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Wedding / Event Videography Techniques
Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...


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Old February 7th, 2006, 10:13 AM   #16
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Andrew,

THe XL2 is an excellant choice. It's very versatile and can shoot native 16 x 9. It's a choice I think you will be happy with.

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Old February 7th, 2006, 02:38 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Oveson
You also mentioned that you can shoot in 24 fps with the existing HD cameras. While this is true, NONE of them except for the Panasonic HVX200 can shoot in 24P.
I said you can shoot in 24p in HD, just as you can in SD. Agreed that the HVX200 would be the camera to get if that's important to you, unless you can afford something better.

Quote:
I guess I am a bit behind when it comes to HD-DVD as I didn't know there were burners available for the format. How will you test your material?
The first thing I want to do is find out if the new players can display HD video from a standard red-laser DVD, which in theory they should be able to do. If they can then that might be the best HD distribution option for the foreseeable future, since a red-laser disc is much less expensive to produce and much more widely playable than a blue-laser one. If they can't then I'm back to producing widescreen SD DVDs, and I might just return the player since it wouldn't be much use to me.
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Old February 7th, 2006, 03:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Shaw
"but there's no logical basis why a low frame rate would look better than a higher one"
Well, actually there is but I do not understand it on any more than abstract terms...I can see it in my head but cannot describe it. Perhaps it's the speed at which the motion blurs? Perhaps it's the amount of a certain breed of detail (not resolution detail but something much finer...more subtle) that gets captured at that rate....I don't pretend to know the exactitudes of it, but when I see it I am amazed. Like most everyone else I had shot 60i for a long time. For most of that time I didn't have a clue about frame rates and such...I was a complete amatuer just having fun with a camera....but I was always aware of "the video look". It bugged me and I longed to escape it...I had just assumed that there was only one way....to shoot on film. Then I got into video and movie making on a deeper level and learned about these things which timed up perfectly with the release of the DVX100.....got one, went out into the backyard and shot some test footage, brought it in and captured and was stunned....completely stunned. I'm not Adam Wilt or Barry Won Kennobi, but I do see an amazing, instantly cinematic look to the DVX (and I would have to assume the XL2) footage shot in 24p....it's VASTLY different that 60i, still quite different than 30p and it is the artistic aesthetic that I and many, many others choose for their motion picture creation and also know it to be quite distinct from any other form of video.

In fairness I'll point out that the way the camera handles gamma makes a large difference too, so it's not just the frame rate that makes the overall DVX awesomeness, but even shooting with normal gamma the 24p difference is there.
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Old February 8th, 2006, 01:17 AM   #19
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One of the reasons 24p looks good to many people is because of conditioning. The best cinematography we have seen in our lives is always at 24 frames per second. Conversly much of the poor video, news etc we see is @60i. Oddly in Japan they prefer the 60i look or so I've heard.

Mike
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Old February 9th, 2006, 08:44 AM   #20
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I haven't read all the posts but this is my 2 cents. If you are just starting in this business, take advantage of the Sony rebate and buy PD-170s. This camera is industrial strength, compact, delivers great images and is acknowledged as one of the best for low-light receptions.

Forget HD cameras for now because the product line has not matured and there is no real delivery for HD content. When do we really think a majority of brides will have HD DVD players in their homes. When they do, you can think about upgrading everything to HD and by then maybe the Z3(?) will see better in the dark.

Concentrate on learning how to capture compelling images because it is the content in your video that counts the most to B&Gs. Quality wedding video is a blend of artistic and technical skills. Concentrate on developing these skills with your camera and learn from some of the experts in this forum. I know I did.
Bob
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Old February 9th, 2006, 10:19 AM   #21
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The canon XL2 is a great camera, but for weddings? I had a XL1s and used it for a few weddings and each times I wish I had got the PD170. The main reason was after a few hours of carry the Canon around my arm and back where hurting. You better have a mono pod or something.
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Old February 9th, 2006, 02:13 PM   #22
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I just want to say a big thank you to everyone who has posted so far. After reading all of the posts and searched these forums some more I have come to the conclusion that it is indeed a tricky time to be setting up a new business like this, as it seems silly to get a high end SD camcorder but maybe too early for a HD.

Although saying that IMO I find it a little silly at this moment to buy a high end camcorder like the XL2 as in two years time or so I will have to upgrade to HD… when I do what will I do with the SD camcorder?... surely no body would buy a XL2 (for example) as it will be an old technology and if they do I’ll probity get not much for it. Also if I keep it why would I ever use it again when I’ll have a HD camcorder?

So at the moment my train of thought goes with a HDV camcorder, as it will also do SD and the HD will be there too ready for when I am ready. I have looked into a few and have been very impressed with the Canon XL H1 although it’s very pricey!!! but it has the Image stabilizer Auto focus. Also… and forgive me for saying this… but it looks the part and in my opinion this counts in this business… it shouldn’t but it does.

Having said all that as bob said…

“Quality wedding video is a blend of artistic and technical skills.”

Which I have to agree with fully and at the end of the end the camcorder is only a tool… but you must still choose your tool wisely! I don’t have another wedding booked till the end of march but would like to order something by the end of next week… it’s a big decision and a lot of money so again any more comments are welcomed… as for me… more researching head banging!

Thanks again in advance.
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Old February 9th, 2006, 04:02 PM   #23
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If you're shooting wedding videos there is no rush to go HD. Spend the $3500.00 on an xl2, my only suggestion would be to buy the 16x manual lens for it. The standard lens is OK at best. (tough to focus correctly)
Your final product will look great and the camera will pay for itself after a few weddings, and yes there will be a market for a used xl2 in 2 years if you want to switch to HD. Don't believe the hype, HD is coming just not that quick.

Mark Bournes
Shark Video Productions
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Old February 9th, 2006, 04:33 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Bournes
If you're shooting wedding videos there is no rush to go HD. Spend the $3500.00 on an xl2, my only suggestion would be to buy the 16x manual lens for it. The standard lens is OK at best. (tough to focus correctly)
Your final product will look great and the camera will pay for itself after a few weddings, and yes there will be a market for a used xl2 in 2 years if you want to switch to HD. Don't believe the hype, HD is coming just not that quick.

Mark Bournes
Shark Video Productions
I'll have to agree with Mark on that. There will still be plenty of demand for an XL2 in two years. It won't be entirely wasted money if you do go that route now. I'd estimate you could still get back half of your initial investment in two years.

However, I can see your reasoning for an HDV camera. It'll do HD and SD, so it's more versatile. I would pass on the Canon XL-H1 right now as it is WAY overpriced for what it does. The Sony FX1 and Z1 are both great cameras and I have seen stunning videos made with them. Want a sample? Try this: http://www.proeditproductions.com/ This gentleman shoots with Z1s and the videos he creates are incredible. Like you said before, the camera IS just a tool, but picking the right one is important. Good luck with the decision. Let us know what you decide as it may help others in the future.
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