A question about shooting football (soccer) at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Wedding / Event Videography Techniques

Wedding / Event Videography Techniques
Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old December 13th, 2015, 12:51 PM   #1
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
A question about shooting football (soccer)

Hello all,

I'm hoping I can pick the collective brains to get some advice about improving my workflow for a particular kind of shooting.

I work for Dumbarton FC (a Scottish Professional football league Championship team) shooting games and then producing a 10-15 minute "highlights" package which is then uploaded to the YouTube channel ("SonsTV"). I shoot using a Sony HVR A1E and a Datavideo DN60 CF recorder. I use a dictaphone to note highlights, goals, red cards etc and the time at which they occur.
When I get home, I Clipwrap the resultant m2t files to mov, then load each half into the project timeline using FCP7. I then go through the 45 minute or so footage, clipping around the highlights etc, loading the first half at zero on the time line, and the second half at 1.00.00.00 on the timeline so that I can easily find the highlight (ie if the the highlight in the second half occurs 15 minutes in, I'd look at 1.00.15.00). Hope that makes sense!

I'm finding the managing of the shooting and the noting of highlights with the dictaphone a bit of a challenge, and so I was wondering if there is a more obvious or straight forward way of doing this which makes it easy to find a particular point in the footage. I should point out that there is zero budget for this - I volunteer my time, and the gear is all mine. Any alternative method would need to make use of what I have!

Any ideas?

Many thanks

Dave
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 13th, 2015, 01:42 PM   #2
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: LOWESTOFT - UK
Posts: 2,125
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

To be honest, I hate football, and when I have to do this occasionally, I get pretty fed up. I think I will steal your idea, because it's better than my current system of trying to do it from memory and by wandering all over the timeline. Your system seems pretty logical. I use Premiere, but the same system will work for me. I realise you want better, but what you are doing seems pretty good to me!
Paul R Johnson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 13th, 2015, 02:02 PM   #3
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Lol, I'm shocked - how can you hate football, the beautiful game? To be honest, standing on a freezing concrete floored shed watching my team being thrashed, I can honestly say there are times I hate it too...

I'm pleased you think it's a logical system, hope it works out for you! I do occasionally find myself rather hysterically shouting repeatedly into the (off) dictaphone whilst trying to see what time has elapsed and following the action. I also live in unrelenting terror of...missing a goal...

all the best

Dave
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 14th, 2015, 08:19 AM   #4
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: LIncolnshire, UK
Posts: 2,051
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Haven't shot a football match for a few months, but would usually use the main camera as high as possible,
level with the pitch centreline probably in the stands, although I have used a stepladder before now if there is no stand. You can't capture a football match properly unless you are looking down on it. For the last one I also used a pair of cheap SJ4000 cams (GoPro clones), with one just behind each goal which gave great footage of goals and saves. A pair of those cams is only about 100 and would be well worth it if you are shooting matches regularly. If the goal has a back top frame supporting the net, the camera can be clamped to that just under the frame, where it is also out of the reach of inquisitive children.

I would normally just scrub through the footage on the timeline for highlights and incidents, but a voice recorder could be useful for notes, preferably one with voice activation. You could also use the stopwatch facility on a smartphone, set to lap times, so you just click it each time there is an incident, which will give you all the times in sequence.

Roger
Roger Gunkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 15th, 2015, 01:19 PM   #5
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

> stopwatch facility on a smartphone, set to lap times, so you just click it each time there is an incident<<

Ooh - that sounds like a grand idea. I'll give it a go on Saturday!

Many thanks!

D
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16th, 2015, 12:13 PM   #6
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Atlantic Coast Canada
Posts: 578
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

I shoot american style football for high schools and minor league teams.in atlantic canada
Maybe start and stop recording when the ball is in and out of play. Upload all the clips from the game and let them sort out what they want to watch. The playes and team know about when and thus in which clip the highlite occurs and the number of views meter will take it from there for others
Bruce Dempsey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16th, 2015, 01:02 PM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 270
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Shoot for the edit:
I use this method for American Football, and it has saved me hours and hours of re-watching footage.

In American football, a play only last for several seconds, then there is a "stoppage" of play while the teams set-up for the next play. Because of this, I can briefly stop/start recording between each play.

1. If there is a GREAT play, when I stop the camera, I immediately record a "white" frame. That is, I record either 1 second of a Bright Day Sky, or 1 second of the Bright stadium lights.
2, If there is an absolute BORING play, when I stop the camera, I record a "black" frame. That is I place my hand over my lens hood, and record 1 second of darkness.

When I import all the scenes into my timeline, I use the SCENE view to see a thumbnail of each scene.
I can immediately see/delete all the Dark frames, and the Scene Immediately before it.
Next, I look for the White frames, knowing that the scene before it has great footage.

To adapt this to futbol, you would need to pick-and-choose where you start/stop recording.
I must warn you, if you try this method, you need to be doubly sure that you remember to start recording again in between your white/dark frames
Vince Pachiano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16th, 2015, 02:17 PM   #8
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 790
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

I did this for a local Rugby team for cheap, but not for free/volunteer. That said it was a PITA. I hope your friends with them or something, doing this for no charge, because its one of those things that requires ALOT of work, even tho they may not care all that much of the quality of it, sometimes people think 'Just have a beer while your shooting' makes it fun or worthwhile or something.

