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Old June 28th, 2006, 10:38 AM   #1
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How long do you keep project on computer?

I have run into the problem where I have so many weddings, so little computer space. I thought I had plenty but as it turns out I'll be ordering another hard drive very soon. Anyways, I like to keep project files from weddings up on my computer until I know the client is completely satisfied that way if there was a problem I can easily go in and fix it. However, with so many weddings in a row I can't really stall off and keep projects sitting there because new ones need to get on there. So here are my questions:

1) How long do you keep the project file on your computer before deleting it?
2) Do you back the whole project and captured files onto several dvd's in case you need to go back in and change something or just keep a master copy of the final dvd?
3) How big is your hardrive?
4) What do you do when a client hasn't sent their final payment yet so you can't send them their dvd yet so you're left with it sitting on you computer taking up space....
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Old June 28th, 2006, 10:55 AM   #2
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Quote:
1) How long do you keep the project file on your computer before deleting it?
10 days after delivery. The client is told this.

Quote:
2) Do you back the whole project and captured files onto several dvd's in case you need to go back in and change something or just keep a master copy of the final dvd?
I make two master DVD copies and also send one copy to tape. I use the tape copy to make demos. That way I'm working with AVI and not MPEG

Quote:
3) How big is your hardrive?
Three 160 gb external drives. I use one to back up my current project every couple of days (overnight of course).

Quote:
4) What do you do when a client hasn't sent their final payment yet so you can't send them their dvd yet so you're left with it sitting on you computer taking up space....
Get all the money 10 days before the wedding. :)
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Old June 28th, 2006, 10:56 AM   #3
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Jen,

Hi...I am rather new to the Video side....but I can tell you that wehn it comes to final payment....That is expected 2 weeks prior to the wedding. I never deal with money on or after the wedding day unless it is something ectra that the customer wants to order. This has always worked out great for us....have never ran into a problem doiing it this way.

So I cant answer you how long I keeo video files on the computer because I am just starting the Video side....but I do have an internal 160gb hdd and just ordered a G-Tech 250gb hdd...So well see how this will work for me...before I find I need more.

Sorry I couldnt be of more help

Nathan
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Old June 28th, 2006, 11:01 AM   #4
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You don't need to back up your source footage. Just keep the original tapes and recapture if needed. That's much more economical than burning a dozen or more DVDs having to split the source files as needed to fit. So, save the project file, any photos and music files (i.e. any NON video elements) and just burn them to a CD.

Naturally, the best option would be to use a separate hard drive for each project. When that project is done, simply swap out another hard drive for the next project. Then if you needed to return to the other project, you could just put the other hard drive back into place. Eventually, the hard drive could be re-used on another project (i.e. after x number of weeks).

I always print a final version to tape as well. I could always recapture that if the changes were minor and didn't affect the larger portion of the project. Then it might simply be a matter of capturing a few minutes from the original source to fix or replace some of the footage from the "final" project.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 11:20 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Troxel
You don't need to back up your source footage. Just keep the original tapes and recapture if needed. That's much more economical than burning a dozen or more DVDs having to split the source files as needed to fit. So, save the project file, any photos and music files (i.e. any NON video elements) and just burn them to a CD.
Edward, this is how it's *supposed* to work but you ever try this in Premiere? :)

I'd like nothing more than to archive my projects with just tapes and a CD but it never quite works that way.

I think Vegas does (no experience though) because it doesn't generate all that ancillary crap like Premiere. Plus if batch capturing is used or even different IN/OUT points it's almost impossible for me to recreate a project from scratch this way. I'm not sure I'd want to even sit through 6 or 7 hours of recapturing again anyway. Then Premiere gets testy if the project file changes folders and prompts you to hunt for all the missing files.

Nope, much easier for me to mirror to another drive and just scrap it all 10 days after completion. I've never had a need to resurrect a project and don't intend to. Done means "Done" in my books.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 11:32 AM   #6
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I have never done what Ed advises, but I wonder: can you be sure that the recaptured files will be frame-accurate? The slightest slip and they will be worthless, if any editing is involved.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 01:14 PM   #7
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1) We proof clips online, then send a proof DVD prior to the final copies. We then delete the footage to days after delivering the final DVDs and the couple is told that.

