pretty sure Bride's would NOT!
Which was my exact point; technique plays a part in the style and presentation of all TV and Movies and yet is invisible to the ordinary viewer. They don't care what camera and other equipment was used to make said programme, yet the production company will give a great deal of thought to it, as should we in our work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
How do we educate brides to show them how great USB's can be???
I've got an appointment with a couple next week; I intend to bring round a USB with a media player, hook it up to their TV via HDMI and show various clips at SD and HD and let them see the difference. It's as simple as that.
Steve Burkett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 01:01 AM   #65
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,642
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

I have not encountered a couple that doesn't know what to do with a usb stick with a video file on it, they all knew they could just plug it into their tv, I could understand if their parents and grandparents are not aware about this but the current ipad and iphone generation are no tech noobs.

Quote:
technique plays a part in the style and presentation of all TV and Movies and yet is invisible to the ordinary viewer.
I followed a videocourse 10 years ago and our sound teacher explained us what effort went into the sound of the movie "seven", I was stunned to hear about how many layers of sound where used to produce the city sounds in the background. I"m sure a soundguy would be listening to that and hear the subtle differences but in my case I didn't even notice it was there, I just got absorbed by it, I didn't hear those different soundlayers, I felt them while watching the movie in the cinema and it made the experience much more real without knowing why.
Noa Put is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 01:03 AM   #66
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Romsey, UK
Posts: 948
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Actually thinking about it, I think I could put together a nice video showing how small an SD image is compared to the 4K I capture. I reduce the size of the picture on screen to 1/16 roughly of the full screen image, so it's a small rectangle in the middle of the screen, then squeeze it to 4:3, increase size to full screen at the now considerably lower resolution and then un-squeeze to fit the 16:9 screen. I can then do a split screen comparison with SD and HD. I'll pick shots with plenty of detail naturally. :)

I also plan to include in this demonstration video, examples of 4K stills and a run through of some of my extras such as Marryoke, Guest Messages - difference methods to film them and examples of same day edit and footage of how it's enjoyed on the day. Will make for a more interactive meeting that my usual just sitting down and chatting about the Wedding.
Steve Burkett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 01:20 AM   #67
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 7,826
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

There is nothing better than showing a client rather than having to try and explain it to them Steve. That is a good idea ... When I first came across you talking about Marryoke I was interested but not quite sure what you were doing. Then you posted a video and WOW! That made all the difference .... If they can see what the end result is then it saves you trying to tell them what you are trying to achieve and seeing is believing ... The last thing you want is a client imagining something completely different based on your description but saying "Watch this ..this is what you get" all doubt is removed!

Noa, most of my clients have an idea what a USB Thumb Drive is, sure BUT what happens when you get a call "my video won't play on my TV" or "there is no-where for this thing to plug into my IPad" ... I DO supply USB's but it would be easier when all devices have a USB port and all ports play MP4 video. IPads here don't even have a USB!! You can get a little USB adapter cable from Apple but for $200!!!!

At least most know where to put a DVD disk but sometimes I still shake my head when I see them putting a disk in with the printed side down ...!!!
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 02:38 AM   #68
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,642
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Every weddingclient of mine got a usb stick with several mp4 files on it last year and not one has contacted me afterwards with problems and many of them had a ipad and matching iphone. I just showed them each time how it worked on my tv to play those files but also told them how a cheap mediaplayer could solve any other playback issues.
Noa Put is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 05:51 AM   #69
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 7,826
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Someone said a long while back that media distribution would be card based but that never happened did it?

I would have thought that TV manufacturers would have got together by now and developed a universal system that all TV's could have where you just pick up a card/memory based media unit and it plugs into all TV's and they all play it! Would that be great? Almost like a USB drive or even a Bigger SD/CF card so you go to the video store, choose a movie and plug the card into the slot on the front and it plays.

I find it strange that some TV's will play MP4's and some wont ..surely electronics are smart enough to do that by now ... shucks my $149 printer accepts SDHC or CF cards with a slot up front so you can print your images and even edit them ... the TV manufacturers seem to have left that option out ... My mates massive TV does have a USB slot but sadly all it can do is play a slideshow and it's less than a year old .. I wonder why they are lagging behind??
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 09:19 AM   #70
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LIncolnshire, UK
Posts: 1,872
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

I agree with what both Noa and Steve say about it being quite easy to use a media player to access a USB stick, or some other easily available gadget and I also agree that the end product is better in HD than SD. It still doesn't alter my point though that you can't just hand over a USB stick and expect that clients and their friends and family are universally going to be able to sit down and watch it without some other gadgetry depending on what TV they happen to have. Frequently they can, but often they can't and of course Just because they can get it to work on their own TV doesn't mean that everyone else can. At the moment, DVD is still the most readily accessible Inspite of what the quality may be.



Steve, my comments earlier about content being king rather than quality, had nothing to do with technical ability, only to picture quality. I totally agree that great technique enhances viewing enjoyment even when not noticed when coupled to the content that the client wants to see. Many of the old VHS films had superb filmmaking techniques inspite of the poor picture quality.

Your idea of a 4k versus SD demonstration is a good one for the future, but I think you would struggle to show that to a potential client on their own equipment at the moment.