What I found best was writing down the clip # & time any scores or big plays happened. That way I could zip thru on the edit & upload. Eventually tho this past season they called and wanted me to do it for alot cheaper (I would also upload each Quarter to YT & send both coaches a DVD) to the point it just wasn't worth my while at all. People think 'It doesn't have to be perfect' somehow can give them a 50% reduction in costs for some reason?! Would a roofer or car mechanic work that way?? The rate I was originally getting was pretty low already, so I just didn't have it in me to do it for much less.
David Barnett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16th, 2015, 04:15 PM   #9
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Yep,

Been doing it for 2 seasons now, each and every Saturday (just about) during the season entirely written off. I am usually finished editing by about midnight after the game, by which time I'm starting to go a bit gaga. Thats with me starting at midday, since I have to be at the ground at least an hour before the games start. The editing has been very challenging at times, with me making lots and lots of mistakes, and it can be demoralisingly frustrating when FCP crashes, or when you get timecode slippage in the rendered file and have to re-render it. I've had drunken opposing fans grab the camera shouting "Take a picture of me, big man" I've had bovril spilled on me and people falling onto the tripod when other teams wont let me film from their camera positions and have put me instead in the midst of the travelling support. I've had the "real" media moving my camera when my backs turned, or pushing me out of the way at the post-match interviews. But, I've had great feedback from the Dumbarton fans, and from the supporters trust. I know some of the players watch and appreciate the highlights, and doing this means my older brother who is based in China most of the year and who is a Dumbarton FC nut, gets to see highlights of games he'd virtually never see otherwise. I'd love to get paid but there is zero chance of that ever happening. There is so little money in the Scottish game outwith the top league that virtually all of the championship sides have to get by with volunteer media, and indeed volunteer just about everything else. Like most good Scots, I like to have a moan about it all but in reality I love doing it and wouldn't miss it for the world. You can find my efforts at www.youtube.com/SonsTVDumbartonFC - (I hope its OK to do that?) and of course any tips, advice and constructive criticism for this enthusiastic amateur would be most welcome!

Dave
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 16th, 2015, 05:02 PM   #10
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Philly, PA
Posts: 790
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Ok, yours seems A LOT more professional than what I was shooting. The rugby team I worked with was more of a club with about 50 attendees at a school field & very little online interest.

You should try to push the online presence via FB & Twitter, see if you can have access to post on their pages, try to acquire likes, fans & followers, then myb next season be brought on as a Media Manager of some kind. Even if it's a part time gig or something, just try to show the value that you're bringing. With stands that big I'm surprised they can't have any sort of budget for it whatsoever.
David Barnett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2015, 05:13 AM   #11
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

many thanks for the helpful ideas, guys, lots of thought-provoking suggestions.
It seems that (after RTFM!) he DN60 has a "mark" facility which results in a new clip being formed each time, so that might be a way forward too.

appreciate the help

dave
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2015, 07:09 AM   #12
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Lakeland Florida
Posts: 619
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

If your camera has color bars, you can use a second or two of the bars (and tone if you have it) to mark a good play. That stands out when skimming through the timeline. Another trick I've used shooting sports, is when the stadium has a scoreboard, grab a shot of the scoreboard as a marker.
__________________
Roger
trueviewfilms.com
Roger Van Duyn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2015, 09:23 AM   #13
Trustee
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Crookston, MN
Posts: 1,353
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

If you're trying to mark spots when recording, but don't want to stop and start, just have a little white board handy. Something good happens, hold it in front of your lens after the action is over.

I'd pair that with a little notepad to write reminders and ideas and approximate times.

For a chance at better highlights, I'd also see what happens with an unmanned camera (if secure) with a field level view of the area in front of the goal. Up high gives you the highlight, field level gives you the celebration. Possibly.
Robert Benda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2015, 09:34 AM   #14
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK
Posts: 3,445
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Jenkinson View Post
YLike most good Scots, I like to have a moan about it all but in reality I love doing it and wouldn't miss it for the world. You can find my efforts at www.youtube.com/SonsTVDumbartonFC - (I hope its OK to do that?) and of course any tips, advice and constructive criticism for this enthusiastic amateur would be most welcome!
I just took a look at the Youtube channel. You are doing a great job for your team. It's very slick & professional looking & I can only imagine the number of hours it takes you. You are obviously well practiced at this now & your camera work is excellent

I used to own a Sony HVR A1E & it's a great little HDV camcorder but I am glad to see that you are using the Datavideo DN60 CF recorder so at least you aren't spending a couple of hours capturing tapes before you can even start the edit.
Nigel Barker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2015, 12:28 PM   #15
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 16
Re: A question about shooting football (soccer)

Wow, many thanks for the feedback - I appreciate it.

I agree, the Sony is a fantastic little camera and it has handled everything (jncluding driven rain and snow, though I now have a Portabrace cover for it) without batting an eye. But it is perfect when you pair it with the DN60, much much easier workflow now (when I started I was using FCP to capture which was pretty laborious!).

Cheers

Dave
David Jenkinson is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Wedding / Event Videography Techniques

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:19 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network