2) I back up the final DVD and also keep it on a harddrive. I keep several of the build files (mpeg2 and aiff) around if they might be used for a demo later. With the two proofing options, I haven't had any problems yet wih deleting the project right after delivery.

3) For video, we have 1 external tht just carries the build files and copies of the DVDs. Three more external drives hold a total of three to four current weddings and one more internal for very small weddings, love stories etc. Total space is about 1.2Tb and is turned over very quickly, I never seem tohave much free space.

4)Send them the final DVDs with an invoice. I, as well as several other members on this board, have used this method without a problem before. It helps to somewhat know the couple your dealing with, so you know if you can take that risk. In the future, I would be sure to add something that covers this in the contract, which prevents them from making any changes if there payment is not on time or something that works with your system.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 02:49 PM   #8
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It DOES work and is frame accurate - at least in Vegas. I *DO* batch capture and all it needs to do is the same batch capture. Everything is just fine afterwards. If you do a "capture tape", it would probably NOT be frame accurate.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 03:14 PM   #9
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I always keep a disc image of the DVD on my harddrive. Everything else gets deleted. I also keep a copy of the completed edit on tape. I have a 250g external drive, so I need to clear everything before beginning another project.
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Old June 28th, 2006, 04:17 PM   #10
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It's easy in Premiere....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Steele
Edward, this is how it's *supposed* to work but you ever try this in Premiere? :)

I'd like nothing more than to archive my projects with just tapes and a CD but it never quite works that way.

I think Vegas does (no experience though) because it doesn't generate all that ancillary crap like Premiere. Plus if batch capturing is used or even different IN/OUT points it's almost impossible for me to recreate a project from scratch this way. I'm not sure I'd want to even sit through 6 or 7 hours of recapturing again anyway. Then Premiere gets testy if the project file changes folders and prompts you to hunt for all the missing files.

Nope, much easier for me to mirror to another drive and just scrap it all 10 days after completion. I've never had a need to resurrect a project and don't intend to. Done means "Done" in my books.
I do it with Premiere every week. First you have to batch capture. When done and ready to delete the files you delete the captured video, conformed audio, previews...so all you are left with is the project, titles, pix...that sort of thing. Burn the folder to CD or DVD. If you have to re-capture a project put the folder back on the HD....open the project...Premiere will start telling you it doesn't have this and that....tell it to skip all.....then right click on your clips 1 at a time and select batch capture. Premiere puts the clips back in the same place you had them before and as each clip is finished it updates the timeline to show the re-captured clips. Works a charm. Does it take time to re-capture??? Sure.....but at least you don't have to re-do the entire edit if you don't have the project files. I've only had to do this twice in 8 years.....you might not have had to do it....yet...but when you do .......
Mark
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Old June 28th, 2006, 07:05 PM   #11
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1) How long do you keep the project file on your computer before deleting it?

5 days after the delivery of the finished DVD's. This is in the contract.
I keep a master copy on DV tape and all the project and media files used with the finished product (from photos, to music, to title templates to credit texts). This way i can always go back and reuse titles, etc
I also keep the capture tape logs. I then hang onto thte tapes for 6 months before i either wipe or reuse the tapes.

2) Do you back the whole project and captured files onto several dvd's in case you need to go back in and change something or just keep a master copy of the final dvd?

No, im hired as an editor, therefore my discretion is final. However some larger clients and picky brides prefer to see the finished product. I do this prior to final delivery whereby they have 5 days to contact me in writing to confirm any technical changes required.

The only elements i keep on the HDD are short version highlight AVI's and AC3's and raw waves, all the images i capture, and certain custom backgrounds i may have created with PI3. Then i archive everything else... except the actual footage.
I have 2 TB here on this machine and another 1 TB on the other.. storage usually isnt an issue and i regualarly edit 4 weddings on this unit and 2 on the other

3) How big is your hardrive?