Roger
Roger Gunkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 12:51 PM   #71
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Romsey, UK
Posts: 948
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Gunkel View Post

Your idea of a 4k versus SD demonstration is a good one for the future, but I think you would struggle to show that to a potential client on their own equipment at the moment.

Roger
Er, that wasn't the plan. I'm only gonna show them an HD video, but use it to show the size ratio difference between 4K and SD; I could show a picture of coloured squares to demonstrate this, but it's better with video. My real aim is to show just how much you lose when converting for DVD. Many couples just won't have a clue; think of all those that ask if you film in HD and then select DVD as their format choice.
Steve Burkett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 04:41 PM   #72
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LIncolnshire, UK
Posts: 1,872
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Aaah now I see where you are going with it. The only drawback I can see to that is that you are are showing them the sweets but not allowing them to eat them. I want it, I want it, - well you can't have it - yet, but you can have this crotchety DVD version.

Roger
Roger Gunkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2015, 06:57 PM   #73
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 7,826
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

I seriously wonder if they even care? Brides especially I don't care a bit whether it's in XYZ or ABC format ..as long as it's clear and pleasant to the eye ..that's all they worry about so showing them big squares and little squares isn't going to impress the bride ..the groom maybe, but not the bride. She wants to go shopping and you ask her if she wants to go in your V6 4.2litre Chevvy or in the little 4 cylinder Hyundai Elantra ? She doesn't care ..she just wants to go shopping!!

I have had a few grooms ask me what format I film in and what cameras I have but that was a while back when HD was the "in thing" ... Honestly, this season (which has just ended here as it's Winter), I have not been asked any questions by bride or groom regarding cameras, format or resolution and they all booked me!

I just wonder if making a little "explanation" video, as good as it is, about SD/HD is really going to get better sales ?

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2015, 01:23 AM   #74
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Romsey, UK
Posts: 948
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Gunkel View Post
The only drawback I can see to that is that you are are showing them the sweets but not allowing them to eat them.
But I'm not selling 4K as a deliverable format now (apart from stills), I'm trying to explain the difference in resolution between what I'm filming and what size a DVD is in relation to it. It shows the vast gulf between capture and delivery if nothing else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
I seriously wonder if they even care? Brides especially I don't care a bit whether it's in XYZ or ABC format ..as long as it's clear and pleasant to the eye
Chris
I'm sure some do not, but others may do. I gave a recent example about a Bride who complained her Wedding video didn't look as good as her trailer because that was colour graded with filmconvert and the main video was just corrected for colour. Had I not used filmconvert, no doubt I'd not have had that complaint, but seeing an alternative made her notice the difference.
I'm not saying every Bride will say yay to USB and HD, but at least it'll be an informed choice. Showing side by side comparisons with HD and SD, especially in large group shots and even suggesting how terrible a DVD will look if they ever get a 4K TV will convince some to convert to USB or Bluray.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
I just wonder if making a little "explanation" video, as good as it is, about SD/HD is really going to get better sales ?
Chris
But it's not about sales, it's about cutting down on DVD delivery. Getting sales is about how I film, being unobtrusive, capturing special moments, multi camera, extras such as Marryoke, same day edit and Guest Messages and the fact that if all else fails, I get down on my hands and knees and beg the couple to book me. :)

There are no doubt some who don't even realise that DVD is not HD; I have one Corporate client who thinks his DVD's are HD and nothing I can say will change that. People can be swayed with a good pitch, but in the end, we're talking about 20-30 seconds on a 4 minute video that outlines my entire service. It's there to explain why I'm offering bluray and USB in my service and the difference each format can give. Obviously the drawbacks of USB will be covered for balance, but as most couples get at least 2 copies, I'll may well get more than 1/3 of my clients asking for USB as one of these copies, once they see the video.
Steve Burkett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2015, 02:04 AM   #75
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 7,826
Re: events /weddings : new media to distribute USB sticks: is the future?

Fair enough comment Steve

It's definitely all about workflow and spending as little time as practical producing your end product. After all we are running a business and time is money. I still shake my head when I hear about people proudly saying I spent 60 hours editing this wedding ... Ok, that very impressive but since you charged the bride $2000 and spent a total of maybe 80 hours in all producing the end product do you realise you made a mere $25 an hour ?? If you chop your post production to 30 hours instead of 60 your rate jumps to $40 an hour ... I wonder how many video producers actually cost out a wedding?

If USB delivery or even better online delivery can save you time then that's worth doing as it gives you a better profit. I find that rendering to MPEG2 is quicker than rendering to1080 MP4 so for me that's more time holding up the computer and that equals less profit. To be honest I have never actually done a comparison between production time ..from render to end media on either but if one is a faster production method I'm all for it.

The final decision on delivery should still be the bride's choice not ours but if you can show her why she should choose one over the other that's just common sense. Maybe let us have a peek at your video when you make it??

Chris
Chris Harding is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

Omega Broadcast
(512) 251-7778
Austin, TX

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

EVS
(800) 238-8480
Glendale, CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Wedding / Event Videography Techniques

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:10 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2015 The Digital Video Information Network