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Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...


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Old July 7th, 2015, 06:26 AM   #1
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The average edit...

Had a long chat with another video guy yesterday and we started discussing the 'edit' and where most of the time goes.

It seems that we can break the edit down in to the following major areas:

Ingest, sort & keyword
Sync & Edit Multicam (for those that do multicam) for
-- Ceremony
-- Speeches
-- First Dance
Edit the highlights film (either short 5 mins or longer 20 mins)
Colour correction / grading
Audio mixing / sweetening
Export master file
Compress for disc
DVD / Blu-ray menu design
Disc Label & Inlay Design
Disc Production
Other misc tasks

I was wondering where you all spend your time and roughly how much time you spend in each area for the 'average' wedding you do?

For those who have never done this exercise it may be a good one to do to figure out where you make / lose your money!

Thoughts?
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Old July 7th, 2015, 06:56 AM   #2
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Re: The average edit...

That's pretty much what I do - I don't keyword my clips however - I create a timeline for each part of the day and drop the clips in the relevant ones as I'm sorting them.
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Old July 7th, 2015, 07:41 AM   #3
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Re: The average edit...

My processional editing takes a shockingly large amount of time, but, yes, that's pretty close for me.

For me, before I'm ever in my editor, I dump all the files into a folder, then sort them into sub folders by part of the day (prep, ceremony, reception, dancing). Then I change their names in bulk. So when I go look for ceremony files in my editor, they're labeled ("ceremonybride.mov" "ceremonyrear.mov" and "ceremonygroom.mov)

----------

I create my full length documentary edit first, pulling the best clip from each moment to the top line of my NLE. Later, when I go to make highlights, I cut away what I won't be using. (separate project save files, of course) That means I go from having a 90 minute project, then a 20 minute, then the 5'er last.
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Old July 7th, 2015, 07:51 AM   #4
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Re: The average edit...

I guess what I was wondering was more like "how much time do you spend in each section of the process" for an average wedding?
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Old July 7th, 2015, 08:13 AM   #5
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Re: The average edit...

Ingest, sort & keyword ........45 minutes
Sync & Edit Multicam (for those that do multicam) for
-- Ceremony ...........2hrs (3cams)
-- Speeches.............1-2 hours depending on length or twice real time (2 cams)
-- First Dance............and about 10mis of extra dancing 30mins (2 cams)
Edit the highlights film ......Don't usually do one but allow 2 hours if asked
Colour correction / grading .......30minutes after ingestion
Audio mixing / sweetening ...... 15 mins to equalise and compress
Export master file .............Don't export separately, DVD made from timeline overnight, save is automatic
Compress for disc.............Only compress to MP4 if USB required, again overnight or down time.
DVD / Blu-ray menu design........10 minutes changing template menu to new wedding
Disc Label & Inlay Design...........15 minutes changing basic templates and adding pics
Disc Production............Initial overnight (see above) extras 10 minutes each
Other misc tasks............Archiving master Disc files and artwork 10 minutes

Total 7-8 hours plus overnight for master rendering., which usually takes about 3 hours.

Roger
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Old July 7th, 2015, 05:20 PM   #6
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Re: The average edit...

Copy files to HDD into folders for the different parts of the day, each labelled with a number beginning with 01, then 02 etc. so I can ingest with folders as keywords using XML. (2 hours for ingest and folders)
Copy to Server and go to sleep. (1 minute)
Sync & Edit Multicam (for those that do multicam) for
-- Ceremony (5 hours)
-- Speeches (5 hours)
-- First Dance (don't do this as yet - but had a request to do so for my next wedding)
Edit the highlights film (either short 5 mins or longer 20 mins) (Most of my time spent here - must take around 20 hours)
Colour correction / grading (3 hours)
Audio mixing / sweetening (1 hour)
Export master file (in Compressor, can take a couple of hours)
Compress for disc (Use Handbrake, takes an hour or two - usually do a HQ for USB and LQ for DVD)
DVD / Blu-ray menu design (An hour in iDVD)
Disc Label & Inlay Design (An hour for case design)
Disc Production (Can take up to 2 days for iDVD to sort everything and output the film - don't know if this is the norm?)
Other misc tasks (Like speaking to the bride etc? Meet once, countless emails and prep (because I'm new and want every part of the day carefully managed) Takes about 4 hours - hour meet - hour journey - 2 hours planning and an hour in liason.

Total: Around 44 hours.

I am happy with time, as the day's shoot is just fun! :)

In reality, I take a while with the short film highlights, and as yet, only offer around 8 minute films. I'm also slow at editing at the minute, as I often run into noob issues that I kick myself for having.

Craig

In comparison to Roger, I am a failure haha! I hope to halve most of those times eventually, but I guess I will get more of a workflow with time, and know what looks right, rather than still experimenting.
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Old July 7th, 2015, 06:33 PM   #7
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Re: The average edit...