Main system about 2TB, in a disc array of removable IDE drives (so i can chop and change from system to system as needed) and 1TB on the drafting box

4) What do you do when a client hasn't sent their final payment yet so you can't send them their dvd yet so you're left with it sitting on you computer taking up space....

I dont hit record until the money's in the bank
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Old July 5th, 2006, 08:08 AM   #12
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1) How long do you keep the project file on your computer before deleting it?

Well, if you look in my attic, you'll understand why I still have a wedding in complete from 2003 on one of my hardrives.

2) Do you back the whole project and captured files onto several dvd's in case you need to go back in and change something or just keep a master copy of the final dvd?

I keep copies of the DVD's I make extras on every project I do, if just for demo purchase. But have sent them if the B&G ask for another one. I also keep pictures, audio, screen grabs and the mpeg builds, and edits.

3) How big is your hardrive?

I have 6 internals, and 2 externals, with a TB or more all together. I'll probably start switching out the smaller internals and storing them on a shelf labeled.

4) What do you do when a client hasn't sent their final payment yet so you can't send them their dvd yet so you're left with it sitting on you computer taking up space....

Since, no one gave me my Z1u for free, no money will mean no product.
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Old July 5th, 2006, 10:14 AM   #13
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Hi Jennifer,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer Graves
1) How long do you keep the project file on your computer before deleting it?
I deliver a preview copy for the couple to review. They have two weeks to email a list of 'suggestions' for changes or adjustments. They pay the final balance after they've seen the preview but before the final copies are shipped. I follow up after the final copies are shipped to make sure the DVD's arrived safely. If so the footage is deleted. These terms are also listed in the contract

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer Graves
2) Do you back the whole project and captured files onto several dvd's in case you need to go back in and change something or just keep a master copy of the final dvd?
I back-up to hard drives. I archive a full, self-contained version of the wedding along with the VIDEO_TS file. I also put their DVD insert and label artwork and project file in there too. (See the entry on archiving at www.JoelPeregrine.com)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer Graves
3) How big is your hardrive?
I have 25 drives ranging from 120gb to 320 gb, most of which are external and are placed in a firewire enclosure when I need to access them. Newegg.com has 320gb eide's for $99 right now - no rebates needed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer Graves
4) What do you do when a client hasn't sent their final payment yet so you can't send them their dvd yet so you're left with it sitting on you computer taking up space....
If they have not communicated with me within two weeks of delivering the preview I archive the master (export a self-contained file) and delete the raw footage. From that point on the content can not be changed.

I think the most important aspect of this stage of servicing is to be clear upfront what will happen and what is expected. Have good communication - communication that has a paper trail, like emails that acknowledge the terms you've set. Have polite statements that let them know what consequences inaction will have and stick to your workflow guidelines.
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Old July 5th, 2006, 08:03 PM   #14
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"I think the most important aspect of this stage of servicing is to be clear upfront what will happen and what is expected. Have good communication - communication that has a paper trail, like emails that acknowledge the terms you've set. Have polite statements that let them know what consequences inaction will have and stick to your workflow guidelines."

and even with these guideliens, be prepared for morons who dont bother reading them.. i have a client who is still to send me their choice in music form over a year ago.. without it, i cant edit... As its a "conditional requirement" of their agreement, they dont have a leg to stand on until they send me that information. And even with that, they still have to take into consideration my workload as i do not stop working irrespective if who or how much they paid.

as for giving preliminaries, i used to do that, however i found that people would "cancel" their orders for more copies within that time frame. Obviously they were making their own copies of the work as not only would they cancel the extra "10 copies" but they wouldnt want anythign changed.

I oly offer prelims to the high end clients now, and i state in the contract that theyre not only hiring me to film, but theyre hiring me to edit as well, and with that comes my own discretion in the production. If i make a mistake, obviously i fix it, but if its an asthetic element, then i'll think about it.
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