Craig, I have been filming and editing for over 30 years. and a lot of my filming is done with the editing in mind, so visual flow is captured at the filming stage much of the time. It cuts editing time substantially. You'll save time as you get into a routine and find shortcuts and workarounds that you are happy with :-)

Roger
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Old July 7th, 2015, 07:03 PM   #8
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Re: The average edit...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Gunkel View Post
Craig, I have been filming and editing for over 30 years. and a lot of my filming is done with the editing in mind, so visual flow is captured at the filming stage much of the time. It cuts editing time substantially. You'll save time as you get into a routine and find shortcuts and workarounds that you are happy with :-)

Roger
Thanks Roger! I hope to do so!!!

Looking forward to my next weddings in the Summer! I had the opportunity to second shoot the other week, and learnt a lot from doing that too, even though our workflows were completely different!

Looking forward to seeing how others breakdown their times!

Thanks for the helpful comments,

Craig
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Old July 7th, 2015, 07:15 PM   #9
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Re: The average edit...

Hi Craig

There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking 44 hours to do an edit as LONG as you cost it into your price. I do mine in probably a quarter of that time and that's cos I also, like Roger, shoot for editing. My lucrative market requires me to cost out around $75 an hour and 20 to 25 hours tops which has to include the shoot and the edit. I'd love to kick back and take 44 hours to edit BUT if I did that my packages would need to be at least $4500 if I want to make my hourly rate and the market just doesn't support that amount for a solo operator!
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Old July 8th, 2015, 01:39 PM   #10
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Re: The average edit...

Seems the guys that have been around for a while can edit quickly, because we used to have to edit in camera, its something that stays with you. I shot my first wedding in 1982 on 3/4 inch Umatic using 20 minute tapes. This could be edited down to VHS with reasonable results. Then along came portable VHS and Betamax. Original VHS was excellent, all 240 lines of it !!! Edited VHS was awful. A-B roll editing sytems were expensive, about 8500 in the early 90s. I became an expert in editing in camera, I had to, couldnt afford an edit set up. Quite a few weddings in the early days were edited completely in camera, It was the only way to give the customer a tape of good quality. And as Roger pointed out, it makes you think about the shots you are taking.
BTW My average edit time was 2 to 3 days
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Old July 8th, 2015, 07:09 PM   #11
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Re: The average edit...

Hi Colin

In the Full VHS days, what I would do is make up an optical title (usually the wedding invitation) and then film it and put the tape to one side until the actual wedding day but already with it's labels on. On the day it was all edit in camera until the couple were off to their car with the mandatory tin cans tied to the back. I would then eject the tape and hand it to the couple ...they got a virgin recording and an instant wedding video and I had no editing to do.

As you have already said when I compare what I still shoot now and then look at other guys raw footage I can see why people are talking about 40 to 60 hours!! Gosh, on 90% of my footage all I have to do is top and tail the clip and I am done ... not sitting for hours trying to stitch together tiny segments of video!

Chris
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Old July 9th, 2015, 04:17 AM   #12
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Re: The average edit...

I think editing in camera is a lost art with the new breed of camera operator out there. The time saving when you work that way is phenomenal. I am always counting the length of each shot as I take it and making sure that the next one is part of the flow.

Roger
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Old July 9th, 2015, 05:55 AM   #13
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Re: The average edit...

this is how mine works out
Ingest, sort & keyword
Sync & Edit Multicam for
-- Bridal Prep
-- Arrival
-- Ceremony
-- Greeting line
-- Photoshoot
-- Arrival at reception
-- Speeches
-- Guest messages
-- First Dance
Edit full feature first then the highlights film (15 mins)
Colour correction / grading
Audio mixing / sweetening
Export master file
Compress for disc
DVD / Blu-ray menu design
Disc Label & Inlay Design
Disc Production
Other misc tasks
I usually do maybe two three hours a day sometimes less at times i might only go at it three times in the week depending on time, as I do other stuff too, still photography, IT work etc.

but I imagine it'd be around the 30/40 hours total
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Old July 9th, 2015, 04:05 PM   #14
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Re: The average edit...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
I can see why people are talking about 40 to 60 hours!! Gosh, on 90% of my footage all I have to do is top and tail the clip and I am done
Thats the way Chris. Old habits are hard to dismiss
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Old July 9th, 2015, 04:56 PM   #15
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Re: The average edit...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Gunkel View Post
I think editing in camera is a lost art with the new breed of camera operator out there. The time saving when you work that way is phenomenal. I am always counting the length of each shot as I take it and making sure that the next one is part of the flow.

Roger
You have to remember that not all those who film and edit are the same people. In the industry, there are those skilled in filming and those skilled in editing. Now I don't approach my own business that way as I handle both, in most cases. However when I film, I prefer to focus on filming and not on the editing. That doesn't mean my experience as an editor hasn't influenced my filming, but when I film, I film to grab as much footage as possible. This does increase the editing time in logging this footage, but allows me to be more creative in post production, especially as I offer two edits of the video. It's a different approach to yours but pays dividends for me.

Alas the industry is full of lost arts for the experienced Videographer to lament over. One day, my approach to videography will be a lost art.
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